Buzz v Ryanair at the 11th Hour!
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Buzz v Ryanair at the 11th Hour!
With less than three days to go to the proposed sale of Buzz to Ryanair - KLM are still unable to agre terms with Ryanair. On Wednesday the staff were told that KLM "Remain unable to provide you with several important pieces of information. For this I apologise.
KLM and Ryanair continue to discuss the terms of the sale and to date they have been unable to reach a conclusion on a number of issues.
Until these issues have been resolved, we are simply unable to provide you with any further details. However, none of these issues will affect your entitlement to compensation in the event of your redundancy in accordance with your terms of employment with KLM uk Ltd." signed by the CEO.
On Friday 28th is has been announced that the sale is not going through on the 31st March. The CEO has stated that "As you were advised on 26 March 2003, there were a number of outstanding issues between KLM and Ryanair in relation to the sale of the buzz business.
Regrettably those issues have not as yet been fully resolved and as a result the sale of the buzz business to Ryanair may be delayed.
As a consequence, for the moment you will all continue to be employed by KLM uk Ltd. Your salary and benefits will of course continue to be paid as normal during this time.
We will advise you as and when we have more details and hope to have further information for you on Monday 31st March."
It is a total nightmare for all the employees of KLM uk Ltd. both those who have signed up with Ryanair and those who have not and wish to collect their redundancy all leave both parties behind them.
KLM now run the real risk that they will have lost the sale of the airline for no payment, have lost the routes to Ryanair since they are now selling tickets for them, lost the slots out of Stansted for no payment, be left with the redundancy payment of over 600 staff, and be left with 6 737 leases and 8 146 leases outstanding. Some of the 146 leases run at four times the value of the 737s.
KLM - Didn't they do well !
Ryanair - They'll get the routes since they are already marketing them, and presumably the slots out of STN since they will be vacated by Buzz. - Ryanair won't have to pay for an airline, and have destroyed a small but worthy competitor.
The biggest loses are the wonderful bunch of people that comprise the operating staff of Buzz - they are destroyed.
KLM and Ryanair continue to discuss the terms of the sale and to date they have been unable to reach a conclusion on a number of issues.
Until these issues have been resolved, we are simply unable to provide you with any further details. However, none of these issues will affect your entitlement to compensation in the event of your redundancy in accordance with your terms of employment with KLM uk Ltd." signed by the CEO.
On Friday 28th is has been announced that the sale is not going through on the 31st March. The CEO has stated that "As you were advised on 26 March 2003, there were a number of outstanding issues between KLM and Ryanair in relation to the sale of the buzz business.
Regrettably those issues have not as yet been fully resolved and as a result the sale of the buzz business to Ryanair may be delayed.
As a consequence, for the moment you will all continue to be employed by KLM uk Ltd. Your salary and benefits will of course continue to be paid as normal during this time.
We will advise you as and when we have more details and hope to have further information for you on Monday 31st March."
It is a total nightmare for all the employees of KLM uk Ltd. both those who have signed up with Ryanair and those who have not and wish to collect their redundancy all leave both parties behind them.
KLM now run the real risk that they will have lost the sale of the airline for no payment, have lost the routes to Ryanair since they are now selling tickets for them, lost the slots out of Stansted for no payment, be left with the redundancy payment of over 600 staff, and be left with 6 737 leases and 8 146 leases outstanding. Some of the 146 leases run at four times the value of the 737s.
KLM - Didn't they do well !
Ryanair - They'll get the routes since they are already marketing them, and presumably the slots out of STN since they will be vacated by Buzz. - Ryanair won't have to pay for an airline, and have destroyed a small but worthy competitor.
The biggest loses are the wonderful bunch of people that comprise the operating staff of Buzz - they are destroyed.
Last edited by Hugh Effo; 29th Mar 2003 at 23:33.
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A KLM spokesperson (Mr. B. Koster) issued on March 18th a statement to the Dutch news agencies (after rumours in the Dutch financial community that Ryanair was backing out of the Buzz sale) that KLM and Ryanair couldn't agree on the price Ryanair has to pay. Furthermore KLM wasn't sure the UK competition authorities could clear the sale before the deadline of April 1st.
