French DGAC award English pilot only level 5 English!
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Having listened to 5 three or four times, I can now make out that he is saying "negative speed restriction", though even knowing the answer it took a few listens before I could correlate the known answer to what I heard.
Me Myself:
Your written English is ok but flawed, and I would guess that you are not a native speaker. Am I right?
Me Myself:
Your written English is ok but flawed, and I would guess that you are not a native speaker. Am I right?
As flawed as my english may be, I picked it the first time. You might want to click the following link http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=320977 which will allow you to do a bit of editing, specially spelling and grammar.
I really do not understand what you are bitching about. French as a second language ?? So what ? All you have to do is write down what you hear in the headset. it's in english ......well in that case ( Shannon )....irish. You just have to read the instructions ( in french ) for the so called " voyage fictif " It certainly doesn't take a master at La Sorbonne to understand what is required of you.
Does having to translate " Vous constatez de larges échos sur votre radar et vous demandez une altération de 30 deg par la gauche " seem so difficult for you ?? Do you want it written in english ?? Surely, you must be jesting !
If you have a french licence, then you took the exam in French, didn't you ? So what's this storm in a tea cup about silly instructions ?
The bit you missed out on the tape was plain english spoken by Shannon. We get that everyday. Maybe you just need a bit of practice flying, that's all.
Incidentally, any of you who don't speak fluent French would probably be scored level 1 in English if you were to take that exam, as much of the exam is in French language.
Look, I think your ego just got a bit bruised here. You'll get over it.
I'm sure the vast majority of anglo's who take the test walk away with a 6 and they're not on this thread.
Last edited by Me Myself; 19th Apr 2008 at 16:45.
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Me Myself
I think you're still mistaking the entire point here. The test is just supposed to test level of English - 6 being a native speaker. It should not relate to RT, or be made tricky due to poor annunciation or poor quality of reproduction.
I think you're still mistaking the entire point here. The test is just supposed to test level of English - 6 being a native speaker. It should not relate to RT, or be made tricky due to poor annunciation or poor quality of reproduction.
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It should not relate to RT, or be made tricky due to poor annunciation or poor quality of reproduction.
The emergency situation test does require of you a total command of english or you end up speaking pigeon english just like I heard the other day. At least in this particular case it should be a piece of cake for a native, even if not used to R/T. Can't understand why not.
I am baffled to hear that native english speakers can't even understand a short message like " sqawk alpha........." or " negative speed restriction " when ploddering french pilots can !
What is being tested is not only the ability to speak english but also the R/T profeciency. Don't forget this test replaces what used to be called " Qualification RADIO internationale " by the french authorities. See, you got both, R/T and english.
It seems to me, reading from the various profiles, that a significant number of " wingers " are rather inexperienced in the business. This alone would explain the difficulties experienced with filling the blanks.
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Side steps
A non native english speaker having lived for some years both in the UK and USA I feel quite comfortable with the language. Although far from perfect my spoken English usually makes me a target of the following question:
"are You canadian?" or else "are You from new Zealand?"
Presently flying for a non European airline I took the test and scored 5.
The instructions given prior to the test needed to be strictly followed and an high level of concentration maintained thoughout.
Considering that english in one of the two official languages ot the Country
I was surprised to see that about 20% of the native pilots failed.
The test system must have given great consideration to the "non british" accent and intonation of the candidates.
The same candidates were given a retest but (nearly) all failed again.
Waiting for further evaluation by another certificating agency pilots with negative results cannot be rostered together.
Only exception is a german pilot that having failed both tests went on a trip home to get a nice 4 from the Gernan Authority on the JAR license and is now back happily flying unrestricted.
were's the catch?
"are You canadian?" or else "are You from new Zealand?"
Presently flying for a non European airline I took the test and scored 5.
The instructions given prior to the test needed to be strictly followed and an high level of concentration maintained thoughout.
Considering that english in one of the two official languages ot the Country
I was surprised to see that about 20% of the native pilots failed.
The test system must have given great consideration to the "non british" accent and intonation of the candidates.
The same candidates were given a retest but (nearly) all failed again.
Waiting for further evaluation by another certificating agency pilots with negative results cannot be rostered together.
Only exception is a german pilot that having failed both tests went on a trip home to get a nice 4 from the Gernan Authority on the JAR license and is now back happily flying unrestricted.
were's the catch?
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Presently flying for a non European airline I took the test and scored 5.
The instructions given prior to the test needed to be strictly followed and an high level of concentration maintained thoughout.
The instructions given prior to the test needed to be strictly followed and an high level of concentration maintained thoughout.
Precisely my point ! Is this in Canada ?
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You should try talking to Lakenheath ATC. There's a guy there who speaks high speed American R/T lingo.... Haven't got a damn clue what he's telling me... Any attempts to slow him down doesn't end up with anything much better!
