Ease up on U.S. airport screening?
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Stuck in the middle...
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I recently went from a major European hub, via an East Coast gateway, to a west-coast destination, with a major US carrier. Had to go through the standard security to get into the departures area, but then at the gate (we were told to get there well early), was only allowed into the holding room four-at-a-time where they did a comprehensive manual check (including shoes). I was treated courteously at all times and I responded in kind. One gentlemen who tried to make a scene was (very courteously) informed that he could exercise his right to decline to be checked, but then the carrier could exercise its right to refuse him carriage. he shut up & removed his shoes.
In the US, I was alarmed that I did not have to pass through ANY checks between the gate where I arrived and the gate for the connecting flight, despite that concourse being packed with people and flights from many different carriers (so tha carrier I flew with had no guarantee as to where others had come from).
Leaving the west coast for my return, I was randomly selected for a search (I later noticed my boarding card had been marked at check-in) - again, very thorough and courteous - I made a point of being courteous to the checkers and they remarked that I was unusual in that respect - so I must conclude that if punters are rude to them, they will be rude back- and fair enough. Again, sod-all checks at the east-coast gateway to come back to Europe.
So it appears to me that people OUTSIDE the major east-coast centres are taking security far more seriously than those in the cities which are most likely to be targets next time. There is much gnashing of teeth over the government here - but they will listen to the public, so why are you wasting time writing to PPRUNE and not to your local newspaper of congressman?? Why are those in the industry not taking industrial action? Can you seriously tell me that the papers would not LOVE to take the side of an airline worker sacked for blowing the whistle on lax security??
In the US, I was alarmed that I did not have to pass through ANY checks between the gate where I arrived and the gate for the connecting flight, despite that concourse being packed with people and flights from many different carriers (so tha carrier I flew with had no guarantee as to where others had come from).
Leaving the west coast for my return, I was randomly selected for a search (I later noticed my boarding card had been marked at check-in) - again, very thorough and courteous - I made a point of being courteous to the checkers and they remarked that I was unusual in that respect - so I must conclude that if punters are rude to them, they will be rude back- and fair enough. Again, sod-all checks at the east-coast gateway to come back to Europe.
So it appears to me that people OUTSIDE the major east-coast centres are taking security far more seriously than those in the cities which are most likely to be targets next time. There is much gnashing of teeth over the government here - but they will listen to the public, so why are you wasting time writing to PPRUNE and not to your local newspaper of congressman?? Why are those in the industry not taking industrial action? Can you seriously tell me that the papers would not LOVE to take the side of an airline worker sacked for blowing the whistle on lax security??
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: NY-USA
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Security a joke....
Ever since September 11th I have been in about 10 flights within the U.S . Most of them have been into/out of La Guardia in New York. The following has happened:
In Atlanta on September 21st my lighter was taken away from me. I bought another one in the stores by the gate. It cost me $2.50 to have a cigarette before my flight.
In Houston in January security asked me if I had a zippo lighter in my laptop bag. I said yes and they asked if they could see it. Then the security person put it to the side and said thank you.... I said I wanted my lighter back, they said I'd have to check it... I gave it to a friend that thank god had bid me goodbye by the security check. Next to my zippo, I had a bic, which I could keep but hey terrorists only use zippos, right ?
Between Houston and New York, 4 hour flights, I get served pretzels, if I am lucky a cold sandwich, because they cannot provide food that requires knives...
In New York, after I have been rebooked on another airline due to a delay making my connection impossible, my bag is rechecked. I told them I am trying to make an early flight, the bag has already been checked by the other airline (as the tags showed) 30 minutes ago. No, since I am rechecking in from another airline I need to be rechecked. Ok. I miss the early flight. The next one gets cancelled, I get booked on a morning flight. I ask if I can leave my checked luggage with them. No I cannot. On the third flight I get rechecked. Again opened my bag, took everything out, put it back in.
In Houston again I lose another flight cause someone takes their time checking my bag. Checked in 1 hour 30 minutes before my flight on a Sunday morning. When I had called they had said 60 minutes. Takes me about 12 hours to make it to New York cause of diversions and delays due to weather later on in the day (usually a 4 hour flight). I was one of the lucky ones that got on a 9 pm from Pittsburgh as a standby. Of course they wouldn't pay for a hotel cause it was due to weather now....
Have had to take shoes off, every single time. Even sandals were taken off. Have been frisked every single time. Have taken laptops apart, turned on and off cellphones.
I am a Greek citizen that has lived in the US the last 7.5 years. My "criminal" record consists of 2 speeding tickets. I pay full taxes. Went to a good school here, carry the ring. Have a very slight accent. I now work for a software company and carry all of my visa papers, all in order, for every trip. I always check in with my state-issued driver's license which does not denote my citizenship. I am usually dressed business casual, very clean appearance and travel with my laptop. I am an able male, 25 years old. My full first name is 12 characters.
My father, 60 years old, a diabetic has been harassed for an hour worth of "security" for check-in. His background, he is a retired Air Force 2-star general for Greece, a NATO country. He has held "top secret" NATO clearance and above. He is still harassed for over an hour for an internal flight while he has just flown across the Atlantic into New York 2 days before and has proof of it. He can still disable almost any man with his bare arms.
Why am I writing all this ? Well, I would have no objection what-so-ever to it, none at all, had I not witnessed on 3 different occassions, in two different airports, airport employees complaining about losing their security id cards and just been waved through. On one occassion, when one of the 18-year-old employees was getting a replacement id, to go to the ramp and find a piece of luggage, the other employee that gave it to him just said "What is it, the 3rd one this week ?". Those ids of course could never end up in terrorists' hands.
