BA Cabin Crew Strike Threat
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Heathrow
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Get real
Oh, give us a break!!!
I know there are brilliant, caring and intelligent Crew - at least I've been told there are, but some of them are so naive. They believe they're invisible at Ascot ( and Windsor evening racing ), when Ground staff who see them regularly attend after or before (!!) their antisocial shifts. WE KNOW the truth of the stereotype Crew member - cos we marry them, go out with them or are family members. Don't try to fool us; we know the full SP!!
Move on now, accept that most of the time, the job's a dream and your conditions are peachy. At least they have been up to now. If you don't turn up next week you can just say goodbye to all that. It really will be the end of the good times, for you and for everyone else.
Thanks a lot!!
I know there are brilliant, caring and intelligent Crew - at least I've been told there are, but some of them are so naive. They believe they're invisible at Ascot ( and Windsor evening racing ), when Ground staff who see them regularly attend after or before (!!) their antisocial shifts. WE KNOW the truth of the stereotype Crew member - cos we marry them, go out with them or are family members. Don't try to fool us; we know the full SP!!
Move on now, accept that most of the time, the job's a dream and your conditions are peachy. At least they have been up to now. If you don't turn up next week you can just say goodbye to all that. It really will be the end of the good times, for you and for everyone else.
Thanks a lot!!
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Heathrow
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Get real
No litebulbs. My other half isn't, my brother isn't; my friends aren't but all of them agree they're working daily with colleagues that embarrass them. They take liberties and are sloppy, and what really winds my partner up is they feel oh so superior to Ground staff who take the pain and filter the baddies before they get on board. What's really got her goat, is the cavalier way in which BASSA can con her Crew colleagues that the strike(a) is right and just, and (b) will be successful. Doh!!!
My bro sees the job he joined 10 years ago and loves about to change drastically with the ableassistance of WW and BASSA working in concert.
My bro sees the job he joined 10 years ago and loves about to change drastically with the ableassistance of WW and BASSA working in concert.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Heathrow
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
get real
Knew you'd eventually get personal Lightbulbs, once you'd run out of anything else to say. We are all going to regret this, sadly I believe you will have to admit that one day. Let's stop the madness now for both our sakes, and the other 40+ thousand BA staff, not just 10K crew.
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
BA CC - The Perfect Angels.
Litebulbs
No. Not all CC are like that but even if a small percentage are like that then that is why the sickness average is so high!
Ohhh! and while we are on the subject didn't BASSA sign up to the AMP one year after the rest of the company after they were offered a "bribe" of a couple of grand for every CC member?
Not all CC are like that but the Facts remain:
Fact: 700 CC go sick every day.
Fact:BA employ 1000 extra CC to cover this.
Fact: Even after AMP.....CC sickness dropped from 22 to 12 (60% higher than other airlines)
Don't worry it's not the fall that kills you.....only the ground at the end!
No. Not all CC are like that but even if a small percentage are like that then that is why the sickness average is so high!
Ohhh! and while we are on the subject didn't BASSA sign up to the AMP one year after the rest of the company after they were offered a "bribe" of a couple of grand for every CC member?
Not all CC are like that but the Facts remain:
Fact: 700 CC go sick every day.
Fact:BA employ 1000 extra CC to cover this.
Fact: Even after AMP.....CC sickness dropped from 22 to 12 (60% higher than other airlines)
Don't worry it's not the fall that kills you.....only the ground at the end!
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Heathrow
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Get real
Forgive me Litebulbs; I'd hate you to feel I've been harsh. It's just my future and the future of people I love. I can't imagine why I feel so passionate about this.
Now dig deep and admit you've come up against Crew that, er shall we say disappointed you, some time in the distant past. I admit ( easy to do actually ) that I've been served adequately by many Crew.
I truly believe that from now on you, Litebulbs and I are going to see more and more unhappy faces on board. Now how am I going to handle that??? I'm already iffy about the on board service; it can only get worse once WW has his pound of flesh after winning ( sadly it's got to the stage of winners and losers ) hands down the fight HE HAS to win.
Now dig deep and admit you've come up against Crew that, er shall we say disappointed you, some time in the distant past. I admit ( easy to do actually ) that I've been served adequately by many Crew.
I truly believe that from now on you, Litebulbs and I are going to see more and more unhappy faces on board. Now how am I going to handle that??? I'm already iffy about the on board service; it can only get worse once WW has his pound of flesh after winning ( sadly it's got to the stage of winners and losers ) hands down the fight HE HAS to win.