Thus it looks as if price is the most important issue
Thus it looks as if price is the most important issue
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Don't think FR have sufficient aircraft to operate all the proposed routes if the sale doesn't go through, so don't think this was their plan all along.
Hope it gets sorted out soon, firstly for the sake of all the buzz guys and for all the pax who have already booked on the "Ryanair operated by buzz" routes.
As said previously, KLM seemed to make a right mess of the whole affair.
Hope it gets sorted out soon, firstly for the sake of all the buzz guys and for all the pax who have already booked on the "Ryanair operated by buzz" routes.
As said previously, KLM seemed to make a right mess of the whole affair.
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Surely if the sale does not go through Ryanair get nothing. No sale surely means they dont get the Buzz slots and they dont get the Buzz aircraft. The slots would become vacant and Ryanair would then have to buy them from whoever you buy slots from. What will have happened though is they will have closed down a competitor.
With regard to load factors, everymonth is 2002 saw more passengers travel with Buzz then the previous year. The first drop in pax figures over the previous year came in Jan 03, when this outrageous fiasco was first announced.
We had the "bye bye Buzz" staff party last night. And very good it was too. I doubt when Ryanair closes (and its time will come) there will be so many tears shed over the end of an airline (well perhaps, but tears of joy......)
With regard to load factors, everymonth is 2002 saw more passengers travel with Buzz then the previous year. The first drop in pax figures over the previous year came in Jan 03, when this outrageous fiasco was first announced.
We had the "bye bye Buzz" staff party last night. And very good it was too. I doubt when Ryanair closes (and its time will come) there will be so many tears shed over the end of an airline (well perhaps, but tears of joy......)
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Please see http://www.balpa.org
I think Ryanair's attitude stinks. The latest issue of the Log from Balpa, reprinted a Q&A issued by KLMuk on instructions from Ryanair:
Q: If a member of staff refuses to sign the offer of a new contract of employment by Ryanair with different terms and conditions effective 1st April 2003, would they be made redundant or could they volunteer redundancy?
A: If any member of staff refuses to sign the offer of a new contract of employment with Buzzaway they will effectively terminate their own employment. Redundancy in such circumstances does not therefore arise.
Q: Would this refusal to accept new conditions be seen as non cooperation by an individual and consequently result in the closure of Buzz?
A: Yes, and if sufficient Buzz people refuse to sign the new contract then Buzz will close.
Q: I am currently receiving medical treatment under the Company private medical cover scheme, will this continue after 1st April 2003?
A: No.
Q: If staff volunteer for redundancy rather than accept new terms and conditions, could this jeopardise their mortgage protection?
A: If staff refuse to sign the contract they won't qualify for either statutory or voluntary redundancies.
Q: How can Ryanair make staff redundant or advise on which staff will be made redundant when they don't own the Company?
A: Staff who refuse to sign the new contract on or before 14th March will be dismissing themselves with no entitlement to redundancy with effect from April the 1st. All other staff who are being made redundant on April 1st will be advised in writing this week as soon as we receive the names and addresses from KLMuk.
Q: What aspects of the Air UK pension scheme will not apply after April 1st?
A: All of it.
--------------
Of course this is all against the Law, but that doesn't seem to bother Ryanair.
So Balpa are asking their members to post messages of support to fellow pilots in Buzz and to let them have your views on the "Ryanair way". This is Balpa's... http://www.balpa.org/intranet/Media-...ry.doc_cvt.htm
I think Ryanair's attitude stinks. The latest issue of the Log from Balpa, reprinted a Q&A issued by KLMuk on instructions from Ryanair:
Q: If a member of staff refuses to sign the offer of a new contract of employment by Ryanair with different terms and conditions effective 1st April 2003, would they be made redundant or could they volunteer redundancy?
A: If any member of staff refuses to sign the offer of a new contract of employment with Buzzaway they will effectively terminate their own employment. Redundancy in such circumstances does not therefore arise.
