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MH 370 final report

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MH 370 final report

Old 31st Jul 2018, 13:13
  #21 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by birdspeed View Post
In the press conference the “inspector-in-charge” said the power failures to the communication systems(transponder,acars,satcom) were either turned off, OR power to them failed.

This means we are talking about a mechanical failure—an accident.
No it doesn't.

How can you discount the systems being deliberately switched off for malicious reasons?
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 14:25
  #22 (permalink)  
 
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The facts are simple - there are no facts.
More pointless theories, I am surprised that nobody has yet claimed alien abduction.

In the absence of any real evidence it should be time for the moderators to lock this thread until the wreckage is located.
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 14:41
  #23 (permalink)  
 
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For all we know the flight deck was struck by a meteorite, knocking out the pilots and disabling parts of the electricals. And that's the final word, I say.
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 14:56
  #24 (permalink)  
 
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The Ancient Greek....true, there are not many facts, but there is plenty of circumstantial evidence.

1/ crew & passengers have all had their backgrounds checked, nothing suspicious found.
2/ there was a sudden event that disabled communication systems and possibly autopilot.
3/ one hour later satcom powers up.
4/ the aircraft continues to fuel exhaustion. When ever this happens it is usually due to decompression and crew incapacitation. Four past incidents I can think of. So,
5/ crew incapacitation.
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 15:19
  #25 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Old Fella View Post
We can all speculate endlessly. A couple of things which I believe are, or at least could be, significant.
(1) The F/O was on his last training flight to type, and
(2) the opportunity existed for one pilot to lock the other out of the cockpit.

If either pilot left the cockpit and the other did lock the cockpit door it would have been a simple
matter for the lone pilot in the cockpit to don his oxy mask and depressurise the aircraft. Time
of useful consciousness, for those outside the cockpit without access to pressure breathing equipment,
would have been minimal leaving the handling pilot to disable the transponder and ACARS.
Of the two pilots it is reasonable to suspect the PIC would have the knowledge to do so. Why the
autopilot would have been disengaged, and for how long, is anyone's guess.

Whilst we may never find the answer my money would be on a deliberate act by one of the crew.
The above, or a slight variation of the above is where my money is too. Especially as the PIC had put the planned evasion (or whatever you want to call it) route into his home flight sim, presumably to rehearse.
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 15:49
  #26 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by booke23 View Post
The above, or a slight variation of the above is where my money is too. Especially as the PIC had put the planned evasion (or whatever you want to call it) route into his home flight sim, presumably to rehearse.
Exactly Booke23; & especially as that route concluded into one of the most expansive & uncharted part of the ocean in that particular area of the world.

Last edited by MATELO; 31st Jul 2018 at 16:34.
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 16:28
  #27 (permalink)  
 
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The pilots have finally been cleared of any nefarious acts.
No they most definitely have not. They flew along an FIR boundary for goodness sake.
Your post makes no sense.
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 17:25
  #28 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by birdspeed View Post
The Ancient Greek....true, there are not many facts, but there is plenty of circumstantial evidence.

1/ crew & passengers have all had their backgrounds checked, nothing suspicious found.
2/ there was a sudden event that disabled communication systems and possibly autopilot.
3/ one hour later satcom powers up.
4/ the aircraft continues to fuel exhaustion. When ever this happens it is usually due to decompression and crew incapacitation. Four past incidents I can think of. So,
5/ crew incapacitation.
This hamster-wheel was done to death last time:
2, There was no 'sudden event' the radiating aids were switched off in the seconds after handoff from Malaysia in a known area of poor radar cover, and the aircraft did not call Vietnam control.
3. The only comms system that was not switched off was SATCOM which maintained transport layer handshakes with the INMARSAT geostationary satellite. This is probably because very few if any crew members are either aware that SATCOM handshakes with the satellite even when not used and even if they were aware probably have no idea how to switch the SATCOM off. I would suspect that no non-engineers realize that these comms systems keep exchanging network messages even if untouched.
4. The aircraft did not just continue to fuel exhaustion. After all the radiating aids were switched off, immediately after handoff, it climbed to its ceiling and then turned back to fly along the Malaysian/Thai FIR boundary - across to Penang (the captain's birthplace) where it appears to have descended, then turned right North along the Malacca straits and turned to left to parallel the airway toward Sri Lanka then after passing Banda Aceh and clearing Sumatra and just after leaving radar cover, the aircraft turned South and flew into the Southern Indian Ocean.
What a chain of coincidences for a disabled aircraft
5. Someone in the crew was not incapacitated or 4, above would not be possible. Or of course someone else with the capability to operate a 777, but there were none on the passenger list.

