Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Flight Deck Forums > Rumours & News
Reload this Page >

Air Dolomiti ATR catches fire in Munich (25 Aug 2008)

Rumours & News Reporting Points that may affect our jobs or lives as professional pilots. Also, items that may be of interest to professional pilots.

Air Dolomiti ATR catches fire in Munich (25 Aug 2008)

Old 25th Aug 2008, 23:20
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Dublin
Posts: 840
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 2 Posts
Air Dolomiti ATR catches fire in Munich (25 Aug 2008)

Looks like a wheel/brake fire. Serious, but hardly the "Blazing" claimed in the headline.

BBC NEWS | Europe | Blazing plane at Munich Airport

JAS
Just a spotter is offline  
Old 25th Aug 2008, 23:26
  #2 (permalink)  
F4F
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: on the Blue Planet
Posts: 255
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Indeed...
And thanks to the fire brigade someone finally herds the loose passengers

live 2 fly 2 live
F4F is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 01:17
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Abu Dhabi
Posts: 294
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Yikes, I get one of those all the time between Genoa and Munich!!

Looks a bit more than "1 or 2 seconds" too.
dubh12000 is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 01:46
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Florida
Posts: 4,569
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
A Munich airport spokesman said the plane's left carriage briefly caught fire and was put out within two seconds
Damm the camera must have been taking super slow motion pictures according what I timed for the fire. It's a good thing they evacuated because that fire looked serious. I assume that it was probably fed by Hydraulic fluid?:
lomapaseo is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 02:12
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Herts, UK
Posts: 748
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
And thanks to the fire brigade someone finally herds the loose passengers
Indeed, well spotted... quick on his feet wasn't he, ex-shepherd or centre forward for Bayern Munich?

... put out within two-seconds of the foam cannon being turned on it, I think they meant
HarryMann is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 02:21
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: merseyside
Posts: 81
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
BBC Report ? 2 seconds = 60 seconds ?

BBC NEWS - A Munich airport spokesman said the plane's left carriage briefly caught fire and was put out within two seconds.

Has the BBC gone crazy putting quotes on their website which are so blatantly incorrect - the video loaded of the fire clearly shows it is a full 60 seconds before the fire truck arrives and it must have been the longest 60 seconds of those passengers lives .

Any fire on any aircraft is serious whether on the ground or in the air and the video tho hazy looks scary as hell .

I for one would not want to be on that aircraft .

especially after the events of this week .

commendations to all for exemplary evacuation .
dicksorchard is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 06:38
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 3,218
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Hardly an exemplary egress, with passengers exiting the airplane then walking back toward the fire, wondering around the airplane, migrating everywhere. No organization, no control. Longest minute of their lives? Nobody looks that concerned...certainly not enough to use common sense to move away. More interested in gawking at the fire.

Then of course the trucks staging aft of the aircraft and firing the cannons through the egressing passengers...who didn't finish egressing and can be seen after the stream stops and the fire is knocked down.

All's well that ends well, but that egress was a mess.
SNS3Guppy is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 07:37
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Europe
Posts: 627
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
60 longest seconds

The regulation for Fire Service at the Airfield requires the Fire-Engine on the spot within 90 seconds after "ringing" the bell. 60 seconds where indeed long for those in and around the Plane but well within set time frames. Every second count in such a event and it shows again that the volume and amount of carry on luggage should be duly more enforced. I remember some PAX to and from Dheli or Mumbai are housemoving when they bord the plane. Do they think we fly beyond the Moon to the Mars?

Well done by the Fire-Fighters in MUC.... just something for the future for all Airport Operators: Would it not be appropriate to "Alarm" some Coaches/Buses together with the Fire-Engines to colect the loose PAX when a Evacuation is notyfied by the Crew to the Tower. Not every Airport has a Cowboy or Shepard available to round up the crauwd / Krauts ??

Fly safe and land happy

NG
B737NG is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 07:55
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Dubai - sand land.
Age: 54
Posts: 2,832
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Guppy - of course it's a mess... We're talking about ordinary people who would be untrained to deal with and react to emergency situations.. The crew would still be onboard evacuating (not egressing) the aircraft so would not be herding the pax outside.
Are you now saying that every airport should have 'evacuation personnel' waiting at the sides of the taxiways and runways just in case an aircraft needs evacuating??
Looks like the evacuation went quite smoothly - no-one broke their ankle going out of the forward exit (common with those doors), and everyone was out quickly.
White Knight is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 07:56
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: On the Climb
Age: 55
Posts: 73
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Technically speaking, from the initial application of foam from the monitor, the fire was put out within seconds. It was the response which took 60 seconds or so. Maybe BBC/spokesman got mixed up somewhere along the line???