Look deltahero
Their is not point having a go at each other, because we are at the bottom of the food chain.
BA CC terms and conditions were there before Mr Walsh turned up. BA is making shed loads of cash. BA has a 10% operating margin. I would imagine that WW has no brand loyalty, but I bet you and your family have.
I must state again, I no longer work for BA, but will still hopefully be a BA pensioner. I was in the unique position of being one of the few jobs at BA who get paid less than the market rate, so I left.
Their is not point having a go at each other, because we are at the bottom of the food chain.
BA CC terms and conditions were there before Mr Walsh turned up. BA is making shed loads of cash. BA has a 10% operating margin. I would imagine that WW has no brand loyalty, but I bet you and your family have.
I must state again, I no longer work for BA, but will still hopefully be a BA pensioner. I was in the unique position of being one of the few jobs at BA who get paid less than the market rate, so I left.
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: At home
Posts: 181
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
No litebulbs. My other half isn't, my brother isn't; my friends aren't but all of them agree they're working daily with colleagues that embarrass them. They take liberties and are sloppy, and what really winds my partner up
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: LHR/EGLL
Age: 45
Posts: 4,400
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
One point about the possible motivation of calling in 'sick' being to take 'some control over days off'.... I assume then that at induction/training, BA CC are told that they do have control over which days off they'll get, thus them all being surprised when they start working on the line and seeing the reality, and thus motivating them to call in sick.
If however, the way the roster works is explained to them, what's the problem?
From those CC whom I know that do take the pi$$ regarding calling in sick, this 'taking control of days off' is a load of tosh....they just don't want to go to work and would rather spend the day at home/out shopping/generic sporting event.
If however, the way the roster works is explained to them, what's the problem?
From those CC whom I know that do take the pi$$ regarding calling in sick, this 'taking control of days off' is a load of tosh....they just don't want to go to work and would rather spend the day at home/out shopping/generic sporting event.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Heathrow
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Get real
[quote=Litebulbs;3089955]Look deltahero
Their is not point having a go at each other, because we are at the bottom of the food chain.
Quite right Litebulbs, and I'm genuinely concerned about my situation already. I'm sorry you left as you're obviously still passionate, but this is my bread and butter. It doesn't kill me that some people have been having the jam - that's life, but I want them to appreciate it.
AYC seems to think that this is management speak, well my old manager would be laughing in his grave if he heard that. As a convenor I was a pain in his butt.
Nice talking with you Litebulbs. I'm up at 3am for my early and hope to talk again - maybe we'll acheive something out of this hopeless situation.
Their is not point having a go at each other, because we are at the bottom of the food chain.
Quite right Litebulbs, and I'm genuinely concerned about my situation already. I'm sorry you left as you're obviously still passionate, but this is my bread and butter. It doesn't kill me that some people have been having the jam - that's life, but I want them to appreciate it.
AYC seems to think that this is management speak, well my old manager would be laughing in his grave if he heard that. As a convenor I was a pain in his butt.
Nice talking with you Litebulbs. I'm up at 3am for my early and hope to talk again - maybe we'll acheive something out of this hopeless situation.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Heathrow
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
get real
Sorry AYC. Re read you and think I got it right this time. You were knocking Crew managers, not me.
Very tired- hate these earlies. Glad I'm not crew - GAWD! Did I say that?
Ninight.
Very tired- hate these earlies. Glad I'm not crew - GAWD! Did I say that?
Ninight.
Cabin crew are in close quarters with passengers so probably are more likely to get sick from whatever new bug the pax are carrying. It might be more useful to compare their rates of sick leave to the ticket counter agents or security screeners than comparing it it to pilots who these days have much less contact with the general public, or to baggage handlers, who may have less contact.
The pax will often fly when sick to avoid missing a vacation or business meeting, so the CC will encounter sick people, often ones in their most contagious stages of infection.
Obviously, calling in sick as a form of protest is separate from the above, but lets not compare apples and oranges.
An early post on this thread said they debated whether to count cervical cancer towards sick days, if I recall correctly, which strikes me as insane or incredibly cynical. (Cynical in that cervical cancer is often deadly and quick.)
Still, the news here says they may cancel 1300 flights, which has to hurt.
The pax will often fly when sick to avoid missing a vacation or business meeting, so the CC will encounter sick people, often ones in their most contagious stages of infection.
Obviously, calling in sick as a form of protest is separate from the above, but lets not compare apples and oranges.
