AF 447 report out
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: FR
Posts: 477
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The person saying that was the Captain, not the PIC. The captain was resting at the beginning of the trouble. At most, his lack of rest could have impaired his ability when he finally got back to the cockpit.
But, and that's perhaps more important, I don't think the translation is correct, as already posted in the TL thread:
« Cette nuit, j'ai pas assez dormi »
« une heure, c'était pas assez tout ŕ l'heure »
« I didn't sleep enough last night »
« one hour was not enough earlier »
The second part ("one hour") refers to a nap IMO.
The judicial report CVR transcript shows 2" between the 2 sentences, it even write them on 2 separate lines in the transcript.
AZR
AZR, thanks for that point.
Across a translation, there is ample room for doubt inhow one understands that remark.
If one's body clock was a bit off, one's rest might be disturbed.
There are other reasons for not getting a full night's sleep, none of which the Captain's remarks refer to. Nor did he amplify. I don't doubt that in his career, he'd flown a flight or two when his sleep had been interrupted the night before. See CONFiture's point ...
If I go to bed to get six or seven hours of sleep, but on a particular evening toss and turn and get interrupted or poor sleep, versus getting uninterrupted sleep, will I just throw up my hands and not make my take off time?
I doubt it.
Whether or not the Captain was alert, or if he was shaking off the effects of a tired body remains a point of speculation. I don't think we can ever know, unless someone comes up with credible evidence. Sharp or not so sharp, he entered the problem playing a game of catch up. There was a finite window of time where remedy was going to be possible, and in that amount of time he was unable to unravel the knot. The two already in the seats put him in an extremely diffucult position. Not sure how many other captains would have saved it, and others not.
We can speculate all we like, we still won't know.
This isn't a TV script, this is real life. Sometimes even hindsight is partially obscured by clouds.
Across a translation, there is ample room for doubt inhow one understands that remark.
If one's body clock was a bit off, one's rest might be disturbed.
There are other reasons for not getting a full night's sleep, none of which the Captain's remarks refer to. Nor did he amplify. I don't doubt that in his career, he'd flown a flight or two when his sleep had been interrupted the night before. See CONFiture's point ...
If I go to bed to get six or seven hours of sleep, but on a particular evening toss and turn and get interrupted or poor sleep, versus getting uninterrupted sleep, will I just throw up my hands and not make my take off time?
I doubt it.
Whether or not the Captain was alert, or if he was shaking off the effects of a tired body remains a point of speculation. I don't think we can ever know, unless someone comes up with credible evidence. Sharp or not so sharp, he entered the problem playing a game of catch up. There was a finite window of time where remedy was going to be possible, and in that amount of time he was unable to unravel the knot. The two already in the seats put him in an extremely diffucult position. Not sure how many other captains would have saved it, and others not.
We can speculate all we like, we still won't know.
This isn't a TV script, this is real life. Sometimes even hindsight is partially obscured by clouds.
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: canada
Posts: 147
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Rapoport's so called report is total bunk. The crew did not complete the Unreliable Airspeed Dril which is a memory item and instructs the crew to turn off the A/P, F/D and A/T. I wont waste my time with the other nonsense.
People who do not have an ATPL and who do not fly the Airbus should keep their petty thoughts to themselves.
People who do not have an ATPL and who do not fly the Airbus should keep their petty thoughts to themselves.
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Around the World
Age: 74
Posts: 87
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi
Thank you for having specified this.
A nap? why not.
Therefore, beacause both sentences are separated, maybe it is possible to think that « one hour was not enough earlier » made reference to the interval of time to get ready (eyes wide open) between the alarm clock ring and the shuttle departure?
« I didn't sleep enough last night »
« one hour was not enough earlier »
The second part ("one hour") refers to a nap IMO.
The judicial report CVR transcript shows 2" between the 2 sentences, it even write them on 2 separate lines in the transcript.
« one hour was not enough earlier »
The second part ("one hour") refers to a nap IMO.
