RAF fighters scrambled in BA security alert
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>>One was described as in his early 50s and dishevelled looking, the other was in his 20s with long sideburns and wearing a bead bracelet.
Another American passenger said: "If you picked the two most likely looking terrorists on the plane, you would have picked them. <<
Oh, no! They were profiled due to their appearance, how unfair...
Another American passenger said: "If you picked the two most likely looking terrorists on the plane, you would have picked them. <<
Oh, no! They were profiled due to their appearance, how unfair...
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"They stood out. They weren't businessmen or women."
...
"The two men - both United States citizens travelling in economy class "
Damn those non-businessmen for travelling in non-business class, eh!!
...
"The two men - both United States citizens travelling in economy class "
Damn those non-businessmen for travelling in non-business class, eh!!
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Apparently the 'conversation' that sparked suspicion went along the lines of:
"We've been planing this for 6 months, you can't back out now".
Origionally construed by a passanger as a terrorist conversation, the captain bolted the door and quite correctly took the necessary steps. Speculation on the ground then moved to the possability that the pax were discussing a buisiness deal, but I believe the true nature of the conversation turned out to be a contraversial family reunion. Speculation aside, the machine swung into action and a well prepared plan was executed like clockwork by all concerned. The actual alarm was raised slightly earlier than the BCC state, nearer 0810 BST. RAF Fighters were alerted & launched within timescales stipulated by Parliment. A great deal was made of the distance maintained by the fighters, but the media / public should not under estimate the range & accuracy of the latest 'Fire & Forget' munitions carried by the UK air defence force.
As a mere, well informed, spectator to the action, from my perspective, the crew, air traffic controllers, air defence controllers, air defence crews, and ground side security forces involved all did a fantastic job and have convinced me of their undoubted ability to deal with a more real incident should the need arise, heaven forbid. (And I never thought I would hear myself praising the Scopies!)
Hippy.
"We've been planing this for 6 months, you can't back out now".
Origionally construed by a passanger as a terrorist conversation, the captain bolted the door and quite correctly took the necessary steps. Speculation on the ground then moved to the possability that the pax were discussing a buisiness deal, but I believe the true nature of the conversation turned out to be a contraversial family reunion. Speculation aside, the machine swung into action and a well prepared plan was executed like clockwork by all concerned. The actual alarm was raised slightly earlier than the BCC state, nearer 0810 BST. RAF Fighters were alerted & launched within timescales stipulated by Parliment. A great deal was made of the distance maintained by the fighters, but the media / public should not under estimate the range & accuracy of the latest 'Fire & Forget' munitions carried by the UK air defence force.
As a mere, well informed, spectator to the action, from my perspective, the crew, air traffic controllers, air defence controllers, air defence crews, and ground side security forces involved all did a fantastic job and have convinced me of their undoubted ability to deal with a more real incident should the need arise, heaven forbid. (And I never thought I would hear myself praising the Scopies!)
Hippy.
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We just didn't know what was going on......
W.r.t...... Another American passenger said: "If you picked the two most likely looking terrorists on the plane, you would have picked them. "They stood out. They weren't businessmen or women." He added: "We were terrified. We just didn't know what was going on."
Uhm, if this is representative of what a worldly-wise (?) and 'informed' American populace is thinking then is it any wonder that American foreign policy performs so poorly ?!
Uhm, if this is representative of what a worldly-wise (?) and 'informed' American populace is thinking then is it any wonder that American foreign policy performs so poorly ?!
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Panic, panic everywhere! Where will end? God knows! But it is well and truly out of hand now.
Listening to conversations has always been a problem. There is well worn out of date one which, as it happens, fits the situation pefectly.
Brigadier "Carruthers" marshalling his troops in the war sent the following message: "Send re-inforcements we are going to advance."
The radio operator wrote it down and gave it to the "General" When he read it, it said "Send three and fourpence(oldmoney) we are going to a dance."
No doubt a joke, but it's no joke hearing about panic in the skies either. Perhaps, as DA says, we should wrorry about policy.
Listening to conversations has always been a problem. There is well worn out of date one which, as it happens, fits the situation pefectly.
Brigadier "Carruthers" marshalling his troops in the war sent the following message: "Send re-inforcements we are going to advance."
The radio operator wrote it down and gave it to the "General" When he read it, it said "Send three and fourpence(oldmoney) we are going to a dance."
