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American Airlines Pilot Dies in Flight BOS-PHX

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American Airlines Pilot Dies in Flight BOS-PHX

Old 7th Oct 2015, 22:41
  #41 (permalink)  
 
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But he didn't call for a doctor, did he? Neither did the FA call for medical help. Nor was any reported effort made to resuscitate the afflicted pilot.

Because the FA and the FO knew it was too late. Otherwise, it is inexplicable not to have called for help, not to have attempted to use the AED, not to have laid the patient out on the front entry floor and perform CPR.
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Old 7th Oct 2015, 23:51
  #42 (permalink)  
 
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Robert

Out of curiosity piqued by the thread. Who would you say would be better equipped to handle an inflight medical emergency, a doctor or a paramedic?

Recognize there's a lot of variables.
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Old 8th Oct 2015, 00:52
  #43 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by West Coast View Post
Robert

Out of curiosity piqued by the thread. Who would you say would be better equipped to handle an inflight medical emergency, a doctor or a paramedic?

Recognize there's a lot of variables.
As an EMT-I with 8 years of street experience (emergency, not a transport service), pilot, and volunteered myself 3 times on commercial flights...in general, under any pre-hospital/field conditions, airborne or otherwise: ER doc w/field experience (e.g. HEMS flight physician) > HEMS flight nurse/paramedic > paramedic (any type) > ER doc > EMT with emergency experience (not transport service) > ER nurse > everyone else. That is a fairly large generalization and YMMV quite a bit. Mostly it comes down to whatever is the strongest combination of medical skill combined with a level of comfort working outside of the hospital environment. I've personally seen some otherwise outstanding ER personnel completely brain lock when trying to execute in the back of an ambulance.
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Old 8th Oct 2015, 05:03
  #44 (permalink)  
 
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Listening to the audio, it sounds as though they gave the F/O a pretty straight taxi to the gate at the end of the terminal so there was probably a minimum of turning in a confined space. I'm assuming that provided he got it somewhere close to the correct place, the jetway would be easy enough to position, assuming they didn't just have a set of mobile stairs on hand.
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Old 8th Oct 2015, 05:26
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What a ridiculous world when you are qualified to fly the aircraft but not steer it on the ground. Good old USA again.
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Old 8th Oct 2015, 05:40
  #46 (permalink)  
 
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Why couldn't he taxy to the gate? As long as the docking guidance wasn't left seat only he could do it. If it was left seat only they could use a Marshall.

In our mob F/O's park the Jet when it's their sector without any problems......
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Old 8th Oct 2015, 05:46
  #47 (permalink)  
 
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I knew the captain, and I'd flown with both of them. Both good guys and experienced.

The F/O was very experienced, all the pilots in PHX have been here for at least 10 years due to our base being locked in place. Company policy is that only the captain taxis the jet. Most captains on the airbus, let the F/Os taxi. Everyone is typed in the plane, you have to demonstrate the ability to taxi.

This was a sad day for us. The crew did an outstanding job. If there are critiques then they will come out in the final report, but no one has suggested that anything other than the best efforts were made to take care of Mike.
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Old 8th Oct 2015, 07:40
  #48 (permalink)  
 
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Cactusbusdrvr,

Our heartfelt condolences go out to you and your fellow Cactus pilots who knew Mike.

May he rest in peace.
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Old 8th Oct 2015, 14:05
  #49 (permalink)  
 
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As far as letting a medical doctor on the flight deck, 14 CFR 91.3 is pretty clear:

(b) In an in-flight emergency requiring immediate action, the pilot in command may deviate from any rule of this part to the extent required to meet that emergency.
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Old 8th Oct 2015, 16:19
  #50 (permalink)  
 
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aa777888 answers the question well... in a medical emergency aboard an airliner, there is a large variability on the skills of those who may be in a position to help. EMTs, paramedics, RNs, MDs, fire/police... I am a gastroenterologist, and although I regularly take an ACLS retraining course, I would defer to an active critical care physician or critical care nurse in an emergency. But keep in mind that the current automatic external defribrillators are just that... automatic. They will tell you when and if a shock is warranted.

In this situation, we did not need to have an MD admitted to the flight deck. If the pilot has shown any signs of life or had the event been witnessed, the best course of action would have been to ask for help to move the man to the front exit area and work on resuscitation with CPR (if needed), defribrillation as needed, and whatever appropriate meds are currently in the medical kit.

This type of medical emergency happens relatively frequently with passengers. Again, the fact (as far as we know) that neither the FO or the assisting FA called for further medical aid from passengers means to me that they already felt it was too late.
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Old 8th Oct 2015, 17:37
  #51 (permalink)  
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As far as letting a medical doctor on the flight deck, 14 CFR 91.3 is pretty clear:

(b) In an in-flight emergency requiring immediate action, the pilot in command may deviate from any rule of this part to the extent required to meet that emergency.
Actually, I believe the more pertinent reg in this case is:

121.557 Emergencies: Domestic and flag operations.

(a) In an emergency situation that requires immediate decision and action the pilot in command may take any action that he considers necessary under the circumstances. In such a case he may deviate from prescribed operations procedures and methods, weather minimums, and this chapter, to the extent required in the interests of safety.
I'll certainly agree that it's wacky to worry about cockpit door regulations and legal jurisdiction when someone's life might be at stake but that's the modern CYA workplace that we now operate in.
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Old 8th Oct 2015, 20:15
  #52 (permalink)  
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Our heartfelt condolences go out to you and your fellow Cactus pilots who knew Mike.

