FAA Grounds 787s
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By 'Eck!...you are a fussy lot for a mere 116 million USD , you expect perfection? 
Just google "787 price" and you'll find an article in"Forbes" stating that 116 mill. is the going price (a 45% discount off list) Get yours today! whilst stocks last!
the actual build -cost is $ 200 Mill....So, yes! they're literally buying their way into the market-place.
The Forbes article is quite enlightening.
Just google "787 price" and you'll find an article in"Forbes" stating that 116 mill. is the going price (a 45% discount off list) Get yours today! whilst stocks last! the actual build -cost is $ 200 Mill....So, yes! they're literally buying their way into the market-place.The Forbes article is quite enlightening.
One of the two latest incidents above (11 June) has just been translated and reported here: Singapore-bound JAL Dreamliner turns back due to anti-icing system glitch ? Japan Today: Japan News and Discussion
Er... not so fast, the mods have deleted my own splendid translations above. Go with this one, more official then ... 
Edit, the second incident has now been picked up in this article here, but in less detail and accuracy than my translation of yesterday.
ANA Boeing 787 has engine problem before takeoff ? Japan Today: Japan News and Discussion
Edit 2. There were three incidents in the last three days, summarized here:
ANA Dreamliner domestic flight cancelled - Yahoo! Finance UK
Er... not so fast, the mods have deleted my own splendid translations above.
Go with this one, more official then ... Edit, the second incident has now been picked up in this article here, but in less detail and accuracy than my translation of yesterday.
ANA Boeing 787 has engine problem before takeoff ? Japan Today: Japan News and Discussion
Edit 2. There were three incidents in the last three days, summarized here:
ANA Dreamliner domestic flight cancelled - Yahoo! Finance UK
Last edited by jolihokistix; 12th Jun 2013 at 11:33.
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Any good F/E would have said wait.
You never identified the problem!
Same situation will occur again.
Only thing you have done is put a band aid over a bullet hole.
Cheap system to contain when happens again.
Never addressed the real problem or solved anything.
Probaly why they got rid of all F/E.
We knew the system and could cause them many problems.
Hope the pilots there now actually look at this.
You never identified the problem!
Same situation will occur again.
Only thing you have done is put a band aid over a bullet hole.
Cheap system to contain when happens again.
Never addressed the real problem or solved anything.
Probaly why they got rid of all F/E.
We knew the system and could cause them many problems.
Hope the pilots there now actually look at this.
Last edited by Earl; 13th Jun 2013 at 03:13.
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Boeing admitted in April that despite months of testing it did not know the root cause of the problems, but rolled out modifications it said would ensure the issue did not recur.
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Underwriters Laboratories issues new test standards for lithium ion batteries
Probably doesn't apply directly to aircraft, but interesting nonetheless.
Our Lithium-ion Batteries journal covers four key subjects that
demonstrate how UL is working to enhance the safety of lithium-ion
batteries. Fault Tree Analysis is the foundation of how we approach
lithium-ion battery safety — by identifying and understanding the root
causes of failures. We found that one of the leading causes of failure is
an internal short circuit (ISC), so we developed a simple and repeatable
way to induce ISCs. The Indentation Induced ISC test enables us to
study battery behaviors when an ISC occurs. This and related research
has given us insights that we’ve used to update existing standards and
create new ones to address the most recent applications of lithiumion batteries.
Finally, a new area of potential concern, Aging Effects, is
a significant area we are focusing on, given the trend toward longer
battery life and second-use applications for lithium-ion batteries.
http://www.ul.com/global/documents/n...al_Issue_2.pdf
Our Lithium-ion Batteries journal covers four key subjects that
demonstrate how UL is working to enhance the safety of lithium-ion
batteries. Fault Tree Analysis is the foundation of how we approach
lithium-ion battery safety — by identifying and understanding the root
causes of failures. We found that one of the leading causes of failure is
an internal short circuit (ISC), so we developed a simple and repeatable
way to induce ISCs. The Indentation Induced ISC test enables us to
study battery behaviors when an ISC occurs. This and related research
has given us insights that we’ve used to update existing standards and
create new ones to address the most recent applications of lithiumion batteries.
Finally, a new area of potential concern, Aging Effects, is
a significant area we are focusing on, given the trend toward longer
battery life and second-use applications for lithium-ion batteries.
http://www.ul.com/global/documents/n...al_Issue_2.pdf
Last edited by Mark in CA; 13th Jun 2013 at 06:20.
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B787 Battery Problems
Heard rumour from a guy who works for Boeing Company.
The Problem with B787 is NOT Battery itself, but its battery controller (to avoid from overcharging) made by Korean Company LG.
Any info on this???
The Problem with B787 is NOT Battery itself, but its battery controller (to avoid from overcharging) made by Korean Company LG.
Any info on this???
Securaplane
Originally Posted by GEDriver
Any info on this???
Doubtless there are plenty of semiconductor parts inside the box supplied by others, and it could be that LG is a supplier of one deemed a problem--but that does not fit the public statements very well.
