BREAKING NEWS: airliner missing within Egyptian FIR
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Originally Posted by Icarus2001
Really. You think because the aircraft was still climbing the belt sign must have been on, therefore all pax were seated?
Amazing.
Are you a pilot? Do you fly as a passenger very much?
The belt sign in many airlines comes off after transition (FL100-FL150) if in smooth air and nothing visible ahead that poses a turbulence threat.
Amazing.
Are you a pilot? Do you fly as a passenger very much?
The belt sign in many airlines comes off after transition (FL100-FL150) if in smooth air and nothing visible ahead that poses a turbulence threat.
Originally Posted by dsc810
The Russians will be in a quandry.
1. if it was a bomb then they would be forced into some retaliatory action which they probably do not want to get involved in for all sorts or reasons.
1. if it was a bomb then they would be forced into some retaliatory action which they probably do not want to get involved in for all sorts or reasons.
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Kulverstukas, I wonder how 'engine blast' became 'explosive device' by No 10. Politics.
Do you happen to know when the drone took the aerial views of the crash site?
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Originally Posted by Kulverstukas
Really? Can you give me direct proof about that?
TASS: Russian Politics & Diplomacy - Kremlin warns against linking A321 crash in Egypt with Russia?s operation in Syria
But I have certainly exaggerated it by saying "having a hard time".
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Last edited by oldoberon; 4th Nov 2015 at 18:58. Reason: colourise request for help
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Sergey, moreover, ""Hypothetic insinuations on that score are inappropriate. Besides, these are absolutely different issues. There is no point in linking them," Peskov said, when asked if progress in Russia’s operation in Syria might be affected if it was confirmed the plane had fallen victim to a terrorist attack."
As I said, message is clear: We doesn't make trades with terrorists.
As I said, message is clear: We doesn't make trades with terrorists.
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The British government has decided to halt flights from Sharm el-Sheikh:
Quote:
"While the investigation is still ongoing we cannot say categorically why the Russian jet crashed. But as more information has come to light we have become concerned that the plane may well have been brought down by an explosive device."
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/s...harm-el-sheikh
Quote:
"While the investigation is still ongoing we cannot say categorically why the Russian jet crashed. But as more information has come to light we have become concerned that the plane may well have been brought down by an explosive device."
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/s...harm-el-sheikh
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As someone who is due to operate a Sharm this weekend I have to admit I've been seriously worried these past few days. I've been saying for months (not on here) that the next place, after Tunisia to receive this treatment would be Sharm. It took six weeks for our company to circulate the NOTAM regarding St Catherine which I found far from ideal. I operated a number of SSH flights during this six week period, one of which took me straight over CAT below 25,000' because 22R was in use. My eyes are on stalks every time I go near the place and brief the other guy if I see anything untoward I'll be taking evasive action.
IF, and it's a big IF this tragedy is sinister, why can't we just get the RAF down there with their bomb dog squad and go through everything checked in, and the aircraft prior to departure? To me it's the only way we can reduce a bomb threat to its lowest acceptable level. The Dogs won't lie and identify anyone, or item of baggage that'll be suspicious.
IF, and it's a big IF this tragedy is sinister, why can't we just get the RAF down there with their bomb dog squad and go through everything checked in, and the aircraft prior to departure? To me it's the only way we can reduce a bomb threat to its lowest acceptable level. The Dogs won't lie and identify anyone, or item of baggage that'll be suspicious.
Just sticking for a moment with the earlier Egyptian statement talking about an "engine explosion", is there anything in the photos so far of the engines themselves - or adjacent fuselage - that would support that (appreciating that, whatever the cause, those engines fell far, fast and hard and have huge final impact damage)?
I recall many messages ago someone looking at a photo of one of the engines and saying something about missing fan parts. But I now can't find that post.
I recall many messages ago someone looking at a photo of one of the engines and saying something about missing fan parts. But I now can't find that post.
Sprinkles
quote ''As someone who is due to operate a Sharm this weekend I have to admit I've been seriously worried these past few days. I've been saying for months (not on here) that the next place, after Tunisia to receive this treatment would be Sharm. It took six weeks for our company to circulate the NOTAM regarding St Catherine which I found far from ideal. I operated a number of SSH flights during this six week period, one of which took me straight over CAT below 25,000' because 22R was in use. My eyes are on stalks every time I go near the place and brief the other guy if I see anything untoward I'll be taking evasive action.