May he rest in peace.
Amen.

What a ridiculous world when you are qualified to fly the aircraft but not steer it on the ground. Good old USA again.
Don't know how this one is blamed on the U.S. (but it is indeed traditional here ).

Some overseas operators allow the FO to taxi, most do not, right?

Company policy is that only the captain taxis the jet. Most captains on the airbus, let the F/Os taxi. Everyone is typed in the plane, you have to demonstrate the ability to taxi.
Do you mean to say that the AA FM prohibits the FO from taxiing but the captains allow it anyway? Three decades ago that sort of thing was pretty common in the U.S. as in 'swap seats so we can give the FE a leg'. But in recent years I hardly see anything done other than playing video games and texting that isn't explicitly allowed while in the seat.

Back before the days of the U.S. P2 type ratings, some airlines that typed the FO would let you take most of the sim ride from the right seat, then hop in the left seat to taxi and do a reject to complete the requirements.

Why would a copilot assume the additional responsibility of routinely taxiing the aircraft if he/she is not being paid commensurately for that responsibility?
Similar arguments were made by some geniuses down at the union hall about not taking the type rating offer as an FO on domestic fleets. I flew international aircraft and the rating was supposedly required for crew augmentation although there were always a couple of FO's who couldn't pass the rating ride but somehow could pass the FO check.

If you ever hit the streets for BK furlough or strike, that extra type rating is nice to have in my opinion.

Anyway, in these days of heightened awareness of perceived income inequality, the other argument is made: why should captains make more money when the first officer is younger, better looking, smarter etc.? And the FO would already be bidding captain now if not for 9-11, age 65, RJ's, BK, CEO pay, the merger, etc., etc. etc...
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Old 8th Oct 2015, 20:39
  #53 (permalink)  
 
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Exclamation

Company policy is that only the captain taxis the jet. Most captains on the airbus, let the F/Os taxi. Everyone is typed in the plane, you have to demonstrate the ability to taxi.
I'd be very surprised if this is true. The A320 transmits almost anything to MX, and if the F/O gets caught taxiing the airplane against company policy, then (s)he's have to do an interesting carpet dance.

I am typed in the A320 and was not required to demonstrate my taxi (in)ability on my checkride. I know that there are slight difference between east and west crews but letting the F/O taxi?
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Old 9th Oct 2015, 08:54
  #54 (permalink)  
 
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"Some overseas operators allow the FO to taxi, most do not, right?"


I believe most 'overseas' operators include taxying as a function of the F/O.


One sizeable operator outside of the U.S. that employs FAA crew include taxying training for new joiners to the R/H seat on the T7 & 'Bus.
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Old 9th Oct 2015, 10:09
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Doesn't matter a damn whether he was allowed, qualified/unqualified, able/unable...............good grief . The FO was , effectively, the COMMANDER of the aircraft and in an emergency can deviate from all rules and regs if he considers it necessary. Sadly, if the LHS pilot was determined to have lost his life, it is no longer an "Emergency" but a state of "Urgency". Full Pan call . In that state, if he felt uncomfortable taxying, inform ATC and comply with guidance. Looks to me like a very sad event very well handled.

In my day, all British manufactured aircraft could be taxiid from either seat. (There was a tiller on each side). Boeings could not. (Tiller only on the left). Of course, limited capability was available through differential breaking but you would not want to try that method for getting on the gate.

My concern is that yet again, so carefully monitored and, according to press reports, just having passed a Class one Medical, the pilot has a fatal heart attack ? Pretty useless screening, eh ?
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Old 9th Oct 2015, 11:59
  #56 (permalink)  
 
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As stated on the website of a popular Phoenix based AME:

"Remember passing the standards for the flight physical, does not assure that your general health is good and there are no underlying conditions that need to be addressed."
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Old 9th Oct 2015, 12:59
  #57 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by slowjet View Post
<snip>

My concern is that yet again, so carefully monitored and, according to press reports, just having passed a Class one Medical, the pilot has a fatal heart attack ? Pretty useless screening, eh ?
You can only say it's useless if the carefully monitored pilots have the same rate of heart attacks etc. as the unmonitored general populace.
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Old 9th Oct 2015, 13:09
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My concern is that yet again, so carefully monitored and, according to press reports, just having passed a Class one Medical, the pilot has a fatal heart attack ? Pretty useless screening, eh ?
Not at all.

No carefully monitored screening can predict every single possible occurence of incapitation or death of a human being. Our medical science is centuries away from that.

That is why we carry two (or more) pilots.

The system we have, worked as designed. What is your issue with that? It happens extremely rarely, and on they day it did happen, the jet landed safely. That is the system we have implemented and it has proved it's worth yet again. And that is the system we continue to be happy with.
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Old 9th Oct 2015, 15:10
  #59 (permalink)  
 
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Phoenix Fire honors fallen American Airlines pilot - Story | KSAZ

The pilot, Michael Johnson's body was returned to Phoenix. Watch the video of his fellow employees at the airport.
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Old 9th Oct 2015, 15:25
  #60 (permalink)  
 
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The dignity of the event was somewhat diminished by the generic shipping container.

American could have done better.
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