The judicial report CVR transcript shows 2" between the 2 sentences, it even write them on 2 separate lines in the transcript.
A nap? why not.
Therefore, beacause both sentences are separated, maybe it is possible to think that « one hour was not enough earlier » made reference to the interval of time to get ready (eyes wide open) between the alarm clock ring and the shuttle departure?
We can speculate all we like, we still won't know.
Latest system enhancement to the BUSS is that FPV is available when BUSS is active.
To echo what CONF said, A33Zab's posts are very informative, as usual.
This isn't a TV script, this is real life.
Last edited by OK465; 19th Mar 2013 at 21:57. Reason: grammar
60 minutes story
David Learmount interviewed by 60 minutes, aired Sunday 12th May.
In three parts.
Flight 447: The air safety investigation
In three parts.
Flight 447: The air safety investigation
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: fl
Posts: 2,525
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I concur, not available to Americans because Airbus, Air France and the pitot tube manufacturers have decided they are not at fault and Americans will dispute it. I am sure it is a totally unbiased report, don't you?
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Lower Skunk Cabbageland, WA
Age: 74
Posts: 354
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well, heck, there are plenty of licensing reasons why we often can't watch content from other countries (am I right, Canada?), and MSNBC has undergone a lot of contractual changes recently, with NBC divorcing from Micro$oft. So, I really doubt that it's a content issue. 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: NNW of Antipodes
Age: 81
Posts: 1,330
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So, I really doubt that it's a content issue.
I'm sure that Channel 9 Australia have plans to sell to other networks, so why not protect distribution on the web.
All 3 parts are viewable via the web in Australia and New Zealand.
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Sydney
Posts: 39
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The video is not available at the moment, don't know why.
Flight 447: The air safety investigation
I watched it live in Sydney on the free to air 9 network last night.
It was pretty useless. Nothing new at all. Don't loose any sleep over it.
Flight 447: The air safety investigation
I watched it live in Sydney on the free to air 9 network last night.
It was pretty useless. Nothing new at all. Don't loose any sleep over it.
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 704
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I watched it live in Sydney on the free to air 9 network last night.
It was pretty useless. Nothing new at all. Don't loose any sleep over it.
It was pretty useless. Nothing new at all. Don't loose any sleep over it.
It also brought home to me that in the middle of the pitch black night in the middle of nowhere you are absolutely reliant on your instruments, and why did none of them notice the pitch-up attitude on the AH and do what any student air cadet glider pilot should have done instinctively, i.e. lower the nose?
The fact neither pilot could see the other pilot's sidestick position is also a huge concern. I won't revisit the customary "wouldn't happen on a non FBW brand of aircraft" discussion but it would perhaps have helped had PNF been able to discern the PF stick input.
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Not far from a big Lake
Age: 82
Posts: 1,454
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It also brought home to me that in the middle of the pitch black night in the middle of nowhere you are absolutely reliant on your instruments, and why did none of them notice the pitch-up attitude on the AH and do what any student air cadet glider pilot should have done instinctively, i.e. lower the nose?
Until you are sitting in the seat under identical conditions, you do not know how well you would have handled the sensory overload. There are load shedding strategies for handling sensory overload, but they need to be trained and developed.
Has training improved that much in the intervening almost 4 years that everyone feels they could handle that scenario should it happen to them?
For those who cant see the You Tube, try installing hola.org which should by pass content restrictions. I saw the 60 Minutes and they crucified the PF but there was little mention of Airbus design issues. Just a brief mention that the other 2 pilots couldnt see PF side stick movements and the stall warning eventually stopped when attitude became unbelievable. No mention of the THS being on or close to its backstop position or lack of AoA instrumentation.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: fl
Posts: 2,525
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
And guess what was causing the roll , the PF, so why not just pull up because the airbus can't stall in normal law so that is why you don't need experienced pilots to fly an airbus. Only this time it slipped into a law that had no stall protection so everybody died. This is the future so get used to it. Hopefully it won't reach the USA.