FAA proposes 40-48 hour rest after 'ultra-long-range flights'
Join Date: Nov 2007
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Neither CAP nor FAR regs seriously take into account the kind of ULH ops that now take place. We need a new, IATA prescribed FTL scheme that is valid for a modern long haul operation that takes actual fatigue studies from among all of us to come up with something sensible.
Join Date: Jun 2001
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My longest flight to date is a bit over 14 hours. Thats LAX to Korea somewhere. Going west bound for me is no big deal, but going eastbound kicks my arse! Going from the east coast of the USA to Europe realy kicks my arse!!! Going a few more time zones east from europe DOESN'T kick my arse so bad. Go figure.
"Experts" say that it takes one day per time zone change, to acclimate properly. Clearly that is not a practical solution.
Some folks are ready after 16 hours, some need 36 hours. Everyone is different and there cannot be a solution for everyone.Whats good for one will not be good for the other guy. I really don't think there is a practical solution to this problem, except for, if its kicks your ass too much,find another job. Most of my flying is long haul. I have gotten used to it. When I was a classic skipper, I encouraged the other crew members to nap!. Now on the -400, I insist guys get naps. Thats what the bunks are for. I actualy feel rather good after a 12 hour trip if can get 3 or 4 hours of sleep enroute. It cuts down on the recuperation time once at the destination.
Does anyone have any practical solutions?? I'm all ears!
"Experts" say that it takes one day per time zone change, to acclimate properly. Clearly that is not a practical solution.
Some folks are ready after 16 hours, some need 36 hours. Everyone is different and there cannot be a solution for everyone.Whats good for one will not be good for the other guy. I really don't think there is a practical solution to this problem, except for, if its kicks your ass too much,find another job. Most of my flying is long haul. I have gotten used to it. When I was a classic skipper, I encouraged the other crew members to nap!. Now on the -400, I insist guys get naps. Thats what the bunks are for. I actualy feel rather good after a 12 hour trip if can get 3 or 4 hours of sleep enroute. It cuts down on the recuperation time once at the destination.
Does anyone have any practical solutions?? I'm all ears!
Neither CAP nor FAR regs seriously take into account the kind of ULH ops that now take place. We need a new, IATA prescribed FTL scheme that is valid for a modern long haul operation that takes actual fatigue studies from among all of us to come up with something sensible.
Any FTL by these groups would be worse than what we´ve recently got here courtesy of EASA. And that one is no good.
Join Date: Apr 2006
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Have done trips to IAH and LAX in the last few weeks. Both outbound legs 16 hours +.
I did the same oprating schedule , Aug out op back.
The LAX flight took 5 days to recover from whilst the IAH only 3.
The problem of proper rest and recovery is not helped by rostering rules that have little or no relevance to the job in hand.
Unfortunately the rostering rules seem to be constructed in isolation and thus look fine on paper but when applied together as a roster it turns into a dogs dinner.
Certainly here in the ME it appears a significant number of rules are just spiteful under the impression that we all go on holiday when we are away.
Ah well
I did the same oprating schedule , Aug out op back.
The LAX flight took 5 days to recover from whilst the IAH only 3.
The problem of proper rest and recovery is not helped by rostering rules that have little or no relevance to the job in hand.
Unfortunately the rostering rules seem to be constructed in isolation and thus look fine on paper but when applied together as a roster it turns into a dogs dinner.
Certainly here in the ME it appears a significant number of rules are just spiteful under the impression that we all go on holiday when we are away.
Ah well
Join Date: Mar 2000
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Does anyone have any practical solutions?? I'm all ears!
All this ultra long haul complaining is a lot of crap, plain and simple.
Why?
Simply because, on these flights, proper rest facilities (IE: horizontal dozing for dollars) are provided, quite unlike the 12 hour sectors I do, single crew.
Don't like these ULH flights?
Find another job.
Todays pilots are simply whimps, that simply can't keep up the pace.
Harry Truman was right...can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen.
IE: when you knocked on the HR door, you asked for work.
So, do your job, and stop complaining like school children.
EOM
Join Date: Apr 2006
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411A
By your own admission you have done no true ULR flying and as an un-informed opinion carries no weight your opinion is well weightless.
By your post count you should also maybe get out more mate?
By your own admission you have done no true ULR flying and as an un-informed opinion carries no weight your opinion is well weightless
.By your post count you should also maybe get out more mate?
Join Date: Oct 2004
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ULH
I, for one that has been flying the Ultras for the last 6 years, am against 48 hour layovers. I can get it done and feel good after in 24 to 36. The longer the layover the more bored (and unrested) you become especially if you have been there many times. Not much to do anywhere if your up all night.
The FAA and the companies really miss the boat on this one. If they wanted to make sure we were rested they would put us in proper hotels, make sure the flight attendants didn't crash galley carts around or slamming the crew phone down that is connected to the bunk and slam doors (including the flight deck) around our bunk area constantly waking us up.
THEY CANT REGULATE THIS TYPE OF SLEEP. ITS UP TO THE PILOT AND WE ARE ALL DIFFERENT.
The FAA and the companies really miss the boat on this one. If they wanted to make sure we were rested they would put us in proper hotels, make sure the flight attendants didn't crash galley carts around or slamming the crew phone down that is connected to the bunk and slam doors (including the flight deck) around our bunk area constantly waking us up.
THEY CANT REGULATE THIS TYPE OF SLEEP. ITS UP TO THE PILOT AND WE ARE ALL DIFFERENT.
