Russian Airlines still flying

[Dont worry]

After Bermuda revoked the airworthiness certificates of all VP-B, VP-Q registered Russian airliners you still see them flying around on Flightradar24.
Therefore they are all illegal. We know, that Russia is giving a wet ****… scoopy doo about it.
But nevertheless just imagine something goes wrong and one of those airplane crash. No airworthiness, no insurance.
Are they really that desperate to go that way? They will never ever make it into international airspace again or with maybe just really high payments to insurance companies.

[ATC Watcher]

Therefore they are all illegal.

Not necessarily , it depends on the Russian laws ( which I do not know ). But you have to operate according the law of the country you fly in not the law of registration.
On insurance, if the Russian State covers them, no need for commercial insurance. Military Pax transport aircraft are not commercially insured and they transport civilians sometimes for instance.

[747-8driver]

Was in HKG last week and during taxi in we heard an ABC asking Ground something (start up?).
Then ATC told the guy that the airplane was de-registered from Bermuda and the airplane was now grounded...

[Bidule]

Originally Posted by ATC Watcher

Not necessarily , it depends on the Russian laws ( which I do not know ). But you have to operate according the law of the country you fly in not the law of registration.
On insurance, if the Russian State covers them, no need for commercial insurance. Military Pax transport aircraft are not commercially insured and they transport civilians sometimes for instance.

Not fully correct. According to ICAO, the CoA is issued by the country of registration, that is Bermuda in this case. When the CoA is revoked, the aircraft is assumed to no longer be airworthy and so, it should not fly.
The Russian CAA attempts to overturn this "automatic" grounding by registering the leased aircraft in Russia are a breach to ICAO rules, stating that an aircraft can be registered with only one country.

.

[ATC Watcher]

Russia are a breach to ICAO rules,

Thanks Bidule, I must admit this is well outside my area of expertise, and I do not doubt what you say, just a remark, ICAO SARPS are aiming to standardize international operations But you are still sovereign in your airspace. The only thing you have to do as a State is to file a difference with ICAO. Plenty of those, the US having the biggest chunk. You can also withdraw from ICAO and do what you want ( e.g North Korea) but stuck in your own airspace, and fly outside with bilateral agreements. As someone said in the other thread, Putin is at war and ,and in war times ,everything is possible.
The hangover will be hard though....

[sycamore]

It`s about time that Kaliningrad had it`s airspace`closed`,and a/c en-route escorted back....

[Less Hair]

And then it's WW3 that you want?

[DaveReidUK]

Originally Posted by sycamore

It`s about time that Kaliningrad had it`s airspace`closed`,and a/c en-route escorted back....

Read the above references to sovereign airspace.

How exactly do you propose that (NATO?) imposes a NFZ over Russian territory ?

[JCviggen]

Aeroflot has announced they'll be flying SSJs to Armenia and Azerbajan from next week.

There's also a flight from Colombo to Moscow tomorrow at some point SU6266, offered to Russians in Maldives to get back. Also rumours that they're busy making local agreements to fly to Male and a couple other places again soon.

[sycamore]

DR,might be interesting to see the passengers; probably not a lot of holidaymakers, more a bunch of men,short haircuts,and lots of `farm machinery` in the cargo pallets.....

[BFSGrad]

Originally Posted by DaveReidUK

Read the above references to sovereign airspace.

How exactly do you propose that (NATO?) imposes a NFZ over Russian territory ?

Perhaps the suggestion refers to the Russia's common transit of Polish or Baltic state sovereign airspace when flying to/from Kaliningrad.

[DaveReidUK]

Originally Posted by BFSGrad

Perhaps the suggestion refers to the Russia's common transit of Polish or Baltic state sovereign airspace when flying to/from Kaliningrad.

AFAIK, Russia is already banned from overflying EU airspace enroute to Kaliningrad, so I doubt that's what's being suggested here.

[EDLB]

Originally Posted by DaveReidUK

AFAIK, Russia is already banned from overflying EU airspace enroute to Kaliningrad, so I doubt that's what's being suggested here.

There are currently lots of flights from KGD to SVO in the air as if they evac. that place.

[ATC Watcher]

Originally Posted by DaveReidUK

AFAIK, Russia is already banned from overflying EU airspace enroute to Kaliningrad, so I doubt that's what's being suggested here.

Dave , as far as I know, there is an overfly convention between Belarus Vilnius and Kaliningrad that the Russian territory will always be accessible by air. signed around 1989-90. I do not thinly that closing unilaterally the corridor will be accepted by Russia.

[EDLB]

They do not give that a shot and fly over the baltic see. Might be that they fear a Lukaschenko style fighter scramble repo of some leased jets.

[NoelEvans]

Originally Posted by ATC Watcher

Dave , as far as I know, there is an overfly convention between Belarus Vilnius and Kaliningrad that the Russian territory will always be accessible by air. signed around 1989-90. I do not thinly that closing unilaterally the corridor will be accepted by Russia.

If you watch FR24, all the Russian flights to/from Kaliningrad route over the sea, between Finland and the Baltic states all the way.

[sycamore]

Not true ; the FIR boundary for K`Grad extends to appx 200km west,Russian aircraft are cutting the corner from a point 100km west of Latvia, both inbound and outbound. So,NATO doesnt appear to be watching,or ignoring it....

[Bksmithca]

Originally Posted by sycamore

Not true ; the FIR boundary for K`Grad extends to appx 200km west,Russian aircraft are cutting the corner from a point 100km west of Latvia, both inbound and outbound. So,NATO doesnt appear to be watching,or ignoring it....

I'm thinking NATO is watching but is holding back because if they did anything Putin would jump all over it and drag NATO into the conflict.

[DaveReidUK]

Originally Posted by sycamore

Not true ; the FIR boundary for K`Grad extends to appx 200km west, Russian aircraft are cutting the corner from a point 100km west of Latvia, both inbound and outbound. So, NATO doesn't appear to be watching, or ignoring it....

The relationship between FIR boundaries and countries' national airspace is approximate, to say the least. It's the latter that counts in this instance.

[sycamore]

The Swedes certainly are watching,but cutting thru` a TMZ is just p%&s taking....GPS `spoofing..?