No doubt a joke, but it's no joke hearing about panic in the skies either. Perhaps, as DA says, we should wrorry about policy.
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Despite the 12" high dramatic headlines in some rags this morning, there wasn't much excitement about it at work yesterday. I went in at 2pm and it wasn't until around 5pm that someone just happened to mention it in passing.
However, being as I was in the middle of swotting for my check-out, I was looking through radio failure procedures and the thought struck.. Unusual conversation heard... crew does the drill and ATC gets the message.. then the a/c suffers an RT failure and starts its approach over London. What would the Tornadoes have done..... I find it somewhat scary to think about.
However, being as I was in the middle of swotting for my check-out, I was looking through radio failure procedures and the thought struck.. Unusual conversation heard... crew does the drill and ATC gets the message.. then the a/c suffers an RT failure and starts its approach over London. What would the Tornadoes have done..... I find it somewhat scary to think about.
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Hippy:
Your faith in the accuracy of the missiles is a lot greater than mine, given what measures we as civil ATCOs are told to take with regard to making arrangements to protect innocent traffic in the vicinity of the suspect aircraft!!
Can't be more specific, but those that know will know to what I am referring.
Your faith in the accuracy of the missiles is a lot greater than mine, given what measures we as civil ATCOs are told to take with regard to making arrangements to protect innocent traffic in the vicinity of the suspect aircraft!!
Can't be more specific, but those that know will know to what I am referring.
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Indeed, there was no need to panic pax by aligning on the wingtips, as contact with flight deck was maintained so better to stay behind a/c at a distance. French AF Mirages have had closer encounters but that was to get flight deck's attention.
well done RAF and BA!
well done RAF and BA!
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A 'bead bracelet' makes you look like a terrorist?!?!? I can see the headlines now,
"Sisters of Terror!
Sister Immaculata, the nun made to lie spreadeagled on the concrete at JFK, claims she was only trying to say a Hail Mary"
"Sisters of Terror!
Sister Immaculata, the nun made to lie spreadeagled on the concrete at JFK, claims she was only trying to say a Hail Mary"
> Uhm, if this is representative of what a worldly-wise (?) and 'informed' American populace is thinking then is it any wonder that American foreign policy performs so poorly ?!
<
Come on now, we all know that the snoopers on board were English nanny's not well informed American citizens.
<
Come on now, we all know that the snoopers on board were English nanny's not well informed American citizens.
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Misinterpretation not exactly new.
I believe in World War One someone said "At ten to six we are going to advance" and by the time it got to the end of the trench it was interpreted as "At ten to six we are going to a dance"
You have got to ask Did the passenger actually hear this? Or did he hear something and put arms and legs on a story to justify his fears.
However that said better safe than sorry and I think all the services involved appear to have done everything correctly. Makes a nice change
I believe in World War One someone said "At ten to six we are going to advance" and by the time it got to the end of the trench it was interpreted as "At ten to six we are going to a dance"
You have got to ask Did the passenger actually hear this? Or did he hear something and put arms and legs on a story to justify his fears.
However that said better safe than sorry and I think all the services involved appear to have done everything correctly. Makes a nice change
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What an over-the-top report in the Express, though ... they reported it as if the aircraft was seconds away from being blown out of the sky! This is not going to help anyone - if anything, it may discourage people from voicing their concerns about the activities of a fellow passenger as the risk of hijacking would be less than getting shot out of the sky!
Journos, dontcha luv em.
Journos, dontcha luv em.
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McIce, even your chinese whispers heard wrong. The phrase was "send reinforcements, we're going to advance", becoming "send three and fourpence, we're going to a dance".
Is it true the Tornado's didn't descend below FL150 because the TMA was too crowded for them and they didn't have the correct separation of 25nm radius to escort the BA plane back to LHR? Bit difficult to monitor a plane 10,000 feet directly beneath you over London?
Sounds like the actions of a keen WingCo pushing a desk than a proper ATC co-ordination.
Is it true the Tornado's didn't descend below FL150 because the TMA was too crowded for them and they didn't have the correct separation of 25nm radius to escort the BA plane back to LHR? Bit difficult to monitor a plane 10,000 feet directly beneath you over London?
Sounds like the actions of a keen WingCo pushing a desk than a proper ATC co-ordination.
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In response to Heathrow Directors quote: if the aircraft had suffered a radio failure, what would the Tornadoes have done. I would hope that the aircrew would squawk 7600, rather than 7500.
