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Lufthansa Hamburg

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Lufthansa Hamburg

Old 22nd Apr 2008, 18:53
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Lufthansa Hamburg

Somebody told me yesterday the captain involved in the near crash in Hamburg a few weeks back, was sacked.
Can anyone confirm ?
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Old 22nd Apr 2008, 19:01
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If so, do you feel any better?
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Old 22nd Apr 2008, 19:30
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Feel any better? What kind of question is that?
For all of us it would mean that the certain rules have been broken although all the massmedia and Lufthansa PR were saying all around that it was a masterpiece of flying skills and/or airmanship...
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Old 22nd Apr 2008, 19:40
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But at what point do you reject the landing?, that is why they pay the big bucks for four gold rings on your jacket. IMHO should have never even tried, Bremen was a good alternate that day and would probably saved a wing tip scrape.
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Old 22nd Apr 2008, 19:53
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Originally Posted by Me Myself
Somebody told me yesterday the captain involved in the near crash in Hamburg a few weeks back, was sacked.
Can anyone confirm ?
I seriously doubt it.
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Old 22nd Apr 2008, 20:27
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Somebody told me yesterday the captain involved in the near crash in Hamburg a few weeks back, was sacked.
Anyone who calls that a 'near crash' is talking out of their a** and I'd ignore anything else they said.
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Old 22nd Apr 2008, 21:12
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IMHO should have never even tried, Bremen was a good alternate that day and would probably saved a wing tip scrape.
For all what I recall EDDW/BRE was closed due to the storm. This does not rpt not mean that he should have aborted EDDH/HAM - I simply wasn't there and therefore refuse to judge whether his decision to try EDDH was right or wrong.
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Old 23rd Apr 2008, 08:12
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Folks

Spare me all the speculations about what the bloke should or shouldn't have done. It's been discussed here at lentgh.
All I'm interested in is wether the guy got the sack or not. A german friend told me he had been and I just want to find out wether it's true or not. No more.


Hetfield

You obviously had a bad hair day. Don't take it out on me will you ?

Last edited by Me Myself; 23rd Apr 2008 at 12:09.
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Old 23rd Apr 2008, 08:22
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If so, everybody at LH and the VC (our union) would have heard so through the gossiping circuit; I have not heard a thing like it. Also, it seems very unlikely from all the bits of info that I picked up here and there from inside my company.
So my calculated guess right now is: NO he has not been sacked.



Oh, and to all my honourable colleagues stating misinformed facts and to whom such an approach could certainly never ever have happened because they only take perfect decisions: Please wait untill the BF‹-report has been published, and then instead of judging this crew, please think of how you will learn from the incident, and will try to prevent it from happening to your silly a**es during your career. Thank you very much.


P77
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Old 23rd Apr 2008, 08:49
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Pegasus77 is right, with every word he wrote...

Nic
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Old 23rd Apr 2008, 08:54
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Pegasus77, you are absolutely right! Would appreciate if everybody had this attitude.

Seems to be something of these days, "always the other who is at fault" Tell people sometimes "to look in the mirror first" before yelling and screaming.

My thougts.
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Old 23rd Apr 2008, 09:19
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cross wind limit

Would like to know if in Lufthansa F/O have a cross wind limit above which he/she can't land the plane. in CX even a 7000 hours (like a friend of mine) F/O has such limit. When I read that The Captain corrected and save that aproach I asked myself why he was not landing in first place.
correct?
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Old 23rd Apr 2008, 09:24
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Originally Posted by Pegasus77 View Post
and then instead of judging this crew, please think of how you will learn from the incident, and will try to prevent it from happening to your silly a**es during your career.
A true word of a prophet. Indeed.
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Old 23rd Apr 2008, 09:40
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Please wait untill the BF‹-report has been published, and then instead of judging this crew, please think of how you will learn from the incident, and will try to prevent it from happening to your silly a**es during your career. Thank you very much.
Who needs a report to make a judgement? The crew received the current weather report and still the FO was the flying pilot, did I miss something?
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Old 23rd Apr 2008, 10:05
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Yup

P77's point I think
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Old 23rd Apr 2008, 10:19
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Originally Posted by Dream Land View Post
Who needs a report to make a judgement? The crew received the current weather report and still the FO was the flying pilot, did I miss something?
Is it not true that under demading conditons (to which both crewmembers have been trainded equally) it is beneficial to let handling to the second-in-command so that the true captain is in position to call a go around while not being distracted by the petty job of steering the ship?

Is it not true that if a captain screws up the FO has a complicated CRM position and limited experinece to force a go-around? How long a delay is there between sanding a winglet and tearing a wing apart?

Judgement is superfluous. We want to learn and avoid. For that a full set of information will be needed and surely is to be found in the BFU report when it sees the light of a day. I hope to see answers whether:
  • LH publishes operational and final x-wind limits to crew
  • the actual wind was beyond demonstrated Airbus value
  • an alternate runway was available
  • the scrape occured with dual input

FD (the un-real)
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Old 23rd Apr 2008, 10:36
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Is it not true that under demading conditons (to which both crewmembers have been trainded equally) it is beneficial to let handling to the second-in-command so that the true captain is in position to call a go around while not being distracted by the petty job of steering the ship?
I think modern crew resource management has now agreed that during conditions as stated, the crew is better served to let the FO drive, this philosophy has nothing to do do with being the operating pilot in dangerous wind conditions, is that how you operate, I hope your not an airline pilot.
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Old 23rd Apr 2008, 11:53
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Listen guys

I merely asked a question following a rumour I heard. I'm happy with the answer I got. All this ranting about what should / shouldn't have been done is pointless, often coming from people who wouldn't find their own bottom in broad daylight.
It would be better if the thread was closed Dr Prune.

Last edited by Me Myself; 23rd Apr 2008 at 12:12.
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Old 23rd Apr 2008, 11:57
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I have also heard nothing coming down the grapevine..

I suspect if it were true, I should have.

OORW
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Old 23rd Apr 2008, 12:06
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the petty job of steering the ship
That attitude, right there, is a seven-word summation of the troubling state of our industry.

I would submit that the owners of the aircraft, and the passengers strapped in the back, would not find anything petty in the control of the jet on that day.

I am not pointing fingers - my airline has lost quite a few hulls (and banged up a few more) in the landing phase, thanks to a lack of skills in the petty job of steering the ship.

Hand-flying skills are more important now than ever. You can't wish that away....
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