United pilot arrested at LHR
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Zurich, Switzerland
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Good CRM doesn't stop after work.
When hanging out together, all my colleagues stopped drinking quietly 9-10h before next duty time. This was never an issue. For Cabin and Flightdeck this was obvious and never a hassle and handled as a team.
On long trips, it happened that young FOs had a hard start after partying out, but always performed well during the short trips and where wise enough to avoid that for the long return trips.
When hanging out together, all my colleagues stopped drinking quietly 9-10h before next duty time. This was never an issue. For Cabin and Flightdeck this was obvious and never a hassle and handled as a team.
On long trips, it happened that young FOs had a hard start after partying out, but always performed well during the short trips and where wise enough to avoid that for the long return trips.
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: God's Country
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Albert Salmon
Did you speak to the boozy breathed Captain first? You may have cost a man his lively hood for nothing. I am currently on the Atkins Diet and when you enter a stage known as Ketosis (your body is flushing out large amounts of toxins) your breath stinks of alcohol, quite sweet, similar to nail varnish remover but alcohol none the less. I have not consumed alcohol for over 60 days, yet my breath currently smells of alcohol. It will cease within 15-30 mins of me taking carbohydrates. People can enter this unawares if they do not consume enough carbs over 48 hrs. So a few days away eating bacon and eggs for breakfast, salads at lunchtime, and a nice big steak and salad in the evening washed down with water, tea no suger, red wine or a few scotch and waters will see you in Ketosis within 48-60 hrs, with your breath smelling of .....alcohol!
Not speaking with the crewmember concerned was wrong of you and reporting him in such a manner was quite awful. I imagine you felt quite clever but to be honest you became judge and jury and maybe you ruined his life for no reason at all.
Gentleman Jim
Many years ago - in the early 1970's, to be more precise - I was an operations agent for TWA at Ben-Gurion Airport, Tel Aviv.
I was briefing a flight crew early one morning when I detected a strong smell of alcohol on a captain's breath. I consulted the station manager (the late, great, Louis Fogiel), who sent a TTY message to the Rome despatcher's office.
The boozy-breathed aviator was summarily suspended from duty and a check captain, due to take a later flight out, was hastily roused from his bed to take his place.
We never saw the offending pilot again in TLVKO.
I was briefing a flight crew early one morning when I detected a strong smell of alcohol on a captain's breath. I consulted the station manager (the late, great, Louis Fogiel), who sent a TTY message to the Rome despatcher's office.
The boozy-breathed aviator was summarily suspended from duty and a check captain, due to take a later flight out, was hastily roused from his bed to take his place.
We never saw the offending pilot again in TLVKO.
Not speaking with the crewmember concerned was wrong of you and reporting him in such a manner was quite awful. I imagine you felt quite clever but to be honest you became judge and jury and maybe you ruined his life for no reason at all.
Gentleman Jim
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: U.K.
Age: 68
Posts: 380
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Alcohol v's neurotoxins.....
How come it is so easy to throw the Rule book against a pilot who is over the alcohol limit and yet that same pilot is "allowed" to have unlimited amounts of neurotoxins in their blood / fat and actually feel intoxicated?
Viewing this short clip might help to explain how many aircrew often feel intoxicated - whilst not having any alcohol in them.
Sunday Night Videos - Yahoo!7 TV
Please someone explain the difference...
DB
Viewing this short clip might help to explain how many aircrew often feel intoxicated - whilst not having any alcohol in them.
Sunday Night Videos - Yahoo!7 TV
Please someone explain the difference...
DB
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: God's Country
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Atkins diet / ketosis makes the breath smell of ketones (pear drops, nail varnish remover), not alcoho
They would be esters
Suraci
Pass a bottle of Nail Varnish remover under somebody's nose and they will tell you it contains alcohol, I think you really do get the point don't you..
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Manchester
Age: 45
Posts: 615
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Pass a bottle of Nail Varnish remover under somebody's nose and they will tell you it contains alcohol, I think you really do get the point don't you..
I very much doubt 99.99% of the population could tell the difference between etyhl alcohol and acetone. The remainder have Chemistry degrees !
The chance of the chimps at security knowing the difference is the square root of
all
The Reverend
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Sydney,NSW,Australia
Posts: 2,020
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sunday Night Videos - Yahoo!7TV
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Cornwall-on-Hudson, New York
Posts: 875
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"Pass a bottle of Nail Varnish remover under somebody's nose and they will tell you it contains alcohol, I think you really do get the point don't you.."