An early post on this thread said they debated whether to count cervical cancer towards sick days, if I recall correctly, which strikes me as insane or incredibly cynical. (Cynical in that cervical cancer is often deadly and quick.)
Still, the news here says they may cancel 1300 flights, which has to hurt.
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: West London
Posts: 46
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
All very interesting but I have been watching BASSA / T&G and this is basically an attempted mugging that they now realise has gone t**ts up and are desparate to find a way out of. They were asking for guarantees on discounted incidences of sickness - i.e. irrespective of an individual's sickness record. Presumably a negotiating line but one they must have been confident would end up working in the favour opf the most frequent who are taking liberties. Despite WW accepting their most recent wording they have backtracked since Dromey was made to sound stupid on BBC R4 "Today" Programme. It is not a question of disputing whether or not someone is fit to fly (or do any other work for that matter) if they say they are not. What is more to the point is challenging why some people have greater incidences of illnesses (especially discountable ones) than colleagues or similar folk in similar jobs in the industry. What is it about their lifestyle or physiology that makes this happen - can that be changed / improved or (in the final analysis) is this the sort of work they should be doing?
Coupled with this is an interest as always with BASSA of feathering nests - not usually those most in need but more often their own cronies. Why are they after a pay settlement when they know that BA had to sort pensions first. What about A Scales, engineers, pilots, managers, anyone? Why should BASSA simply make unsupported demands and expect BA to cough up? Who is doing the bullying here?
BASSA cancelled 1 x day of action as they knew the stakes were ratcheting up when the flight cancellations were due. BASSA are split but it seems the radicals are in the ascendency - do they want this settled or are they looking for some real action. What is the true agenda? BASSA have never looked out for the weakest in their ranks only the noisiest. I have heard that the costs of IA in real terms are going down every day as the costs are already incurred by lost bookings, refunds etc. In excess of £30m already. The Co. has taken this and is still not blinking!
It seems that the way they expect to run industrial relations is "we give nothing, demand more and you roll over -if you are lucky we won't do it too often" And not to forget we will personalise publically, send poisen pen letters and intimidate. "If a captain downroute should attempt to criticise our actions, record his name and report him to BASSA" What pray will BASSA then do with this information? Watch what you eat guys and hide your cars!
Its up to the CC when all is said and done. Follow them if you like but you will regret it as they don't know what they really want and don't know what success might look like. A deal on EG300 + pensions could have extricated them from embarrassment but like a child in a tantrum they continue to wail.
An amusing rumour that BASSA have advised the Met that they will picket from 08.00 to 16.00 on the strike days - that's dedication for you!
Oh and are the key BASSA players rostered on duty on Tuesday next?
Coupled with this is an interest as always with BASSA of feathering nests - not usually those most in need but more often their own cronies. Why are they after a pay settlement when they know that BA had to sort pensions first. What about A Scales, engineers, pilots, managers, anyone? Why should BASSA simply make unsupported demands and expect BA to cough up? Who is doing the bullying here?
BASSA cancelled 1 x day of action as they knew the stakes were ratcheting up when the flight cancellations were due. BASSA are split but it seems the radicals are in the ascendency - do they want this settled or are they looking for some real action. What is the true agenda? BASSA have never looked out for the weakest in their ranks only the noisiest. I have heard that the costs of IA in real terms are going down every day as the costs are already incurred by lost bookings, refunds etc. In excess of £30m already. The Co. has taken this and is still not blinking!
It seems that the way they expect to run industrial relations is "we give nothing, demand more and you roll over -if you are lucky we won't do it too often" And not to forget we will personalise publically, send poisen pen letters and intimidate. "If a captain downroute should attempt to criticise our actions, record his name and report him to BASSA" What pray will BASSA then do with this information? Watch what you eat guys and hide your cars!
Its up to the CC when all is said and done. Follow them if you like but you will regret it as they don't know what they really want and don't know what success might look like. A deal on EG300 + pensions could have extricated them from embarrassment but like a child in a tantrum they continue to wail.
An amusing rumour that BASSA have advised the Met that they will picket from 08.00 to 16.00 on the strike days - that's dedication for you!
Oh and are the key BASSA players rostered on duty on Tuesday next?
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I hear what you say.....but!
Juud. In reply to your post Pg 39 Post 763
Work ethic & management quality
BA CC sick days do indeed peak during British events such as Ascot and Wimbledon, (there is nothing wrong with the mentality of those who fraudulently call in sick apart from the fact they know the system will let them get away with it)! Or used to anyway.
The management is trying to change this…. Hence the strike.
