Boy, it's noisy in here!
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Boy, it's noisy in here!
"Air India plane flies with wheels out, forced to land early"
Air India: AI plane flies with wheels out, forced to land early | India News - Times of India
Air India: AI plane flies with wheels out, forced to land early | India News - Times of India
F9er,
Well, the Hapag Lloyd crew knew the gear was down and why it was, they didn't fuel plan for the eventuality and didn't recognize its effects. Us C-5 guys are intimately familiar with gear down flights, drag indices and noise, vibration effects.
Well, the Hapag Lloyd crew knew the gear was down and why it was, they didn't fuel plan for the eventuality and didn't recognize its effects. Us C-5 guys are intimately familiar with gear down flights, drag indices and noise, vibration effects.
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From the article linked above:
In some previous cases in India, the licenses were fraudulent, for example:
Nose wheel landing: DGCA cancels pilot's licence - Times of India
"After take off, both the women pilots forgot to retract the landing gear. As a result, the brand new Airbus A-320 continued to ascend at a very low climb rate. The plane finally gave up climbing after reaching an altitude of 24,000 feet as the extended landing gear meant very heavy drag. It then levelled out (continued flying at 24,000 feet as opposed to the usually assigned level of 35-37,000 feet) and flew at 230 knots (426 kmph) for the next 1.5 hours," said a source.
Aircraft are designed to fly with minimum drag for enhanced fuel efficiency and extended range. Since AI 676 was flying at a much lower than the optimal level and that too with wheels out, it meant more fuel burn due to extra drag.
By the time the A-320 was near Nagpur, it was very low on fuel and the pilots decided to divert there as the plane could not have made it to Mumbai. "When preparing to land, they decided to lower the landing gear. At this point they realised that the wheels had been out all the while from Kolkata," said the source.
Aircraft are designed to fly with minimum drag for enhanced fuel efficiency and extended range. Since AI 676 was flying at a much lower than the optimal level and that too with wheels out, it meant more fuel burn due to extra drag.
By the time the A-320 was near Nagpur, it was very low on fuel and the pilots decided to divert there as the plane could not have made it to Mumbai. "When preparing to land, they decided to lower the landing gear. At this point they realised that the wheels had been out all the while from Kolkata," said the source.
CHENNAI/NEW DELHI: The licence of a woman pilot of no-frills airline IndiGo has been cancelled after she made a rough landing in Goa last month, endangering several lives and investigators later found she had allegedly faked papers to get her permit to fly.
"Yes, it (commercial pilot's licence) has been cancelled. We will file a police complaint soon against the pilot, Parminder Kaur Gulati," DGCA Director General Bharat Bhushan said.
DGCA sources said the pilot while flying the private Indigo airliner made a rough landing at Goa airport on January 11 using the nose wheel instead of the rear landing gear.
Investigations have revealed that she used the wrong technique several times, the sources said.
The sources said the incident came to light when the Airbus A-320 returned to Delhi from Goa and a routine inspection found that its nosewheel was damaged.
The investigators then analysed the data of the Digital Flight Data Recorder (DFDR) of the aircraft, which the sources claimed, showed that the lady captain had used the wrong landing technique that caused the nosewheel damage.
Following the probe, it was also found that the papers of Capt Gulati were not in order and enquiries into them showed that the documents, required for getting a flying license, were forged, the sources claimed.
"Yes, it (commercial pilot's licence) has been cancelled. We will file a police complaint soon against the pilot, Parminder Kaur Gulati," DGCA Director General Bharat Bhushan said.
DGCA sources said the pilot while flying the private Indigo airliner made a rough landing at Goa airport on January 11 using the nose wheel instead of the rear landing gear.
Investigations have revealed that she used the wrong technique several times, the sources said.
The sources said the incident came to light when the Airbus A-320 returned to Delhi from Goa and a routine inspection found that its nosewheel was damaged.
The investigators then analysed the data of the Digital Flight Data Recorder (DFDR) of the aircraft, which the sources claimed, showed that the lady captain had used the wrong landing technique that caused the nosewheel damage.
Following the probe, it was also found that the papers of Capt Gulati were not in order and enquiries into them showed that the documents, required for getting a flying license, were forged, the sources claimed.
Can an AB pilot explain how this is possible?
As a GA guy, I really have no idea what Airbus monitoring and automation is capable of. I am pretty sure there is a ground proximity warning if attempting landing when gear is up.
If so, similar warnings seem obvious...overspeed, exceeding speed for flaps, gear,etc.
Can an Airbus pilot walk us through the system warnings that were missed?
If so, similar warnings seem obvious...overspeed, exceeding speed for flaps, gear,etc.
Can an Airbus pilot walk us through the system warnings that were missed?
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If, and if, the reporting is true it is unbelievable. Forgetting to raise the landing gear is, fair enough, a mistake that can happen, not professional and all but it can happen. It is the part afterwards that is astounding! No, or badly done, after take off checklist. Aircraft barely climbs, only reaches fl240, presumably on full power. They cruise like that for an hour and only after fuel is getting low they divert.
If things like that happen and your engines are working it screams "drag". Either flaps, gear or structural damage and you do not proceed towards your destination without knowing what it is.
There must be more to it than what is reported,
If things like that happen and your engines are working it screams "drag". Either flaps, gear or structural damage and you do not proceed towards your destination without knowing what it is.
There must be more to it than what is reported,
I’m not a pilot, but I call BS on this. I can’t believe that a) there were no automated warnings, b) the pilots simply shrugged their shoulders and accepted the lack of performance, or c) that nobody noticed. I believe they have radar and ATC in India?
FlightRadar24 track
Confirms the flight AI676 on July 22nd took off Kolkata and diverted to Nagpur.... then continued from Nagpur to Mumbai
https://www.flightradar24.com/data/f...ai676/#e30062e
https://www.flightradar24.com/data/f...ai676/#e30062e
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I guess that someone who doesn't like women pilots could have made all this up and fed it to the newspaper; but if you believe Flight Aware, the flight departed on time, only climbed to FL 240, and arrived three hours late in Mumbai. To me that points to an unplanned stop. There are some technical malfunctions that would make you level off low, but in that case one would expect a longer delay as they fixed the airplane at the diversion airport. I have never seen an airplane with a "gear down when should be up" warning, the reasons being that having the gear down is safer than having it up, and that it is extremely obvious by the noise level, lack of climb performance and increased fuel burn. Not to mention the checklist. There is an "insufficient fuel" warning, however, which the crew thankfully dealt with.
Perhaps a gear pin was left in, that would also explain it.
Perhaps a gear pin was left in, that would also explain it.
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No-one has mentioned the 'After Takeoff Cx List.' Does this not include 'Gear Up'? If so, then it is more than a little forgetfulness, but a lack of Cx List discipline. It also exposes a lack of problem solving culture/philosophy/training. Problem: the a/c is not performing as expected; Why? En-route fuel checks, (issue that is an SOP) we are using too much fuel; Why? The vibration & noise is more than usual: why? So many questions should have been buzzing around the flight deck. There are supposed to be 2 brains up there. One might fail, but the back-up system should have been working. Good job they were not trying to climb over the Himalayas.
Does India have an alternative day to April 1st?
Does India have an alternative day to April 1st?
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