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Over-the-limit Finnairís A320 pilot arrested in cockpit

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Over-the-limit Finnairís A320 pilot arrested in cockpit

Old 20th Aug 2018, 15:21
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How about some private airport place where everybody can check his levels before reporting for duty?
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Old 20th Aug 2018, 15:37
  #22 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Less Hair View Post
How about some private airport place where everybody can check his levels before reporting for duty?
I think that people over or close to the limits know about that without checking...
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Old 20th Aug 2018, 17:01
  #23 (permalink)  

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Back in the days when it was possible to have a half of shandy within seven days of duty, I once left the aircraft without signing the tech-log. Getting back to my room after dinner, and a couple of beers at the hotel, there was a message from ops that the engineers would ground the plane in the morning if the log wasn't signed. The only practicable thing to do was to change into uniform, wear ID and go to the office. I wasn't drunk, but would have blown over the limit if breathalysed. Although I wasn't due to report for flying until the following afternoon, I suppose if someone had been looking to cause trouble, signing the tech-log could be construed as an "aviation function". There but for the grace (and a different social outlook) .. etc
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Old 21st Aug 2018, 05:52
  #24 (permalink)  
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Not sure if they still do but at one time professional pilots in India had to pass a breathalyser test before every flight. Such a system, with airport standby, (or even one hour and ready to go standby), carried out before signing on would a). stop the problem and b). minimise bad publicity as well as any delay to departure. Anyone blowing positive under these circumstances possibly needs help anyway and this, too, can be addressed.
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Old 24th Aug 2018, 00:49
  #25 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Herod View Post
Back in the days when it was possible to have a half of shandy within seven days of duty, I once left the aircraft without signing the tech-log. Getting back to my room after dinner, and a couple of beers at the hotel, there was a message from ops that the engineers would ground the plane in the morning if the log wasn't signed. The only practicable thing to do was to change into uniform, wear ID and go to the office. I wasn't drunk, but would have blown over the limit if breathalysed. Although I wasn't due to report for flying until the following afternoon, I suppose if someone had been looking to cause trouble, signing the tech-log could be construed as an "aviation function". There but for the grace (and a different social outlook) .. etc
That was the only practicable thing to do? How about someone from the airport bring the logbook to the hotel for you to sign? :-)
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Old 24th Aug 2018, 07:06
  #26 (permalink)  
 
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FedEx's chief pilot Jack Lewis sent an October 2006 letter to captains with a laundry list of stupid stunts to avoid including this one:

We have another Captain crew member who showed up drunk in the crew lounge recently after deadheading in for a trip. He wasn't checking in for 7 hours and was only transiting the crew lounge, getting his Jepps to prepare to fly later. Security nabbed him and we are all wear the label. Dumb move.
The letter is here: https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/84113-post1.html

I've sure had the phone call at the hotel to come sign the logbook. In the past it wasn't a big deal and you could even give the mechanic verbal authorization to sign your name where I worked. Or, so they tell me. However, times change and in recent years I've had colleagues get letters from the FAA for not catching a missing signature a couple of days earlier.

The question of when you report for duty for purposes of drug and alcohol testing has been a moving goalpost. After the Fargo incident in 1990 I believe at Northwest you could say you weren't fit to fly and wanted help up to the point the before start checklist was completed and you would get amnesty from prosecution as long as you went into HIMS. A Virgin pilot at IAD in 2003 got off with a misdemeanor plea deal after he tested drunk after being arrested on the plane while looking over the logbook in uniform prior to pax boarding. It was ruled that there was no clear intent to operate the plane. The drunk America West pilots in MIA in 2002 tried to claim that they weren't operating the plane since the towbar was still connected when they were ordered back to the gate but the judge didn't buy it.

I had a colleague get his positive alcohol test thrown out years ago because he was sleeping it off in a crew lounge and he was tested hours before his report time. Sounds like the FedEx incident above. I sure wouldn't go near company property for any reason with alcohol on my breath these days.
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Old 24th Aug 2018, 07:53
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I agree with the above...why put yourself in jeopardy by appearing on company premises over the limit? Best to avoid it even if transiting or paxing if you have been drinking. There is always someone willing to stab you in the back. I was lucky enough to get a 200k/yr job once, not sure i’m lucky enough to get another one.
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Old 31st Aug 2018, 18:29
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Even in the 'old' days, the rules were simple. If you're drinking, don't wear the uniform and don't go anywhere near an aircraft.

I have understanding and sympathy for people who have a problem with drinking, but that's no excuse. It's not an easy job at the best of times, and trying to do it when impaired even slightly is insane. If it all goes well you might just get away with it. But if it doesn't...

We used to play with this in the sim many years ago. Have a few glasses, then try a sim landing when all hell breaks loose. It's a massive wakeup call.
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Old 31st Aug 2018, 22:48
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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Many airlines have a bottle to throttle rule of 12 hours these days, not unreasonable, but these same airlines often have no restrictions on early starts late finish, so day one you report at 04:00am so thar means for most up at 3am or earlier, which means your drinks curfew starts a 3pm the day before....late Sunday lunch anyone.

What Iíd love to see is a blanket test at say EDI or MAN of everyone from cabin crew to security tested for drugs and alcohol use, on the other hand maybe best we donít

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Old 1st Sep 2018, 12:17
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Originally Posted by INKJET View Post
Many airlines have a bottle to throttle rule of 12 hours these days, not unreasonable, but these same airlines often have no restrictions on early starts late finish, so day one you report at 04:00am so thar means for most up at 3am or earlier, which means your drinks curfew starts a 3pm the day before....late Sunday lunch anyone.

What Iíd love to see is a blanket test at say EDI or MAN of everyone from cabin crew to security tested for drugs and alcohol use, on the other hand maybe best we donít

Maybe best we do,

Would you really be happy with someone in the seat next to you who is under the influence?

I'm no saint, believe me. However, there's a time and place. As before, if all goes well you can get away with all sorts. The issue comes when things go to hell. That's when the last thing you need is anyone who isn't 100%.

We can all rail on about the time limits and the commercial pressures and mostly we are right. But we don't need to add our own issues.
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Old 18th Jan 2019, 19:13
  #31 (permalink)  
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Finnair pilot fired for drunkenness gets 3-month suspended sentence, writes yle.fi. The most frightening fragment comes a bit later. "The test showed that the 40-year-old's blood alcohol level was 2.0 promille (mg per ml of blood), according to court testimony." Oh dear, it's 0.2 per cent, an utter irresponsibility.
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Old 18th Jan 2019, 19:55
  #32 (permalink)  
 
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Is there an economic self testing system
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Old 18th Jan 2019, 23:18
  #33 (permalink)  
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Yes, it's seeing if you can resist the temptation to have any alcohol at all. Tough, but cheap.

I've posted before about Matthew Walker's book, Why we sleep. It's a must read for many professions. One of the most thought provoking statements was, Intoxicated, and you take more time to take action. (whatever that may be!) but tired, and during a micro-sleep, you make no decision at all.

Tiredness in the US causes more road traffic accidents than alcohol and 'substances' combined. He goes on to Controlled Release sleeping tablets, with horrifying statistics.
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