Boeing's public statements have included mention of tightened operating parameters implement in the chargers. They have also mentioned changes to the batteries themselves, and to the monitoring and control of their manufacture.
All this is in addition to the more widely discussed containment aspects of the changes.
Does your rumor add any detail as to what the controller is alleged to have been doing wrong?
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787 Battery
This is speculation, not rumor...overcharging the battery could be the problem, meaning the charger is not wellregulated.
One rumor is that a contribyting factor was altitude...hard to imagine that.
Li Ion batteries have been known to overheat, I don'y know if later technologies have eliminated that characteristic.
You have to rely on the engineering guys and the FMEA ( Failure Mode Effects and Analysis ) and testing.
One rumor is that a contribyting factor was altitude...hard to imagine that.
Li Ion batteries have been known to overheat, I don'y know if later technologies have eliminated that characteristic.
You have to rely on the engineering guys and the FMEA ( Failure Mode Effects and Analysis ) and testing.
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overcharging the battery could be the problem, meaning the charger is not wellregulated.
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Boeing 787 Dreamliner diverted due to brakes | News24
Los Angeles - A Boeing 787 Dreamliner jet was forced to make an emergency landing during an internal US flight on Sunday, due to a problem with its brake system, United Airlines said in a statement.
continues.
Los Angeles - A Boeing 787 Dreamliner jet was forced to make an emergency landing during an internal US flight on Sunday, due to a problem with its brake system, United Airlines said in a statement.
continues.
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Am I serious ? You bet'ye !
Bustre....Yeah, I've always considered airborne electrical fires trivial
too!!
Are you serious?
Is every false incident, therefore, of importance to discussions on this website ? Not if everyone were to start reporting them...................this site would run out of space ! False fire warnings occur quite frequently.
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Seems like there is also a prevailing oil pressure issue as well...
Poor United....what is this...4 United 787's in a week?
Edit: just checked...United has 6 787's.
Second United Dreamliner diverted with oil-related problem
"United flight 125 from London's Heathrow airport to Houston diverted to Newark, New Jersey due to a low oil indication, United said in an emailed statement. The airline said the aircraft landed normally and without incident around 2:15 p.m. local time and customers were put on other flights."
Poor United....what is this...4 United 787's in a week?
Edit: just checked...United has 6 787's.
Second United Dreamliner diverted with oil-related problem
"United flight 125 from London's Heathrow airport to Houston diverted to Newark, New Jersey due to a low oil indication, United said in an emailed statement. The airline said the aircraft landed normally and without incident around 2:15 p.m. local time and customers were put on other flights."
Last edited by FlightPathOBN; 24th Jun 2013 at 16:36.
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I suppose one should add the other 787 issues in the last 2 weeks besides United's..
Last week, a Denver to Tokyo flight was diverted because of an oil indicator light. On June 12, an All Nippon Airways Dreamliner flight was canceled when an engine would not start. On the previous day, a Japan Airlines flight to Singapore returned to Tokyo because of a deicing problem.
So deicing, brakes, oil indicator, wont start...
How many flights vs flights with issues?
For me, there is a difference between having certain bugs with a new launch aircraft, and having 50% of the flights diverting due to issues.
Somehow, that is a bit outside of the 10 -6 SMS probablity.
Last week, a Denver to Tokyo flight was diverted because of an oil indicator light. On June 12, an All Nippon Airways Dreamliner flight was canceled when an engine would not start. On the previous day, a Japan Airlines flight to Singapore returned to Tokyo because of a deicing problem.
So deicing, brakes, oil indicator, wont start...
How many flights vs flights with issues?
For me, there is a difference between having certain bugs with a new launch aircraft, and having 50% of the flights diverting due to issues.
Somehow, that is a bit outside of the 10 -6 SMS probablity.
Last edited by FlightPathOBN; 24th Jun 2013 at 22:04.
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Teething Problems?
Gentlemen, don't you think that the 787's problems fade into insignificance when compared to the horrendous uncontained turbine burst of the A380's engine(s)?? Yet that subject seems no longer to be mentioned. How come?
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I believe that the cause of that engine failure has been determined and fixed.
Dont both the A380 and B787 use RR Trent engines?
Dont both the A380 and B787 use RR Trent engines?
Last edited by FlightPathOBN; 27th Jun 2013 at 17:37.
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A380 Engine
True, the incident was 'spectacular' by comparison, but that's where the comparison ends. It was an engine failure, the cause identified and fixed by the engine manufacturer.
It is quite a different thing to have an airframe experience a seeming myriad of disparate systems issues requiring diversion. I won't speculate, but in my mind, as a potential pax, I start thinking overall QC. For damn sure Boeing can't be happy.
It is quite a different thing to have an airframe experience a seeming myriad of disparate systems issues requiring diversion. I won't speculate, but in my mind, as a potential pax, I start thinking overall QC. For damn sure Boeing can't be happy.