Just went up and took a good sniff of my wife's nail-polish remover. Anybody who would "tell you it contains alcohol" would probably say the same of a can of gasoline, a squirt of starter-fluid ether, a drum of kerosene or a bucket of tar. It smells no more like alcohol than do any of them. Try it.
Just went up and took a good sniff of my wife's nail-polish remover. Anybody who would "tell you it contains alcohol" would probably say the same of a can of gasoline, a squirt of starter-fluid ether, a drum of kerosene or a bucket of tar. It smells no more like alcohol than do any of them. Try it.
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Zummerset
Posts: 137
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I doubt anyone would lose their livelyhood because they were reported for having a breath smelling of ketones or esters.
If they WERE reported, the individual would have the chance of a blood test and I am certain they would be proved innocent.
After all, if ketosis was building up alcohol in the blood, all airlines would ban the Atkins diet for all operating staff.
You are either over the alcohol limit or not!
If they WERE reported, the individual would have the chance of a blood test and I am certain they would be proved innocent.
After all, if ketosis was building up alcohol in the blood, all airlines would ban the Atkins diet for all operating staff.
You are either over the alcohol limit or not!
Trouble is Stop Stop Stop.
It takes a few days to get the blood test result and you are suspended during that time. The flight you were about to do gets Cancelled or at least delayed + the knock on etc.,
Trouble is the breath analyser will register on ketones & as the alcohol limit for crew is so low the police usually defer to the blood test anyway, it can really ruin your day/week.
Personally as this type of reporting "Could" be used in spite I believe that as such a report would be against an airman's professionalism the accused should be able to sue for slander. (assuming alcohol reading below limit)
Before I get flamed, remember the Manchester Police breath tested a crew for doing a Couple of Go-Arounds. So stupidity reigns OK.
It takes a few days to get the blood test result and you are suspended during that time. The flight you were about to do gets Cancelled or at least delayed + the knock on etc.,
Trouble is the breath analyser will register on ketones & as the alcohol limit for crew is so low the police usually defer to the blood test anyway, it can really ruin your day/week.
Personally as this type of reporting "Could" be used in spite I believe that as such a report would be against an airman's professionalism the accused should be able to sue for slander. (assuming alcohol reading below limit)
Before I get flamed, remember the Manchester Police breath tested a crew for doing a Couple of Go-Arounds. So stupidity reigns OK.
Before I get flamed, remember the Manchester Police breath tested a crew for doing a Couple of Go-Arounds. So stupidity reigns OK
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Surrey (actually)
Posts: 248
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Here's a link to the thread
I'm sure there are references in there somewhere, if you want to trawl through it.
I'm sure there are references in there somewhere, if you want to trawl through it.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Esher, Surrey
Posts: 466
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Ft Lauderdale FL USA
Posts: 46
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"When you arrived to take control of this flight for Atlantic Airlines to Chicago the air crew noticed alcohol on your breath and were disturbed enough to report the matter to airport authorities
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Rockytop, Tennessee, USA
Posts: 5,898
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
As I speculated earlier in the thread:
Captain Washington's lawyer commented to the Court on the light sentences meted out in similar cases of U.S. pilots over the alcohol limit:
Erwin Vermont Washington Pleads Guilty To Being Drunk While Trying To Fly United Plane
What exactly does the 'ten-month sentence suspended for two years' mean?
The last UAL guy at LHR did OK in crown court after producing character witnesses, maybe this one will also walk with a suspended sentence on the criminal charges
Referring to similar cases, Humphreys said an American Airlines pilot who recorded a reading of 39 milligrams of alcohol was given a fine last July, Another pilot who had 60 milligrams of alcohol in 100 milliliters of blood was given a suspended sentence.
What exactly does the 'ten-month sentence suspended for two years' mean?
Just a numbered other
It means it is a sentence of ten months in jail, which won't be enforced if he remains a good boy for two years.
I am still amazed that he can be reported to have pleaded guilty to being drunk. Hewas not. He was perfectly lagally allowed to drive a car after all.
He surely pleaded guilty to being over the limit to fly. Drunk, he most certainly was not.
I am still amazed that he can be reported to have pleaded guilty to being drunk. Hewas not. He was perfectly lagally allowed to drive a car after all.
He surely pleaded guilty to being over the limit to fly. Drunk, he most certainly was not.
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Colorado
Age: 74
Posts: 48
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
What exactly does the 'ten-month sentence suspended for two years' mean?