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Deserves a Limerick . . .
Captain Biggles went right back to school,
Every two years, to speak by the rule.
He crammed for his Inglisch,
And learned some more Chinglish-
Now with rules, he has quite blown his cool
Nini Davies, 2008.
Every two years, to speak by the rule.
He crammed for his Inglisch,
And learned some more Chinglish-
Now with rules, he has quite blown his cool
Nini Davies, 2008.
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Maybe this would solve everything ??
I just pasted it from another thread. Originally posted by FrequentSLF.
I just pasted it from another thread. Originally posted by FrequentSLF.
The European Commission has just announced an agreement whereby English will be the official language of the European Union rather than German, which was the other possibility.
As part of the negotiations, the British Government conceded that English spelling had some room for improvement and has accepted a 5-year phase-in plan that would become known as "Euro-English".
In the first year, "s" will replace the soft "c". Sertainly, this will make the sivil servants jump with joy.
The hard "c" will be dropped in favour of "k". This should klear up konfusion, and keyboards kan have one less letter.
There will be growing publik enthusiasm in the sekond year when the troublesome "ph" will be replaced with "f". This will make words like fotograf 20% shorter.
In the 3rd year, publik akseptanse of the new spelling kan be expekted to reach the stage where more komplikated changes are possible.
Governments will enkourage the removal of double letters which have always ben a deterent to akurate speling.
Also, al wil agre that the horibl mes of the silent "e" in the languag is disgrasful and it should go away.
By the 4th yer people wil be reseptiv to steps such as replasing "th" with "z" and "w" with "v".
During ze fifz yer, ze unesesary "o" kan be dropd from vords kontaining "ou" and after ziz fifz yer, ve vil hav a reil sensibl riten styl.
Zer vil be no mor trubl or difikultis and evrivun vil find it ezi tu understand ech oza. Ze drem of a united urop vil finali kum tru.
Und efter ze fifz yer, ve vil al be speking German like zey vunted in ze forst plas."
As part of the negotiations, the British Government conceded that English spelling had some room for improvement and has accepted a 5-year phase-in plan that would become known as "Euro-English".
In the first year, "s" will replace the soft "c". Sertainly, this will make the sivil servants jump with joy.
The hard "c" will be dropped in favour of "k". This should klear up konfusion, and keyboards kan have one less letter.
There will be growing publik enthusiasm in the sekond year when the troublesome "ph" will be replaced with "f". This will make words like fotograf 20% shorter.
In the 3rd year, publik akseptanse of the new spelling kan be expekted to reach the stage where more komplikated changes are possible.
Governments will enkourage the removal of double letters which have always ben a deterent to akurate speling.
Also, al wil agre that the horibl mes of the silent "e" in the languag is disgrasful and it should go away.
By the 4th yer people wil be reseptiv to steps such as replasing "th" with "z" and "w" with "v".
During ze fifz yer, ze unesesary "o" kan be dropd from vords kontaining "ou" and after ziz fifz yer, ve vil hav a reil sensibl riten styl.
Zer vil be no mor trubl or difikultis and evrivun vil find it ezi tu understand ech oza. Ze drem of a united urop vil finali kum tru.
Und efter ze fifz yer, ve vil al be speking German like zey vunted in ze forst plas."
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english test level for licencing
I am not a native english speaker and I got level 5. That's ok. Big BUT is that here in Qatar those who have english passports no matter where they originally come from they got automatically level 6 and the qataris too got level 6.
there are some pilots I know that speak very good english got 4 and 5.
There some whose english is poor and they manged 6...
me not knoween 6 floor got how ? = 6
ask ICAO.
there are some pilots I know that speak very good english got 4 and 5.
There some whose english is poor and they manged 6...
me not knoween 6 floor got how ? = 6
ask ICAO.
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Richatom:
It's as plain as plain that it's 'negative speed restriction'
Now you'll probably take this the wrong way but most forms of hearing loss either due to age or acoustic trauma start with high frequency loss.
Consonants are typically the first to go: mebbe an audiogram might pinpoint a problem: you'd be surprised how many peeps who think their hearing is good in fact have 20-25dB loss especially in the higher frequency range.
Having heard the tapes though I agree it's a bloody stupid test if you're supposed to write the stuff down verbatim complete with non-ICAO errors.
Cusco
It's as plain as plain that it's 'negative speed restriction'
Now you'll probably take this the wrong way but most forms of hearing loss either due to age or acoustic trauma start with high frequency loss.
Consonants are typically the first to go: mebbe an audiogram might pinpoint a problem: you'd be surprised how many peeps who think their hearing is good in fact have 20-25dB loss especially in the higher frequency range.
Having heard the tapes though I agree it's a bloody stupid test if you're supposed to write the stuff down verbatim complete with non-ICAO errors.
Cusco