Q: Would this refusal to accept new conditions be seen as non cooperation by an individual and consequently result in the closure of Buzz?
A: Yes, and if sufficient Buzz people refuse to sign the new contract then Buzz will close.
Q: I am currently receiving medical treatment under the Company private medical cover scheme, will this continue after 1st April 2003?
A: No.
Q: If staff volunteer for redundancy rather than accept new terms and conditions, could this jeopardise their mortgage protection?
A: If staff refuse to sign the contract they won't qualify for either statutory or voluntary redundancies.
Q: How can Ryanair make staff redundant or advise on which staff will be made redundant when they don't own the Company?
A: Staff who refuse to sign the new contract on or before 14th March will be dismissing themselves with no entitlement to redundancy with effect from April the 1st. All other staff who are being made redundant on April 1st will be advised in writing this week as soon as we receive the names and addresses from KLMuk.
Q: What aspects of the Air UK pension scheme will not apply after April 1st?
A: All of it.
--------------
Of course this is all against the Law, but that doesn't seem to bother Ryanair.
So Balpa are asking their members to post messages of support to fellow pilots in Buzz and to let them have your views on the "Ryanair way". This is Balpa's... http://www.balpa.org/intranet/Media-...ry.doc_cvt.htm
Firstly, my sympathies to all the buzz folk. Travelling with you was always a delight. I've only travelled with O'Leary's lot once - but after the way he's treated buzz, never again! I don't care whether it costs twice as much to fly with a different airline, I just don't want to do anything which will add one brass farthing to RyanAir's profits. Call it cutting one's nose off to spite one's face if you like - I call it having principles.
LD max - you say that 'All this is against the Law'. But against whose law? British, European, Irish....?? Who would bring the case to court? And what would be the outcome - a fine which would be shrugged off with barely concealed indifference?
Whilst the actions of the Dublin taxi-driver may seem to be more akin to those of a Victorian mill owner than those of a 21st century employer, who is actually going to stop him behaving like this - and how?
LD max - you say that 'All this is against the Law'. But against whose law? British, European, Irish....?? Who would bring the case to court? And what would be the outcome - a fine which would be shrugged off with barely concealed indifference?
Whilst the actions of the Dublin taxi-driver may seem to be more akin to those of a Victorian mill owner than those of a 21st century employer, who is actually going to stop him behaving like this - and how?
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As a resident of Bournemouth, our local paper has just been completely full for the last 2 months of people with Buzz BOH tickets, all whining and generally making themselfs well known pizzed of pax.
The appearence of the ryanair manager is now very limited, poor thang must be hiding as much as possible, becuase he'll get interrogated.
I do feel for the peeps that are going to be left without a job as a result of Black suit BMW driving instant profit seaking moorons.
I do agree with timzsta, i am not a fan of ryanair, as now many people aren't. Buzz where ran very well, I dont see ryanair particually succeding with there headless chicken approach.
The appearence of the ryanair manager is now very limited, poor thang must be hiding as much as possible, becuase he'll get interrogated.
I do feel for the peeps that are going to be left without a job as a result of Black suit BMW driving instant profit seaking moorons.
I do agree with timzsta, i am not a fan of ryanair, as now many people aren't. Buzz where ran very well, I dont see ryanair particually succeding with there headless chicken approach.
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Hugh Effo,
Thanks for your update. What is worth remembering is the law of unexpected consequences, and if the Sale falls through for whatever reason and MOL thinks that he can just pick up all the pieces and put "humpty " together again, he may be in for a shock.
Firstly, and probably lastly, if starting from afresh as opposed to inheriting, he would have to convince all the authorities that he was a " fit and proper " person to hold a UK AOC ........need one say more ?
Thanks for your update. What is worth remembering is the law of unexpected consequences, and if the Sale falls through for whatever reason and MOL thinks that he can just pick up all the pieces and put "humpty " together again, he may be in for a shock.