IF, and it's a big IF this tragedy is sinister, why can't we just get the RAF down there with their bomb dog squad and go through everything checked in, and the aircraft prior to departure? To me it's the only way we can reduce a bomb threat to its lowest acceptable level. The Dogs won't lie and identify anyone, or item of baggage that'll be suspicious
i'm amazed that descents were allowed too - my pal a 757 skip out of BRS
had the same - he's ex RAF and did not like it one bit
indeed - trouble is the Metrojet had been on the ground for 12 hours so this occasion any bomb could have been placed on board not in baggage but by an airport worker in the pay of dirty others
quote ''As someone who is due to operate a Sharm this weekend I have to admit I've been seriously worried these past few days. I've been saying for months (not on here) that the next place, after Tunisia to receive this treatment would be Sharm. It took six weeks for our company to circulate the NOTAM regarding St Catherine which I found far from ideal. I operated a number of SSH flights during this six week period, one of which took me straight over CAT below 25,000' because 22R was in use. My eyes are on stalks every time I go near the place and brief the other guy if I see anything untoward I'll be taking evasive action.
IF, and it's a big IF this tragedy is sinister, why can't we just get the RAF down there with their bomb dog squad and go through everything checked in, and the aircraft prior to departure? To me it's the only way we can reduce a bomb threat to its lowest acceptable level. The Dogs won't lie and identify anyone, or item of baggage that'll be suspicious
i'm amazed that descents were allowed too - my pal a 757 skip out of BRS
had the same - he's ex RAF and did not like it one bit
indeed - trouble is the Metrojet had been on the ground for 12 hours so this occasion any bomb could have been placed on board not in baggage but by an airport worker in the pay of dirty others
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According the BBC's aviation expert, UK crews operating into Sharm are 'at the limit of their hours', so delays for departures from Sharm are likely to result in cancellations, or stops in Europe for replacement crews.
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@AGBagb ... fan
Dont know if you mean one of my 'update' posts ...
Found pictures of 2 different engines. I call them A and B as i have no been able to link them to either left or right wing positions yet.
Found pictures of 2 different fans. The first still has all blades (or 1 is missing) and all visible blades are complete end to end. The second clearly has a number of broken blades.
One of the spinners is clearly sooted (would have to check which one), while the engine itself is away from a 'burned area'. So a preliminary impression is that there was a fire at some stage inside the engine. Not possible to say of course if this was during the flight, during the descent or after the engine hit the ground. There is no clear evidence of fire at the outside of the engines. And no trace of 'shrapnel' damage. The leading edge of the cowlings and the cowling doors have separated but are close to the engines (as far as i can see now).
Hope this answers part of your question.
Found pictures of 2 different engines. I call them A and B as i have no been able to link them to either left or right wing positions yet.
Found pictures of 2 different fans. The first still has all blades (or 1 is missing) and all visible blades are complete end to end. The second clearly has a number of broken blades.
One of the spinners is clearly sooted (would have to check which one), while the engine itself is away from a 'burned area'. So a preliminary impression is that there was a fire at some stage inside the engine. Not possible to say of course if this was during the flight, during the descent or after the engine hit the ground. There is no clear evidence of fire at the outside of the engines. And no trace of 'shrapnel' damage. The leading edge of the cowlings and the cowling doors have separated but are close to the engines (as far as i can see now).
Hope this answers part of your question.
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"Russian media outlet LifeNews claims that more than 200 fragments of human remains from approximately 150 people have arrived in St Petersburg.
According to sources, there was a significant difference in the cause of death between passengers at the front and the rear of the aircraft.
Those at the front suffered 'blunt force trauma of the chest, abdomen and pelvis with multiple fractures of upper and lower limbs with tears to the internal organs. Deaths occurred due to acute blood loss, shock and open head injuries.'
Those at the rear of aircraft suffered 'explosive trauma with multiple burns over 90 per cent of their soft tissues'.
Passengers at the back had shrapnel injuries and were peppered with metal particles."
Russian plane crash reveals ?no proof it broke up in mid-air', Egypt claims | Daily Mail Online
According to sources, there was a significant difference in the cause of death between passengers at the front and the rear of the aircraft.
Those at the front suffered 'blunt force trauma of the chest, abdomen and pelvis with multiple fractures of upper and lower limbs with tears to the internal organs. Deaths occurred due to acute blood loss, shock and open head injuries.'
Those at the rear of aircraft suffered 'explosive trauma with multiple burns over 90 per cent of their soft tissues'.
Passengers at the back had shrapnel injuries and were peppered with metal particles."
Russian plane crash reveals ?no proof it broke up in mid-air', Egypt claims | Daily Mail Online
Kulverstukas - thanks for those engine pics. Without context, it's difficult to say. But a guess would be that the fan assembly is lying somewhat near the engine (maybe...) and has separated from it on final impact?
And AO283, thanks too. My impression is that nothing in the photos is screaming out major engine failure but of course photos can be deceptive and imcomplete (as well as me being no expert in the engineering of all this!).
And AO283, thanks too. My impression is that nothing in the photos is screaming out major engine failure but of course photos can be deceptive and imcomplete (as well as me being no expert in the engineering of all this!).
Very good Observation!
Even GA aircraft usually have phugoides around 20s. Airliners typically 40 - 60s. 8s is a clear indications something is totally wrong. You would get a high frequency phugoide if the angle of incidence is very different between wing and tailplane. Which would fit quite well to the assumption that the HS must have experienced a significant excursion.