Jet lost for hours over Java after navigation system failed
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Standby Magnetic Compas? RMI / ADF / VOR /DME?The number 3 emergency battery operated emergency VHF I think they should have one of those in a B737-300? The HF , weather radar map mode?
How about "Eye balls mark 1" and have a good look out of the window for some good old fashioned map reading, and at 06:30 Hrs at FL 310 or higher the sun should also give a fair idea of which way you are going, the average heading from Jakarta to Destination Makassar is about 085? Apparently the aircraft was in the air for about 4 hours for what should have been a two hour flight.Not a word to the 140 passengers all that time even thoug they noticed the aircraft climbing /descending climbing again circling etc?
Imagine the extra documentation to be approved by the FAA/CAA for procedural changes alone, not including a brand-new (to the airline) system, and the procedures on how the crew uses it and any interface with a "steam-gauge" HSI, or with the later machines which have triple laser ring IRS or IRUs! Then aircraft operating manual, flight ops manual, c0ckp1t oper. manual insertions, then the changes, revisions...never mind the extra equipment purchase and installation cost$.
How about installation and problems? A few months ago, we had 3 mechanics onboard, all "new" here, in order to replace a fluorescent light bulb in the fwd. lavatory (im wichtigen Klo) and a second, smaller bulb for the pink or blue light, just behind the c0ckpit door. True story. Young "Ellie", the first one who appeared, looked young enough to be in high school. Some of the folks have allegedly recently signed off logbooks without doing the work-this from a "safety" guy.
More of the future training will be done at home by "distance learning" (as some of it is now, including systems tests: install "JRE", followed by multiple clicks and away you go....a buddy recently was in his first A-330 (his first for ANY Airbus) training at the sim. building. Not just his first Airbus, but this is the larger ETOPS equipment. His Instructor gave him some papers and reportedly said "here is what you can do on the MCDU", and the Instructor disappeared for the whole training period!), in order to save the company money, which could easily be awarded to upper executives (United awarded FOUR HUNDRED of these "suits" with United stock. If true, why did they need 400 to "run" the place?), some of which have done a very bad job of navigating their corporations-but leadership skills are no longer required to instruct the unwashed, unlettered, uncouth peasants (labor).
How about installation and problems? A few months ago, we had 3 mechanics onboard, all "new" here, in order to replace a fluorescent light bulb in the fwd. lavatory (im wichtigen Klo) and a second, smaller bulb for the pink or blue light, just behind the c0ckpit door. True story. Young "Ellie", the first one who appeared, looked young enough to be in high school. Some of the folks have allegedly recently signed off logbooks without doing the work-this from a "safety" guy.
More of the future training will be done at home by "distance learning" (as some of it is now, including systems tests: install "JRE", followed by multiple clicks and away you go....a buddy recently was in his first A-330 (his first for ANY Airbus) training at the sim. building. Not just his first Airbus, but this is the larger ETOPS equipment. His Instructor gave him some papers and reportedly said "here is what you can do on the MCDU", and the Instructor disappeared for the whole training period!), in order to save the company money, which could easily be awarded to upper executives (United awarded FOUR HUNDRED of these "suits" with United stock. If true, why did they need 400 to "run" the place?), some of which have done a very bad job of navigating their corporations-but leadership skills are no longer required to instruct the unwashed, unlettered, uncouth peasants (labor).
Last edited by Ignition Override; 15th Feb 2006 at 07:15.
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With or without radar, the times are run on the flight plan. If you lose navigation capability, you resort to dead reconing. Headings should be flown per the flight plan based on ETAs on the flight plan. The radar coverage in S/E Asia is limited to the larger cities at best. Communications are H/F and spotty at best utilizing relays usually through Perth radio.
However, first and foremost, if there was a discrepency with the GPS or IRU plain and simple, don't move the jet. There are more jobs for NG pilots than pilots to fill the seats.
Don't let these scumbags operators compromise your integrity, safety, and your airmans certificates
However, first and foremost, if there was a discrepency with the GPS or IRU plain and simple, don't move the jet. There are more jobs for NG pilots than pilots to fill the seats.
Don't let these scumbags operators compromise your integrity, safety, and your airmans certificates
captjns
Re 'communications are H/F and spotty at best utilising relays usually through Perth Radio'....
Thanks for that, we did try hard...
However, in about April 2001, we were 'closed' - made 'redundo' to save $'s...
something to do with what was termed, 'affordable safety'...
"Your Safety Will Be Enhanced, And It Will Cost You (The Industry) Less'....was the mantra!
And, with H/F sites located at both Perth and Cocos Is. for both INO and SEA freqs. the service we provided WAS very good - THEN!
And yes, we did do many a relay for those who we heard calling, calling...
Cheers,
Thanks for that, we did try hard...
However, in about April 2001, we were 'closed' - made 'redundo' to save $'s...
something to do with what was termed, 'affordable safety'...
"Your Safety Will Be Enhanced, And It Will Cost You (The Industry) Less'....was the mantra!
And, with H/F sites located at both Perth and Cocos Is. for both INO and SEA freqs. the service we provided WAS very good - THEN!