Firstly, and probably lastly, if starting from afresh as opposed to inheriting, he would have to convince all the authorities that he was a " fit and proper " person to hold a UK AOC ........need one say more ?
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I know there is still one day to go, and the regulator hasn't gone pubic yet, but it would seem KLM want out at any price. Maybe even give it away.
From todays 'Times Online'
March 30, 2003
Ryanair cuts Buzz deal by 25%
Frank Fitzgibbon
RYANAIR, Europe’s biggest low-fares airline, will reveal that it has acquired Buzz, the KLM subsidiary, for between €18m and €20m when the deal closes on Tuesday.
This will represent a discount of up to 25% on the €23.9m price mooted when the acquisition was announced at the end of January.
It is understood that the subsequent due diligence process uncovered greater than anticipated losses and higher than expected costs, leading to a reduction in the cash outlay.
The reduction has been accepted by KLM and is not the subject of dispute.
When Ryanair first announced details of the acquisition it annoyed KLM management by claiming that the net cost of the deal was less than €5m.
Ryanair calculated this figure by subtracting the €19m in advance sales that Buzz was carrying in its accounts.
Since then, however, Buzz has taken a decision to refund the entire pre-paid amounts to customers.
Ryanair will still hit the ground running, however, when it relaunches Buzz as part of the Ryanair network on May 1 following a complete closure of the Stansted-based operation in April.
Pre-marketing of the new routes to be developed on the back of the acquisition has netted three months’ worth of sales believed to be more than €20m.
Many of the tickets have been sold at half the rate that Buzz was charging.
From todays 'Times Online'
March 30, 2003
Ryanair cuts Buzz deal by 25%
Frank Fitzgibbon
RYANAIR, Europe’s biggest low-fares airline, will reveal that it has acquired Buzz, the KLM subsidiary, for between €18m and €20m when the deal closes on Tuesday.
This will represent a discount of up to 25% on the €23.9m price mooted when the acquisition was announced at the end of January.
It is understood that the subsequent due diligence process uncovered greater than anticipated losses and higher than expected costs, leading to a reduction in the cash outlay.
The reduction has been accepted by KLM and is not the subject of dispute.
When Ryanair first announced details of the acquisition it annoyed KLM management by claiming that the net cost of the deal was less than €5m.
Ryanair calculated this figure by subtracting the €19m in advance sales that Buzz was carrying in its accounts.
Since then, however, Buzz has taken a decision to refund the entire pre-paid amounts to customers.
Ryanair will still hit the ground running, however, when it relaunches Buzz as part of the Ryanair network on May 1 following a complete closure of the Stansted-based operation in April.
Pre-marketing of the new routes to be developed on the back of the acquisition has netted three months’ worth of sales believed to be more than €20m.
Many of the tickets have been sold at half the rate that Buzz was charging.
"Mildly" Eccentric Stardriver
BEagle, the answer to your question as to who will be pursueing the case in court is BALPA, who have pledged full support to all members who are being illegally dismissed.
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BEagle, there is a way of buying tickets with Ryanair and not helping their profits.... it is not a method I would advocate, but probably effective.
1. Buy a cheap suitcase.
2. Fill with old clothes that you don't mind never seeing again.
3. Buy the cheapest Ryanair ticket from the airport nearest you- destination unimportant.
4. Go to airport, check in, hand over suitcase as checked baggage.
5. Wait till they start calling your name for boarding, then tell them you've changed your mind.
Admittedly, you'll have paid for a ticket with them, but the delay will probably cost the company more!
As I said, I do not suggest you do this; I never found the nerve myself, but it is a potential nuisance that the no-frills carriers are particularly vulnerable to.
1. Buy a cheap suitcase.
2. Fill with old clothes that you don't mind never seeing again.
3. Buy the cheapest Ryanair ticket from the airport nearest you- destination unimportant.
4. Go to airport, check in, hand over suitcase as checked baggage.
5. Wait till they start calling your name for boarding, then tell them you've changed your mind.
Admittedly, you'll have paid for a ticket with them, but the delay will probably cost the company more!
