Korean Air Pay Cuts Looming
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: uk
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The last time I posted my true feeling towards Korean women, I was banned from prrune. 
What Glueball said is quite true!! But be aware what you are getting yourself into, my last one took me to the cleaners.
What Glueball said is quite true!! But be aware what you are getting yourself into, my last one took me to the cleaners.
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Korea
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To answer your question, the SA Pilots really are terrible and most are imposters as you so mildly put it. They are also extremely arrogant and very racial. No Korean F/O enjoys their flights with a SA in the left seat!
The Aussies are just as bad, but on the positive side their credentials are at least real. The Aussie Captains who made it to the rank of Line Check Pilots (LCP's) were after a period of time, removed from their positions as management soon realized their mistake in appointing them LCP's in the first place.
Management does eventually listen, but it takes postings like this to bring certain matters to their attention.
The Aussies are just as bad, but on the positive side their credentials are at least real. The Aussie Captains who made it to the rank of Line Check Pilots (LCP's) were after a period of time, removed from their positions as management soon realized their mistake in appointing them LCP's in the first place.
Management does eventually listen, but it takes postings like this to bring certain matters to their attention.
Join Date: Dec 2001
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Gentlemen
Re: KIMCHIKAL, KEIONU, KALPILOT etc
Some important points for your consideration.
1. Be very careful if you have any direct e-mail contact with Mr. KEIONU. I am informed that he may well be being investigated by company and police (Korean and US) IT experts for sending malicious e-mails with a poisonous and threatening theme all too evident to observers of his posts. Don’t get tied up on his address list. As a fellow human being and not wishing this person any harm I must (though I am not legally trained) urge Mr KEIONU to not say anything that will make things tougher for himself or his defence lawyers when his identity is known.
2. To Mr. KEIONU and his supporters. It may be your personal tradition to say nasty things about foreigners behind an anonymous e-mail address but that style is not the case for the overwhelming proportion of your countrymen and those who are part of Korea’s drive to globalize. Korea is a wonderful, friendly country that is setting an example to the world in globalizing and exporting. If you want to go against this trend then don’t stop at getting rid of foreign pilots and management: get rid of foreign passengers and freight. Foreign kerosene. Airplanes. Destinations. Get rid of English. Tell all overseas Koreans (especially in “management positions”) to come home. And instead of your airline progressing rapidly into a “Top 10” genuine world class carrier it will go downhill as you seem to so earnestly desire. Seoul National University (did KEIONU go there?) is busy hiring all the “foreign” professors it can get to help build expertise. Maybe they’re wrong too. I’m sure KEIONU can find the SNU President’s e-mail address if he tries.
3. I am not an ACP so I can’t say for sure but I will bet that KIMCHIKAL and KEIONU never went to their offices with suggestions, ideas, complaints. I will promise Mr KEIONU this: if he contacts me with a genuine e-mail ([email protected]) I will keep his message totally confidential and undertake to ensure that his complaints ideas and suggestions get put on the KAL CEO’s desk if I have to take it there myself. If he will forward his signed resume (and this goes for KIMCHIKAL et al too) as a way of showing their level of expertise in knowing best how to run this fine airline I will personally donate US $500 per resume to the Korean charity of their choice.
4. As to the question: what have foreign management done? Not a relevant question. Management at Korean Air is a team. Not “them and us”. Not perfect. Not even near perfect. No airline is. But since Guam, that team has rebuilt this now great carrier from the ground up. AS A TEAM. If you can’t practice CRM outside the cockpit Mr KEIONU, you can’t practice it inside! If you insist on the practice of assessing management credentials based on genetic, racial and cultural traits then you are a bit late. Mr Milosovic is now in the Hague for practicing this sort of stuff and there were plenty before him. “Mein Kampf” was written while your grandparents’ generation was still being oppressed by the Japanese colonizers. I believe “foreign” managers like MacArthur and Truman etc had something to do with ending that war.
5. Mr KEIONU speaks with great authority as the “Voice of the FCU”. Is that an elected position? Funny, but most FCU members I’ve shown his writings to are as disgusted as I am. A number of FCU officials say that they have no knowledge of any FCU campaign against foreigners. If you claim to be speaking for all of the FCU members you’d better make sure because if it is indeed true that you going to be hunted by the authorities for your e-mails then you might need union support one day.
6. Finally, Mr KEIONU and KINCHIKAL etc, write to me so we can discuss this face to face, preferably after a walk through the Yongsan War Museum where we can review the history of foreigners working (and dying) alongside Koreans to keep this great country free. Where I come from we judge people by what they do, not their racial background. This airline has come a long, long way while you haven’t been watching and if you want to find out just how far it’s come then take up this offer of genuine communication NOW. If you come with an open mind you won’t be disappointed.