And yes, we did do many a relay for those who we heard calling, calling...
Cheers,
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Anytime Ex FSO GRIFFO.
I spent a few years flying around that part of the world from the mid 90s through 2000. The first months were rather nerve racking especially approaching FIR Boundry Points. I compare it to going to somebody's home, knocking on their door and no ones home. The next best thing was to try the old radio relay thing. During those years, Perth was a great help, even when we tried to contact Jaakarta Radio when approoching their area of control! I would hope that there would be some improvement.
Sure was interesting flying.
I spent a few years flying around that part of the world from the mid 90s through 2000. The first months were rather nerve racking especially approaching FIR Boundry Points. I compare it to going to somebody's home, knocking on their door and no ones home. The next best thing was to try the old radio relay thing. During those years, Perth was a great help, even when we tried to contact Jaakarta Radio when approoching their area of control! I would hope that there would be some improvement.
Sure was interesting flying.
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The world according to GARP
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DATE:21/02/06
SOURCE:Flight International
Adam Air 737 pilots lose way after cockpit systems failure
Navigation equipment on Indonesian twinjet ‘stopped working’ after leaving Jakarta
Indonesia’s National Transportation Safety Commission (NTSC) will be interviewing the pilots who made an emergency landing on an isolated island airstrip after experiencing problems navigating an Adam Air Boeing 737-300 to its destination.
The aircraft (PK-KKE) took off from Jakarta on 11 February and made an emergency landing at Tombulaka airport on eastern Indonesia’s Sumba island, says Pritap Widjaja, the NTSC investigator examining the incident.
Sumba is a relatively remote island about 550km (300nm) south of the aircraft’s scheduled destination of Makassar, an Indonesian city on Sulawesi island.
Indonesian news reports say that, after leaving Jakarta, the aircraft’s navigation and communication equipment stopped working. The pilots later made an emergency landing at Sumba because they were unaware of their position and were unable to locate Makassar, add the reports.
Widjaja declines to say if there was anything wrong with the aircraft’s navigation equipment, however. He says this is now subject to investigation and that he will be interviewing the pilots involved.
When asked if the aircraft was able to communicate with controllers, the investigator says: “According to air traffic control this was being handled by the Makassar advanced traffic system, but they were unable to receive any communications from the aircraft.”
He cites news reports as saying the aircraft was in the air for about 4h before it landed at Tombulaka airport, which has a 1,600m (5,250ft) runway that is normally only sufficient for turboprops such as the Fokker F27. Despite this the 737 landed safely, and none of the 136 passengers and seven crew on board were injured, adds the investigator.
Adam Air president Adam Suherman says the airline inspected the aircraft at Tombulaka on 12 February and found “nothing wrong with the navigation equipment”.
LEITHEN FRANCIS / SINGAPORE
Flight Home
SubscribeYou are in: Home › News Article
DATE:21/02/06
SOURCE:Flight International
Adam Air 737 pilots lose way after cockpit systems failure
Navigation equipment on Indonesian twinjet ‘stopped working’ after leaving Jakarta
Indonesia’s National Transportation Safety Commission (NTSC) will be interviewing the pilots who made an emergency landing on an isolated island airstrip after experiencing problems navigating an Adam Air Boeing 737-300 to its destination.
The aircraft (PK-KKE) took off from Jakarta on 11 February and made an emergency landing at Tombulaka airport on eastern Indonesia’s Sumba island, says Pritap Widjaja, the NTSC investigator examining the incident.
Sumba is a relatively remote island about 550km (300nm) south of the aircraft’s scheduled destination of Makassar, an Indonesian city on Sulawesi island.
Indonesian news reports say that, after leaving Jakarta, the aircraft’s navigation and communication equipment stopped working. The pilots later made an emergency landing at Sumba because they were unaware of their position and were unable to locate Makassar, add the reports.
Widjaja declines to say if there was anything wrong with the aircraft’s navigation equipment, however. He says this is now subject to investigation and that he will be interviewing the pilots involved.
When asked if the aircraft was able to communicate with controllers, the investigator says: “According to air traffic control this was being handled by the Makassar advanced traffic system, but they were unable to receive any communications from the aircraft.”
He cites news reports as saying the aircraft was in the air for about 4h before it landed at Tombulaka airport, which has a 1,600m (5,250ft) runway that is normally only sufficient for turboprops such as the Fokker F27. Despite this the 737 landed safely, and none of the 136 passengers and seven crew on board were injured, adds the investigator.
Adam Air president Adam Suherman says the airline inspected the aircraft at Tombulaka on 12 February and found “nothing wrong with the navigation equipment”.
LEITHEN FRANCIS / SINGAPORE
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That would be the same Adam Air that Qantas is looking at buying......
http://www.m-travel.com/news/2006/02..._and_adam.html
http://www.m-travel.com/news/2006/02..._and_adam.html
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I know this report is only from a journo
I know the captain was "only" a pilot, but the aircraft still ended up getting lost.
Since I'm sure you'd agree that the implication of village-idiocy sounds just as offensive when it's directed in the opposite direction, is a little professional courtesy still too much to ask here?