As I said, I do not suggest you do this; I never found the nerve myself, but it is a potential nuisance that the no-frills carriers are particularly vulnerable to.
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It is interesting that Ryanair want a discount at this stage, since the due diligence procedure was finished a month ago. What makes it more interesting is that I have heard from within Ryanair that they were feeling very smug about having got Buzz so cheap. It is obviously the FR way of doing business.
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Just don't know how Ryanair have got away with it. Bunch of tax dodging, upstart cowboys come out of nowhere. Irish Airline with a UK base, hiring pilots from god knows where. Manage to destroy a fine upstanding British Airline (call it Air UK) And nobody says a dicky bird. No wonder they make a profit if they're allowed to break all the rules. Methinks they must have something on someone or they're just taking the p**s and seeing what they can get away with. Where are the relevant organisations when you need them?
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If Ryanair was only Southwest...
Gosh, wait a minute...maybe they are.
They seem to offer what other airlines disdain...reliable low cost transportation. Perhaps not to the exact city-centre location, but the price is right.
And if the boss expects that the employees (including flight crew) perform a reasonable days work, for reasonable pay, what's the problem?
Too many prima donnas sniping from the outside perhaps?
They seem to offer what other airlines disdain...reliable low cost transportation. Perhaps not to the exact city-centre location, but the price is right.
And if the boss expects that the employees (including flight crew) perform a reasonable days work, for reasonable pay, what's the problem?
Too many prima donnas sniping from the outside perhaps?
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What MOL is doing to Buzz and it's staff is just disgusting. To anyone who's career/job is being ruined by this man, my most sincere sympathy.
What I'd like to know is where is the CAA when all this is going on? They are the regulatory body and they just seem to be sitting back any watching.
Does the Campaign Against Aviation read pprune? If so, please will you do something about this man, and protect this airline.
I hope BALPA can protect it's members from what appears to be happening, or it really is a very concering trend for the industry.
Please tell me what I can do to help stop this - letters to the CAA, government, MPs, there must be something.
bmi baby crews watch out too . . . MOL has you next on the list.
What I'd like to know is where is the CAA when all this is going on? They are the regulatory body and they just seem to be sitting back any watching.
Does the Campaign Against Aviation read pprune? If so, please will you do something about this man, and protect this airline.
I hope BALPA can protect it's members from what appears to be happening, or it really is a very concering trend for the industry.
Please tell me what I can do to help stop this - letters to the CAA, government, MPs, there must be something.
bmi baby crews watch out too . . . MOL has you next on the list.
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i think what ryanair have done with buzz is damn clever! turning around an airline that was pouring money down the toilet and offering jobs to the poor staff who have been let down by klm. ryanair are going to get so big in the next few years that fares will be practically free and that has to be good news for all passengers. you people who would choose to pay extra to fly another airline just because you don't like mol are just shooting yourselves in the foot, wasting your own hard earned money! most people vote with their feet, and ryanair are attracting more people everyday, which means more profit and a higher share price. ryanair is the true winner in europe and i think they are great.
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Ryanair, upstart cowboys...? Only been around since 1985. Tax dodging...prove it pal. Irish airline with many EUROPEAN bases...whats your beef with that eh..need a UN resolution? Hiring qualified pilots... you got a real problem with that..., take it up with the authorities. Destroying a fine upstanding British airline (call it what you want)...come down to planet earth pal, it was going out of business and was run by the Dutch. What rules are been broken? Oh yes, I forgot, screw Joe public for all you can. Are you for real or just taking the pee eh ?
Many people feel that, by travelling with RyanAir, they'd somehow be supporting the Dublin taxi driver's actions. That makes them feel guilty and leaves a sour taste in the mouth.
And it's madness to expect people to spend longer on a bus getting to their intended destination from whatever cow pasture in the middle of nowhere they've been dumped at - yes, like where-the-hell-is-Hahn....
And it's madness to expect people to spend longer on a bus getting to their intended destination from whatever cow pasture in the middle of nowhere they've been dumped at - yes, like where-the-hell-is-Hahn....