As the report says - someone was flying the aircraft deliberately in a way to avoid suspicion and then to escape to somewhere it would not be found. Had it not been for the SATCOM and the rather strange figure of 8 orbit of the particular not-quite-geostationary satellite, and some very talented INMARSAT mathematicians the suspicion would have been that the aircraft ditched in the South China Sea. As it is, the aircraft was tracked to an area the size of Texas in the mainly unexplored South Indian Ocean. An area that _purely coincidentally_ the Captain had been practicing flying to in his home flight simulator kit. The position of the crash and the fact that there was a crash was confirmed by what wreckage has washed up months later on the coasts to the West of the crash site.
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 17:53
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ian W View Post
This hamster-wheel was done to death last time:
2, There was no 'sudden event' the radiating aids were switched off in the seconds after handoff from Malaysia in a known area of poor radar cover, and the aircraft did not call Vietnam control.
3. The only comms system that was not switched off was SATCOM which maintained transport layer handshakes with the INMARSAT geostationary satellite. This is probably because very few if any crew members are either aware that SATCOM handshakes with the satellite even when not used and even if they were aware probably have no idea how to switch the SATCOM off. I would suspect that no non-engineers realize that these comms systems keep exchanging network messages even if untouched.
4. The aircraft did not just continue to fuel exhaustion. After all the radiating aids were switched off, immediately after handoff, it climbed to its ceiling and then turned back to fly along the Malaysian/Thai FIR boundary - across to Penang (the captain's birthplace) where it appears to have descended, then turned right North along the Malacca straits and turned to left to parallel the airway toward Sri Lanka then after passing Banda Aceh and clearing Sumatra and just after leaving radar cover, the aircraft turned South and flew into the Southern Indian Ocean.
What a chain of coincidences for a disabled aircraft
5. Someone in the crew was not incapacitated or 4, above would not be possible. Or of course someone else with the capability to operate a 777, but there were none on the passenger list.

As the report says - someone was flying the aircraft deliberately in a way to avoid suspicion and then to escape to somewhere it would not be found. Had it not been for the SATCOM and the rather strange figure of 8 orbit of the particular not-quite-geostationary satellite, and some very talented INMARSAT mathematicians the suspicion would have been that the aircraft ditched in the South China Sea. As it is, the aircraft was tracked to an area the size of Texas in the mainly unexplored South Indian Ocean. An area that _purely coincidentally_ the Captain had been practicing flying to in his home flight simulator kit. The position of the crash and the fact that there was a crash was confirmed by what wreckage has washed up months later on the coasts to the West of the crash site.

Excellent post Ian W.

An interesting point regarding the PIC's home flight sim. He had Flight Sim 2004 and a 777-200LR addon installed on a second hard drive that wasn't connected to his computer at the time of the police search. He had Flight Sim X installed on the main Hard drive and seemed to carry out his research on the 'hidden' FS2004 sim. The files showing the rehearsed route had been deleted from the second hard drive, but were recovered by the FBI. Suspicious I'd say.

Last edited by booke23; 31st Jul 2018 at 18:07.
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 18:38
  #30 (permalink)  
 
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Ian W/booke23

Thanks both for your input.

I've long had my suspicions about the Captain for the reasons mentioned earlier, but this is the first I've heard that incriminating flight sim evidence was actually retrieved.

Do you have a link to a reliable source for that?

Cooch
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 18:43
  #31 (permalink)  
 
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If all Pilots who had flight sim at home and obscure self-created FMS routes saved were investigated.. they'd be none of us left....
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 19:58
  #32 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by flash8 View Post
If all Pilots who had flight sim at home and obscure self-created FMS routes saved were investigated.. they'd be none of us left....
Nicely said! My understanding is that every single cause appears to have a hole! The captain could have chosen a better place to supposedly commit suicide choosing an even larger depth at a similar distance - in the deepest ocean of the world.
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 20:14
  #33 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Coochycool View Post
Ian W/booke23

Thanks both for your input.

I've long had my suspicions about the Captain for the reasons mentioned earlier, but this is the first I've heard that incriminating flight sim evidence was actually retrieved.

Do you have a link to a reliable source for that?