Sick days include maternity leave
Maternity leave is included but has a negligible effect on the figures as the lucky Mums are placed into ground jobs until a few weeks before the joyful day.
On your feet vs on your bum
SH do work harder than LH. Shouldn’t they be paid more?
A few ex SH feel extremely bored when they come to LH until they realise they can sleep for a few hours every trip!
FA/Purser to the heady heights of CSD.
Congratulations, but if you are finding it such a difference look in the mirror.
Have you turned into one of those Video Watching/Paper reading Managers that CC and FC despise equally.
The job does have a cumulative effect on you which is why you are paid accordingly! But for BA CC still 60% above the industry average.
Correct! Chalk & Cheese……You have no idea of the pressure of flying a 200 tonne ac into one of the busiest airports in the world in ****ty conditions with the lives of 300+ passengers in your hands. (although I do still get the “We fly the same aeroplane we should get the same perks ********”) OOOOKKKKKKKKKKKK
Your training time 4 weeks.... My training time 3 Years! 
But I do agree with your last comment! (Apart from replacing looming with imminent and destructive) 
Work ethic & management quality
BA CC sick days do indeed peak during British events such as Ascot and Wimbledon, (there is nothing wrong with the mentality of those who fraudulently call in sick apart from the fact they know the system will let them get away with it)! Or used to anyway.
There is also something badly wrong with the management capacities and strategies of those who have allowed such a culture to develop.
Sick days include maternity leave
Maternity leave is included but has a negligible effect on the figures as the lucky Mums are placed into ground jobs until a few weeks before the joyful day.
On your feet vs on your bum
SH do work harder than LH. Shouldn’t they be paid more?
A few ex SH feel extremely bored when they come to LH until they realise they can sleep for a few hours every trip!FA/Purser to the heady heights of CSD.
Congratulations, but if you are finding it such a difference look in the mirror. Have you turned into one of those Video Watching/Paper reading Managers that CC and FC despise equally.
So what is the point I am illustrating?
Comparing 2 things that are entirely different in nature.
OOOOKKKKKKKKKKKK Your training time 4 weeks.... My training time 3 Years! But I do agree with your last comment! (Apart from replacing looming with imminent and destructive)
Best wishes to all BA employees and their passengers for a fair, speedy and non-disruptive solution of this looming conflict.
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: LPFL
Age: 60
Posts: 83
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Will you allow a quick interjection from an SLF not employed by BA (or any other airline)?
To Britain's general public, CC have a "dream job" so striking about pay and conditions is NOT going to get any sympathy from Joe Public. All the papers etc. will report is "My holiday chaos hell" type stories with all sympathy to the traveller and none to the strikers.
I know NOTHING about whether BA CC have a legitimate grievance or not but I DO know you have to be able to sell your case to the public and get the media on your side. Call it "spin" if you will but BA CC haven't done this - you don't have the right "spin doctors" on your side.
Meantime, I would not book a flight with BA through LHR in the long term paying full fare (as opposed to bagging a "cheapie" off the website to fly tomorrow). BA/LHR have had too many "banana skins" recently and this strike will just be the latest in a long line. KLM/AF and Lufthansa (etc.) offer just the same via AMS/CDG/FRA (etc.) and, all other things being equal, that's what I would do rather than risk my plans being upset by another of BA/LHR's periodic "disruptions".
Just the view of an average SLF on the street.
M63
To Britain's general public, CC have a "dream job" so striking about pay and conditions is NOT going to get any sympathy from Joe Public. All the papers etc. will report is "My holiday chaos hell" type stories with all sympathy to the traveller and none to the strikers.
I know NOTHING about whether BA CC have a legitimate grievance or not but I DO know you have to be able to sell your case to the public and get the media on your side. Call it "spin" if you will but BA CC haven't done this - you don't have the right "spin doctors" on your side.
Meantime, I would not book a flight with BA through LHR in the long term paying full fare (as opposed to bagging a "cheapie" off the website to fly tomorrow). BA/LHR have had too many "banana skins" recently and this strike will just be the latest in a long line. KLM/AF and Lufthansa (etc.) offer just the same via AMS/CDG/FRA (etc.) and, all other things being equal, that's what I would do rather than risk my plans being upset by another of BA/LHR's periodic "disruptions".
Just the view of an average SLF on the street.
M63
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: on the golf course (Covid permitting)
Posts: 2,131
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Would someone care to speculate why BASSA refuse the seemingly sensible suggestion of involving ACAS? They talk about always being ready to talk, why not involve an arbitration service?