But hell, just as long as they are full-blooded Americans around the planes, they are safe right ? Should I just mention Oklahoma City here ?
Do I need a lighter or a plastic knife provided to me for food to assault someone on a plane ? No. Does anyone trained in hand-to-hand combat need it ? No. Can a terrorist get a gun on a plane. Sure, all he needs is a damn airport id. The scum that did this back in September, just thought it was too much trouble for something they did not need.
Does anyone believe that the locked-door concept is going to work ? Do not pilots need to take a leak ? These doors cannot be broken into ? Or even simpler, if someone threatens passengers' lives, even starts killing people in the cabin, does anyone think that the pilots will not open the door ?
TNT is playing "Executive Decision". Is it not ironic that there has never been a high-jacking that has had weapons loaded in Athens ? But sure, everyone else's security sucks and is not safe, but the US.
So can everyone stop the BSing and either make flights safe or stop harassing everyone ? I do not mind security checks, I have gone through them for the whole of my life. I was at RheinDahlen when the IRA attacked. Have had a lot of real security checks.
Do not get me wrong. I love this country and living here. If I didn't, I would leave, plain and simple. It is just some of the pretentious BS and ignorance that I cannot stand....
In Atlanta on September 21st my lighter was taken away from me. I bought another one in the stores by the gate. It cost me $2.50 to have a cigarette before my flight.
In Houston in January security asked me if I had a zippo lighter in my laptop bag. I said yes and they asked if they could see it. Then the security person put it to the side and said thank you.... I said I wanted my lighter back, they said I'd have to check it... I gave it to a friend that thank god had bid me goodbye by the security check. Next to my zippo, I had a bic, which I could keep but hey terrorists only use zippos, right ?
Between Houston and New York, 4 hour flights, I get served pretzels, if I am lucky a cold sandwich, because they cannot provide food that requires knives...
In New York, after I have been rebooked on another airline due to a delay making my connection impossible, my bag is rechecked. I told them I am trying to make an early flight, the bag has already been checked by the other airline (as the tags showed) 30 minutes ago. No, since I am rechecking in from another airline I need to be rechecked. Ok. I miss the early flight. The next one gets cancelled, I get booked on a morning flight. I ask if I can leave my checked luggage with them. No I cannot. On the third flight I get rechecked. Again opened my bag, took everything out, put it back in.
In Houston again I lose another flight cause someone takes their time checking my bag. Checked in 1 hour 30 minutes before my flight on a Sunday morning. When I had called they had said 60 minutes. Takes me about 12 hours to make it to New York cause of diversions and delays due to weather later on in the day (usually a 4 hour flight). I was one of the lucky ones that got on a 9 pm from Pittsburgh as a standby. Of course they wouldn't pay for a hotel cause it was due to weather now....
Have had to take shoes off, every single time. Even sandals were taken off. Have been frisked every single time. Have taken laptops apart, turned on and off cellphones.
I am a Greek citizen that has lived in the US the last 7.5 years. My "criminal" record consists of 2 speeding tickets. I pay full taxes. Went to a good school here, carry the ring. Have a very slight accent. I now work for a software company and carry all of my visa papers, all in order, for every trip. I always check in with my state-issued driver's license which does not denote my citizenship. I am usually dressed business casual, very clean appearance and travel with my laptop. I am an able male, 25 years old. My full first name is 12 characters.
My father, 60 years old, a diabetic has been harassed for an hour worth of "security" for check-in. His background, he is a retired Air Force 2-star general for Greece, a NATO country. He has held "top secret" NATO clearance and above. He is still harassed for over an hour for an internal flight while he has just flown across the Atlantic into New York 2 days before and has proof of it. He can still disable almost any man with his bare arms.
Why am I writing all this ? Well, I would have no objection what-so-ever to it, none at all, had I not witnessed on 3 different occassions, in two different airports, airport employees complaining about losing their security id cards and just been waved through. On one occassion, when one of the 18-year-old employees was getting a replacement id, to go to the ramp and find a piece of luggage, the other employee that gave it to him just said "What is it, the 3rd one this week ?". Those ids of course could never end up in terrorists' hands.
But hell, just as long as they are full-blooded Americans around the planes, they are safe right ? Should I just mention Oklahoma City here ?
Do I need a lighter or a plastic knife provided to me for food to assault someone on a plane ? No. Does anyone trained in hand-to-hand combat need it ? No. Can a terrorist get a gun on a plane. Sure, all he needs is a damn airport id. The scum that did this back in September, just thought it was too much trouble for something they did not need.
Does anyone believe that the locked-door concept is going to work ? Do not pilots need to take a leak ? These doors cannot be broken into ? Or even simpler, if someone threatens passengers' lives, even starts killing people in the cabin, does anyone think that the pilots will not open the door ?
TNT is playing "Executive Decision". Is it not ironic that there has never been a high-jacking that has had weapons loaded in Athens ? But sure, everyone else's security sucks and is not safe, but the US.
So can everyone stop the BSing and either make flights safe or stop harassing everyone ? I do not mind security checks, I have gone through them for the whole of my life. I was at RheinDahlen when the IRA attacked. Have had a lot of real security checks.
Do not get me wrong. I love this country and living here. If I didn't, I would leave, plain and simple. It is just some of the pretentious BS and ignorance that I cannot stand....
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Boston, MA, USA
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Re: Security a joke....
Nothing to do with knives. It was part of the service cutbacks most airlines went through.
Between Houston and New York, 4 hour flights, I get served pretzels, if I am lucky a cold sandwich, because they cannot provide food that requires knives
