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STN Security declares war on pilots

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STN Security declares war on pilots

Old 10th Dec 2008, 11:09
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F14
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STN Security declares war on pilots

Stansted Airport requires all crews operating or positioning through STN to hold a full Stansted Airside ID, by 1/1/09 !!!

Up to now, procedures have been in force(I wouldn't want to give details) to allow crews to position or operate via STN.

Maybe this is BAA's kneejerk reaction to the events of this week by the anarchist direct action group "Plane Stupid"?

Will this ground the STN armarda?

Will the commuters look for employment elsewhere?
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 11:15
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What ID do they use at the moment?
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 11:17
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Escorted I believe.
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 11:20
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I presume that a NOTAM will be issued to the effect that Stansted can no longer be promulgated as a diversion airfield. If this is enforced in any meaningful way, it should result a significant traffic reduction.
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 11:28
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Glad the idiots in security are getting their priorities right....mass invasion of their airport by protesters, pretty serious breach of security issue. Meanwhile the harrasment of flight crews and the removal of explosive water, toothpaste etc continues.
Not surprised this country is in such a state.
'Lions lead by Donkeys' springs to mind, though less Lions these days!
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 11:39
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I have heard that BAA at LHR are doing the same - used to be able to get through say on a Leeds pass with another form of ID. Apparently now you need a LHR BAA pass.

Even though we have just flown over london loaded with fuel into heathrow we cant get in the building incase we are a "risk"

Utter madness. Appears the Dft or CAA cant give a monkeys. Security gropes first thing in the morning are worse than traffic wardens.

Arent Ryanair looking to buy STD? I hope so then O'Leary can sack all these numpteys who ruin people's day in security.
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 11:52
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Pax still get on the aircraft with knives (6 inch metal and also a full size bread knife). The first item was found by the cabin crew on a turnround and the second was being used by a little old lady to cut her sandwiches.

Security is necessary. Unfortunately they also hold all the cards. Until this changes then the deliberate disruption to free passage of crew will continue.

Measures are also not equal. At SOU (BAA) you can't take an empty bottle that can contain more than 100ml. At STN (BAA) you can.

Once at SOU I left the aircraft at stand 13 (technically not airside) and has to use the security point by the tower. The numpty watched the entire crew approac him from the aircraft, each of us carrying bottles of water brought from the aircraft. As soon as we tried to go back through the security point (5ft from where we came in) we got "you can't take those bottles/more than my jobs worth" etc.

Vive la revolution !!!
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 11:57
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It would appear that the clamp down is on Pilots with no Airside ID of any discription. It has been possible to get airside with a Licence and Passport. From 01/01/09 you will require a full airside pass - even if it is from LGW.
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 12:16
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It has been possible to get airside with a Licence and Passport. From 01/01/09 you will require a full airside pass - even if it is from LGW.
Im in executive aviation. Does that mean they want me to obtain an BAA airside pass? For every airport I fly to?
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 12:29
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What about pilots who have an overnight in Stn or LHR? They can not leave the next day? because they will be held by security?
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 12:47
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It sounds like they are just doing what the other BAA airports do.

I presume after the protest thing they have had the DFT all over them.


1. If you have a license and passport you have got huge problems.

2. If you have a none BAA pass you have problems but eventually someone will see sense and allow a local passholder to escort you.

3. You have a BAA pass but not a local one. After 10mins of them trying to swipe it they will either let you through unescorted or as per 2.

4. Local BAA pass you should get through unescorted.

But for 2 and 3 be prepared to produce your driving license, birth certificate (I kid you not at BHX), License, passport. But be prepared for the rules to change over night or even by shift change. You can work happly for a couple of days with no hassels to hit a brick wall on the third day.

Executive aviation will use the normal security for their classification of the apron I think we can leave it at that.

I just wish they would have a country wide central pass issue office and aircrew and engineers get issued a pass centrally which is not linked to a company or an airport.

1. Isn't a problem if you fly on anything other than G reg and pretend you don't understand a word security are saying. Or maybe the thought of 300 none english speakers loose in the terminal blocking up the departure lounges not spending any money allows other rules to be used. ie a member of security escorts the 15+ crew to thier aircraft.

Last edited by mad_jock; 10th Dec 2008 at 13:01.
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 13:31
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It really is time to take a stand against this bureaucratic nonsense - I hope BALPA gets involved with this.

Why o why cannot there me a EUROPEAN crew ID card which could be used at ANY airport in the EEC. What's the point of the European Community if we have to have a different ID for each airport? And who pays for this nonsense? Well of course WE do!

I don't think they'd get away with this in Greece! Time for a revolution I think!

Also the illegality and irresponsibility of the "protesters" at STN doesn't seem to have had any coverage in the media which I read.

As I often say if aliens landed from outer space they would not believe how things are organised now!
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 13:40
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Isn't amazing that your passport is accepted as ID anywhere you go (in the world), yet an airport ID is only fully acceptable at the base where it was issued.
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 13:54
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Just play the game. It will be getting increasingly harder to get airside at any other base other than your own over the next year. More and more hoops to jump through. We will protest and Ms Smith will say, I know, how about the national ID card? Just produce that and your permanent base pass and away you go!
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 14:23
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I agree Fernytickles!

It's utter madness and it needs to be stopped ... now!

Can we start a petition (I know something or other was done recently), but we need to keep pestering the idiots that run the UK.
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 14:43
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Minor thread drift but along the same lines. (Mods move if you want)
For interest we take our aircraft (Biz Jet) to a maintenance company in Germany, Nuremburg. We have been informed that EU regulations will require an Airport issued Pass if the crew visit more than 5 times a year -- but going in and out of the Hangar even for lunch counts as one visit! On-Line training course followed by a verbal talk plus a "Letter of Good Behavour" i.e. a Criminal record check from the UK police. All to get to your own A/C, unescorted, during an inspection. We are assuming this will only be valid for the one airport. We'll see what happens!
M.E.
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 14:58
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Smile

Go with the flow, but make sure that your company allows enough time for you and your crew to do battle with these knobheads. Personally I can't stand the scum who "do security" at airports and I will neither speak nor help them in any way whatsoever. Also, to do battle with them on their own terms is doomed to failure. Instead, fight them on their your terms. If the aircraft is blocking a stand, so be it. If this results in a late departure, tell your company (and the pax) the reasons why. Especially is you are being charged parking by the airport. I'll not be rushed into moving before we are ready and if that is inconvenient to the airport, then so be it. Also, remember, you mustn't let these people on your plane - for security reasons, obviously! It's nice denying them access.

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Old 10th Dec 2008, 15:00
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But what has it to do with Ryanair? It must be a major inconvenience for the pilots but RYR itself? And judging on the reactions, everyone is affected (not familiar with the situation).

Last edited by golfyankeesierra; 10th Dec 2008 at 15:10.
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 15:08
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trouble with my "r"s again

that EU regulations will require an Airport issued Pass if the crew visit more than 5 times a year
Is most unlikely to be enforced. This will entail every airport noting the names of every single person without a local pass passing through their security gates, each way. This will have to be done to deny access to those who have passed by too many times. Or, we'll all have to get local passes for every airport. I'd have to carry twenty or thirty passes as a minimum. Mmmmm.... A regulation truly worthy of the pondlife that deals with security, but not even they would be able to get away with this one.

PM

Last edited by Piltdown Man; 10th Dec 2008 at 16:37.
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Old 10th Dec 2008, 15:17
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Best of luck for all you lucky holders of landside passes now then, there are people at STN who have waited 6+ months before getting theirs, and some have simply given up along the way.

The UK, boy am i glad I don't have to live there.
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