De-iced or not
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Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Oop North, UK
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De-iced or not
Just had the following that I believe came from the UK FS. - ouch
In January an aircraft stood on the ramp of a European airport for an
extended period of time in sub-zero temperatures.
The aircraft was prepared for flight and when all the necessary checks
had been completed the doors were closed.
The aircraft was de-iced using a 25% de-icing fluid 75% water mix at 80
degrees centigrade. As required in the procedures. The aircraft appeared
free of ice and the aircraft departed the stand and taxied for take-off.
Shortly thereafter a ground crewman noticed that the area where the
aircraft had been de-iced was covered in solid ice instead of a de-icing
fluid and ice slurry. He immediately raised the alarm and the aircraft
was recalled to the stand where it was found to be covered in clear ice.
An investigation is underway however and initial report suggests that
the mixing valve on the de-icing rig may have failed and that very
little if any de-icing fluid had been mixed with the water at the time
of de-icing. The aircraft may have in fact been de-iced with hot water
only.
The aircrew were given the de-icing certificate but neither the Captain
not the de-icing crew had any way of knowing that the valve had failed
as no volumes of water or de-icing fluid were provided on the
certificate, therefore no error check was possible.
In this case a serious incident or more likely a nasty accident was
averted by the experience, knowledge and quick thinking of the ground
crewman.
In January an aircraft stood on the ramp of a European airport for an
extended period of time in sub-zero temperatures.
The aircraft was prepared for flight and when all the necessary checks
had been completed the doors were closed.
The aircraft was de-iced using a 25% de-icing fluid 75% water mix at 80
degrees centigrade. As required in the procedures. The aircraft appeared
free of ice and the aircraft departed the stand and taxied for take-off.
Shortly thereafter a ground crewman noticed that the area where the
aircraft had been de-iced was covered in solid ice instead of a de-icing
fluid and ice slurry. He immediately raised the alarm and the aircraft
was recalled to the stand where it was found to be covered in clear ice.
An investigation is underway however and initial report suggests that
the mixing valve on the de-icing rig may have failed and that very
little if any de-icing fluid had been mixed with the water at the time
of de-icing. The aircraft may have in fact been de-iced with hot water
only.
The aircrew were given the de-icing certificate but neither the Captain
not the de-icing crew had any way of knowing that the valve had failed
as no volumes of water or de-icing fluid were provided on the
certificate, therefore no error check was possible.
In this case a serious incident or more likely a nasty accident was
averted by the experience, knowledge and quick thinking of the ground
crewman.
What an excellent, and perhaps rather lucky save. Hopefully an appropriate incident report was filed. It would seem pretty straightforward to visibly check the fluid quantities before/after any deiceing, and hopefully an easy standard to introduce.
Join Date: Oct 2003
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A lot of airports are moving to "premix." So one tank on a truck might have 75:25 and the other 100%. Although I have seen some trucks that have type II on one side and type I on the other so there would be hold over issues there if the wrong tank is selected, its still better than neat water!
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The question that I like to raise is the following:
Who is responsible for the de-icing?
OPS manual says the captain, but how can he/she be, how can we even check the de-icing specially when being de-iced on a remote de-icing stand.
Manufacturer says that de-icing is a Mx action, but they don't even know this.
In fact it's ground handling that de-ices the airplane, but as far as I know there are no legal requirements for the crew to do this (Iwas de-iced once by someone who was just hired for the job as a contracter and had not received any training!)
Of course the flight crew should ensure te aircraft to be safe for flight, but other then stating that de-icing is required I have no idea how we can be responsible.
How do you guy's and gals deal with this issue?
Who is responsible for the de-icing?
OPS manual says the captain, but how can he/she be, how can we even check the de-icing specially when being de-iced on a remote de-icing stand.
Manufacturer says that de-icing is a Mx action, but they don't even know this.
In fact it's ground handling that de-ices the airplane, but as far as I know there are no legal requirements for the crew to do this (Iwas de-iced once by someone who was just hired for the job as a contracter and had not received any training!)
Of course the flight crew should ensure te aircraft to be safe for flight, but other then stating that de-icing is required I have no idea how we can be responsible.
How do you guy's and gals deal with this issue?
Join Date: Jan 2006
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You do your best and hope that everyone is professional
I heard about 1000 pounds heavy ice chunk carried on board ( under the floor) during winter time following internal water valve failure. the thing wasn't long discovered and the plane was a hell of a balance
sorry if it is slightly off the thread
ch767