Cooch
Detail on the PIC flight sim here Simulator Data from Computer of MH370 Captain: Part 1 « The Disappearance of MH370

There is nothing new with the release of this final report. The details regarding the PIC's sim have been in the public domain for a while now.

Originally Posted by flash8 View Post
If all Pilots who had flight sim at home and obscure self-created FMS routes saved were investigated.. they'd be none of us left....
I suppose, after all sims are great for messing around with. But not many pilots would go on to actually fly such an obscure self-created route for real.
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 20:28
  #34 (permalink)  
 
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I would suggest the single most important known fact in the investigation report is at paragraph 1.9.5.2. It reads :

"Throughout the flight of MH370, the aircraft communicated through the Inmarsat Indian
Ocean Region (IOR) I-3 Satellite and the GES in Perth, Australia."

The emphasis in bold characters are mine.

This can only mean that the aircraft remained airborne and its flight ended when its fuel was exhausted or nearly exhausted.
The investigation report has concluded that in the initial phases the aircraft was under human control.
Given all the other matters dealt with, in what is a very thorough and complete investigation, where no detail appears to have been overlooked, the reasonable conclusion is that for reasons unknown its crew, or any other person(s) on board, were unable to divert the aircraft from its final course to an unknown destination. There is no other credible evidence to the contrary. All else is speculation.
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Old 31st Jul 2018, 21:37
  #35 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by flash8 View Post
If all Pilots who had flight sim at home and obscure self-created FMS routes saved were investigated.. they'd be none of us left....
Are you suggesting that the captain having had a sim at home which had the same obscure destination as what really happened is coincidence?
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Old 1st Aug 2018, 03:22
  #36 (permalink)  
 
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Many people read this forum because they are pilots. Pilots know bad things can happen in any flight. May be you are good or your time is not up yet. It is highly unethical to speculate and accuse the captain of any intention to harm the passengers and the plane.

If you are a pilot, I humbly ask to you to have a think at this..........you had an accident and passed on, leaving your family in grief and disbelief. They dig into this forum for answers just to read all these baseless accusations! Do you want that and why are you now doing it to other pilots families?

God bless all of you!

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Old 1st Aug 2018, 08:14
  #37 (permalink)  
 
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FL475 seems unlikely, but equally FL445 10nm south of Penang
The report clearly states that the altitude information from the primary radar does not match the capability of the aircraft (not only the absolute figures, but also the altitude changes), but is known to be very unreliable. It is simply not made for this, radar can detect direction and distance, the closer the plane is to the station the more reliably it can also determine altitude, but not at long ranges.

The report relatively often states, that details are not matching, that events can not be explained... It leaves a lot of room for speculation.

I think they have produced a sound document, there is not much more you can do with the available information.
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Old 1st Aug 2018, 09:51
  #38 (permalink)  
 
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From the report:

It was also noted that, in the absence of autopilot or continuous manual control, an aircraft is very unlikely to maintain straight and level flight. Further, it is extremely unlikely for an aircraft to enter and maintain a turn and then return to straight and level flight for any significant period of time.
From the foregoing discussion it can be generally deduced that there is no evidence to suggest that a malfunction had caused the aircraft to divert from its filed flight plan route.
The analysis of the relevant aircraft systems taking into account the route followed by the aircraft and the height at which it flew, constrained by its performance and range capability, does not suggest a mechanical problem with the aircraft.
Yes, there will always be some element of uncertainty as there were no survivors and no FDRs recovered. However, when you have pretty much proven to yourself that the aircraft was deliberately flown to wherever it crashed, I’d have thought at least a suggestion of “unlawful interference” could be made, as opposed to:

In conclusion, the Team is unable to determine the real cause for the disappearance of MH370.
Which is a bit of a cop-out, IMHO.
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Old 1st Aug 2018, 10:15
  #39 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Rwy in Sight View Post
Nicely said! My understanding is that every single cause appears to have a hole! The captain could have chosen a better place to supposedly commit suicide choosing an even larger depth at a similar distance - in the deepest ocean of the world.
Considering the aircraft has not been found & all searches have yielded no results it does seem whoever did this found the "Best place" to hide this aircraft. Now can you imagine if he has also figured a way to somewhat deceive the IMMERSAT data albeit it by 5 Degrees?
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Old 1st Aug 2018, 10:38
  #40 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by RufusXS View Post
Are you suggesting that the captain having had a sim at home which had the same obscure destination as what really happened is coincidence?
How can the destination be obscure if all the information are there on the the sim?
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