My Bible suggests that at this time of year "Peace and Goodwill" should be the themes we pursue. I think this has gone on long enough. Let's do something positive for a change.
Happy Christmas folks and safe flying.
Viastra
Re: KIMCHIKAL, KEIONU, KALPILOT etc
Some important points for your consideration.
1. Be very careful if you have any direct e-mail contact with Mr. KEIONU. I am informed that he may well be being investigated by company and police (Korean and US) IT experts for sending malicious e-mails with a poisonous and threatening theme all too evident to observers of his posts. Don’t get tied up on his address list. As a fellow human being and not wishing this person any harm I must (though I am not legally trained) urge Mr KEIONU to not say anything that will make things tougher for himself or his defence lawyers when his identity is known.
2. To Mr. KEIONU and his supporters. It may be your personal tradition to say nasty things about foreigners behind an anonymous e-mail address but that style is not the case for the overwhelming proportion of your countrymen and those who are part of Korea’s drive to globalize. Korea is a wonderful, friendly country that is setting an example to the world in globalizing and exporting. If you want to go against this trend then don’t stop at getting rid of foreign pilots and management: get rid of foreign passengers and freight. Foreign kerosene. Airplanes. Destinations. Get rid of English. Tell all overseas Koreans (especially in “management positions”) to come home. And instead of your airline progressing rapidly into a “Top 10” genuine world class carrier it will go downhill as you seem to so earnestly desire. Seoul National University (did KEIONU go there?) is busy hiring all the “foreign” professors it can get to help build expertise. Maybe they’re wrong too. I’m sure KEIONU can find the SNU President’s e-mail address if he tries.
3. I am not an ACP so I can’t say for sure but I will bet that KIMCHIKAL and KEIONU never went to their offices with suggestions, ideas, complaints. I will promise Mr KEIONU this: if he contacts me with a genuine e-mail ([email protected]) I will keep his message totally confidential and undertake to ensure that his complaints ideas and suggestions get put on the KAL CEO’s desk if I have to take it there myself. If he will forward his signed resume (and this goes for KIMCHIKAL et al too) as a way of showing their level of expertise in knowing best how to run this fine airline I will personally donate US $500 per resume to the Korean charity of their choice.
4. As to the question: what have foreign management done? Not a relevant question. Management at Korean Air is a team. Not “them and us”. Not perfect. Not even near perfect. No airline is. But since Guam, that team has rebuilt this now great carrier from the ground up. AS A TEAM. If you can’t practice CRM outside the cockpit Mr KEIONU, you can’t practice it inside! If you insist on the practice of assessing management credentials based on genetic, racial and cultural traits then you are a bit late. Mr Milosovic is now in the Hague for practicing this sort of stuff and there were plenty before him. “Mein Kampf” was written while your grandparents’ generation was still being oppressed by the Japanese colonizers. I believe “foreign” managers like MacArthur and Truman etc had something to do with ending that war.
5. Mr KEIONU speaks with great authority as the “Voice of the FCU”. Is that an elected position? Funny, but most FCU members I’ve shown his writings to are as disgusted as I am. A number of FCU officials say that they have no knowledge of any FCU campaign against foreigners. If you claim to be speaking for all of the FCU members you’d better make sure because if it is indeed true that you going to be hunted by the authorities for your e-mails then you might need union support one day.
6. Finally, Mr KEIONU and KINCHIKAL etc, write to me so we can discuss this face to face, preferably after a walk through the Yongsan War Museum where we can review the history of foreigners working (and dying) alongside Koreans to keep this great country free. Where I come from we judge people by what they do, not their racial background. This airline has come a long, long way while you haven’t been watching and if you want to find out just how far it’s come then take up this offer of genuine communication NOW. If you come with an open mind you won’t be disappointed.
My Bible suggests that at this time of year "Peace and Goodwill" should be the themes we pursue. I think this has gone on long enough. Let's do something positive for a change.
Happy Christmas folks and safe flying.
Viastra
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G.Khan,
.....and I certainly will continue to fly Korean Airlines. I tell you Human Nature is hard to understand...nobody is really ever happy, they always seem to want want want..........
Has there ever been a fist fight in the cockpit or between the pilots at Korean? From all indications in this post it sure seems headed that way.
.....and I certainly will continue to fly Korean Airlines. I tell you Human Nature is hard to understand...nobody is really ever happy, they always seem to want want want..........
Has there ever been a fist fight in the cockpit or between the pilots at Korean? From all indications in this post it sure seems headed that way.
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Singapore
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Guys instead of making fools of ourselves in reacting to obvious very stupid statements, why don’t we celebrate a little bit of the Christmas spirit and think of our friends in Sabena and Swissair who are really out of a job, and all because of real bad management. I believe that the best reaction here to these aggressive and slanderous statements from these 2 or 3 local Korean pilots is to completely ignore them. I wish you all a merry Christmas and a happy New Year.