Re pax evacuation, CAA theme item for RFFS audits this year was passenger correlling. Do all airlines have an SOP in place for this event?
grundyhead is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 08:04
  #11 (permalink)  

Freight God
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: LS-R54A
Posts: 307
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I am sure that the airlines have an SOP for that event, but I have serious doubts about the passengers having one...

You cannot be inside and out of the aircraft in the same time, as already noted...
Hunter58 is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 08:29
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: London Whipsnade Wildlife Park
Posts: 5,034
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I assume both the port and starboard main undercarriage were alight? If not, why were the passengers allowed to exit the aircraft on the port side toward the fire?
Buster the Bear is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 08:47
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: right here
Posts: 342
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
i don't think there's an indication in the cockpit telling you WHICH of your wheels if on fire..... and the doors have sufficient spacing to the wheel well. if you get an engine fire on a twin jet you don't use the overwing on that side, but you still use the front and aft doors.
FCS Explorer is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 08:55
  #14 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Germany
Age: 54
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
It looks like there was smoke rising from both sides of the aircraft... which obviously doesn't prove that the fire was on both sides of the undercarriage...

About one minute into the video, you see that the starboard emergency exits have been opened, but with the camera shake I can't tell if anyone goes out of those... I am a little surprised to be honest that those two other emergency exits weren't opened quicker...

Passengers not paying attention to the safety instructions again?

It is also worth noting how little common sense obviously many people have, standing around close in and gaffing...

You see the crew exiting right at the end, in fact one of the pilots at least you see still in the plane at the end of the clip... It certainly looks like a well performed egress in general, just the issue with the other two exits and the passengers wandering around outside...

A lot of people had their hand luggage with them as well...

Andrew

Last edited by alehead; 26th Aug 2008 at 10:00.
alehead is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 09:02
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 3,218
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Guppy - of course it's a mess... We're talking about ordinary people who would be untrained to deal with and react to emergency situations.. The crew would still be onboard evacuating (not egressing) the aircraft so would not be herding the pax outside.
A good technique is assigning the first few out the door to assist others and giving them a clear leadership command and a single direction to run or walk from the airplane...and a clear command not to come back.

Getting one attendant or crew to the outside to manage the egress is a common and proper technique. Our emergency procedures assign certain crewmembers to do this; we don't assume that everyone will simply move away in an orderly fashion once outside.

Passengers turning and wandering back not only to the airplane, but sauntering up to the fire...something's not right there at all.
SNS3Guppy is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 10:15
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: France
Age: 73
Posts: 228
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I assume both the port and starboard main undercarriage were alight? If not, why were the passengers allowed to exit the aircraft on the port side toward the fire?
Main reason, there is no starboard door
Baron rouge is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 10:17
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: La Belle Province
Posts: 2,179
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by SNS3Guppy
A good technique is assigning the first few out the door to assist others and giving them a clear leadership command and a single direction to run or walk from the airplane...and a clear command not to come back.

Getting one attendant or crew to the outside to manage the egress is a common and proper technique. Our emergency procedures assign certain crewmembers to do this; we don't assume that everyone will simply move away in an orderly fashion once outside.

Passengers turning and wandering back not only to the airplane, but sauntering up to the fire...something's not right there at all.
While not disagreeing it's a good idea if practical, I wonder if a small TP has the luxury of being able to do this. I presume there may only have been three total crew onboard - two in the cockpit, presumably trying to manage the comms etc as well as shut down the a/c, and one FA trying to get the unruly herd out of the a/c. Had he/she exited and tried to round up the lost sheep, given how they reacted outside, I'm not convinced they would have got out in a decent fashion. At least once they're outside they may be getting in the way at first, but if there's a bloody great bang at some stage they can start running.
Mad (Flt) Scientist is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 10:54
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: In my head
Posts: 694
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Interesting - to this point in the thread I see no instance of the word tyre or tire in the milling around so far. Closest alluding to perhaps the most immediate hazard depicted in the video was Guppy's 'somethings not right there at all', and MFS's 'bloody great bang'.

So shall we say something about hot wheels and tyres? Burning or not - stay well away because it's not blazing and burns that will kill you when they go bang.
slip and turn is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 10:58
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Germany
Age: 54
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Hey Baron,

There may be no door but there are two emergency exits on the starboard side of the ATR...

Check out this...

Andrew
alehead is offline  
Old 26th Aug 2008, 11:08
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Germany
Age: 54
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
In response to Mad (Flt) Scientist
The FAs on Air Dolomiti wear a turquoise uniform, similar to the colour of the logo...

The reason I mention that is that you can clearly see two of them at the end of the video towards the front emergency exit... there were at least two FAs on board...

I do not know what the required ratio of FAs to passengers is, but the Air Dolomiti's ATR72s are configured for 64 passengers according to their website... Am I correct in thinking that one FA does not meet the safety requirements?

Andrew
alehead is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.