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Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost

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Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost

Old 21st Mar 2014, 22:33
  #7081 (permalink)  
 
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So...

Affects of hypoxia
Investigation: AO-2009-044 - Air system event - Beechcraft King Air C90 aircraft, VH-TAM, 74 km NE of Perth Airport, WA, 16 July 2009

5 hour flight
Investigation: 200003771 - Beech Aircraft Corp 200, VH-SKC
...launching from Perth in a King Air has its risks, eh?

Mods: Feel free to delete (as if you wouldn't...).
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 22:34
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300 ft /min on no engines ? That is about 64:1 glide ratio . . . I'm sure you meant 3000 ft/min.
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 22:36
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The UK Telegraph has a document purporting to be the MAS370 ATC transcript
Weird/non-standard translation? So they claim all communications were in Mandarin? And then there's obvious spelling errors like "Hu (sic) Chi Minh city". Seems a bit weird? It's hard to believe anything the media report...
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 22:38
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Fire

I got curious and did a research on the antenna locations on the B-777. As I imagined, all the comm related antennas are under the "belly" and directly under the forward cargo bay. All the sat comm antennas are, of course, on the top of the fuselage.

Could it be possible that a fire in the front cargo bay destroyed the wiring "traveling" to the lower antennas? The upper antennas continued sending signals to Inmarsat and dense and toxic fumes took over the cabin and cockpit.

If dense smoke takes over the cockpit, it is impossible to fly any airplane. Change course on the FMS with almost no visibility very difficult, low fire but lots of smoke. For how long a crew can resist?

Antennas out?
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 22:43
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Re: Telegraph transcript. According to that the plane climbed 35000ft in 8 minutes, roughly 4300ft/min. A bit extreme?
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 22:44
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Two things I note from the translated twice transcript.

1) 370 call level FL350 at 01:01 and then again at 01:07:55

2) The previous hand off was answered with freq. followed by "Copies that" "copies that" was used to acknowledge instructions 5 times until the hand off to KL RADAR. It wasn't used in response to the climb clearances and it wasn't used in response to the last hand off.


I wonder if the PF changed during the climb or perhaps after the 01 level call. Other pilot not sure if they had called level so made the call again.

Nothing really obvious and because it's a translation of a translation "copie that" may well turn out to be "Roger".
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 22:44
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top of the climb is a bit soon to need a nature break
Are you absolutely 100% sure that is indeed the case for either of the pilots on this flight?
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 22:46
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Weird/non-standard translation? So they claim all communications were in Mandarin?
ENGLISH > MANDARIN > ENGLISH
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 22:47
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"90S" will not take you anywhere as it is not a complete waypoint.

It would have to be in a lat/long format with the " S" first as in S90E127 .
I think I would choose S90E0 if I wanted to go to the pole. A waypoint behind the pole could do as well something like "Tierra del Fuego". If the south pole is chosen, the track must go straight down a meridian. If the flight path was a great circle or a constant heading path should be deductible by the ping arcs (hope that word is not banned yet).
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 22:50
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Mandarin?

Weird/non-standard translation? So they claim all communications were in Mandarin?
I took that to mean English was the spoken language, it was originally written up in Mandarin, and then translated back to English.

No, I don't know why. LiveATC.com actually has a recording of some of the KL ATC freq that night. What little I heard of MAS370 was in English.

No one is going to use the callsign "MH370" on freq (which isn't the flight's actual callsign, anyway). But at least we have times/rough intent of the transmission. Looks completely normal to me, even the second confirmation of climbing to FL350.
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 22:53
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The RAAF P3Cs do not have a air refueling capability.
Given the range at which this search is taking place, with a transit time of approx four hours each way and two hours on station, I wonder how long the current sortie rate can be maintained?
I do not know how many P3 crews they have these days, but what they may lack in numbers is well compensated by their capability. If I was lost they are the people I would want searching for me!
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 23:00
  #7092 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Rob21
I got curious and did a research on the antenna locations on the B-777. As I imagined, all the comm related antennas are under the "belly" and directly under the forward cargo bay. All the sat comm antennas are, of course, on the top of the fuselage.

Could it be possible that a fire in the front cargo bay destroyed the wiring "traveling" to the lower antennas? The upper antennas continued sending signals to Inmarsat and dense and toxic fumes took over the cabin and cockpit.

If dense smoke takes over the cockpit, it is impossible to fly any airplane. Change course on the FMS with almost no visibility very difficult, low fire but lots of smoke. For how long a crew can resist?

Antennas out?
Not all COMMs are on the belly. Some Aircraft have VHF on both the belly and the roof. HF and SATCOM would also be usable. You can use SATCOM to call your girlfriend's cellphone if needed.






Last edited by Lost in Saigon; 21st Mar 2014 at 23:41.
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 23:07
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Originally Posted by DCrefugee
The UK Telegraph has a document purporting to be the MAS370 ATC transcript. Link:

Revealed: the final 54 minutes of communication from MH370 - Telegraph



Last edited by Lost in Saigon; 21st Mar 2014 at 23:25.
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 23:15
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No one is going to use the callsign "MH370" on freq (which isn't the flight's actual callsign, anyway). But at least we have times/rough intent of the transmission. Looks completely normal to me, even the second confirmation of climbing to FL350.
Obviously these were not the actual words used in the transmissions. Normally, all these radio calls would be in English with perhaps a word or two in a local language.

Phrases like 'runway ready, permitted to take off' will never be heard in real world ATC clearances.

If this leaked transcript was the original source of 'all right, good night', I sure wouldn't read too much into it.
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 23:16
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There is no way the aircraft flew for 5 hours or so without the crew doing something.
Hypoxia:
1999 South Dakota Learjet crash - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Learjet continued flying over the southern and midwestern United States for almost four hours and 1,500 miles (2,400 km). The plane ran out of fuel and crashed into a field near Aberdeen, South Dakota after an uncontrolled descent
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 23:16
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With a forward speed of 190kts and an L/D of 20:

Forward speed - 320.6 ft/sec

Vertical speed - 16.0 ft/sec

This is about the structural limit for the landing gear so it wouldn't be conducive for a successful ditching.
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 23:28
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Aqua tone,

As long as needed. They would pull people in from all over aus if qualified and required. It is part of what they train for, they won't want to miss the opportunity to take part.
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 23:35
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There's still this plausible theory that MH370 avoided being noticed by any radars by shadowing SIA68 on its way across India.
"Plausible" only in the sense that, in the absence of any firm evidence to the contrary, pretty well any hypothesis that anyone can dream up can't, strictly speaking, be ruled out.

That would of course also include the "flying for 6 hours with an onboard fire" and "abducted by aliens" scenarios, as well as the above.
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Old 21st Mar 2014, 23:49
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Regarding the possible report of reaching FL450.

This was from Primary radar data readings and estimations.

Today at FL380 our actual GPS ALT was 40,300'
So a 2,300' difference, this I've seen on every flight and can be up to 2,500' difference.

It's therefore reasonable that the 45,000' primary radar altitude above sea level was up to 2,500' above the Aircrafts pressure Altimeter reading of FL425 to 430. Hence the A/C wasn't as high as we think?

Not that it matters much.
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Old 22nd Mar 2014, 00:05
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Please tell me the (alleged) transcript posted above isn't real.
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