Boeing down in Cotonou (merged)
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Location: "como todo buen piloto... mujeriego y borracho"
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You Kapufniks hate it when the media rushes into speculations ought to watch your own speculation, especially when the media cruises aviation forums like "johns" looking for juicy "interpretations" from "experts."
Personally, I would love to know what happened also, but I'll wait for the year or two until the real experts (those who kick tin and review the tapes) come out with the most interesting and accurate interpretation of what probably happened.
Personally, I would love to know what happened also, but I'll wait for the year or two until the real experts (those who kick tin and review the tapes) come out with the most interesting and accurate interpretation of what probably happened.
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like for other air disasters on that continent, we will never know the cause(s) as there will be no serious investigation. Lack of means, expertise, will, motivation etc etc, on top of that regulating authorities are as much responsible as the bunch of business men that run these airlines, so what...
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Is it possible to change the number on a Airliner? Comparing the crashed 727 to the missing 727.
When I look at the pictures of the two aircraft note the makings on the tail, even though maybe repainted, there are similarities.
link to crashed craft.
http://www.airliners.net/open.file/478565/M/
link to missing craft.
http://www.airliners.net/open.file?i...B0aGlzIGV4LUFB
When I look at the pictures of the two aircraft note the makings on the tail, even though maybe repainted, there are similarities.
link to crashed craft.
http://www.airliners.net/open.file/478565/M/
link to missing craft.
http://www.airliners.net/open.file?i...B0aGlzIGV4LUFB
Aisle seat, please.
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For more information on the aircraft involved and for a reminder of the human side of this tragedy it is worth looking at some of the posts on the African Aviation forum.
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...hreadid=113289
Edited to add the URL
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...hreadid=113289
Edited to add the URL
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B727 Accident
I felt very soory for those who lost thier life in Africa on Board the B727.
All reports indicate that the aircraft hit the building at the end of the runway while the Landing Gears still down and that they suspected that the aircraft was over weight.
This Aircraft was previously planned to go on Labanese registeration and the application was rejected due to safety concern (Maintenance History) and that aircraft was not brought up todate by the owner who is based in Sharjah, United Arab Emirates.
The owner is known for his reputation attitude toward maintenance and compliance with regulations.......
This give a clear indication that this owner is not only cutting corners in sfaety and maintenance but intentially harming people on board and should face the consequences.
It is a sad things to see people like that in Aviation.............
And it is time for Authorities to step and take sever action against those people specially in The UAE where many charters arlines are based thier using it as a base for maintenance while the aircraft is registered in Non accountable Authorities like New Guinee, Swaziland< Kinshasa, Sudan and many others.....
All reports indicate that the aircraft hit the building at the end of the runway while the Landing Gears still down and that they suspected that the aircraft was over weight.
This Aircraft was previously planned to go on Labanese registeration and the application was rejected due to safety concern (Maintenance History) and that aircraft was not brought up todate by the owner who is based in Sharjah, United Arab Emirates.
The owner is known for his reputation attitude toward maintenance and compliance with regulations.......
This give a clear indication that this owner is not only cutting corners in sfaety and maintenance but intentially harming people on board and should face the consequences.
It is a sad things to see people like that in Aviation.............
And it is time for Authorities to step and take sever action against those people specially in The UAE where many charters arlines are based thier using it as a base for maintenance while the aircraft is registered in Non accountable Authorities like New Guinee, Swaziland< Kinshasa, Sudan and many others.....
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maintenance
Yes, it is sad indeed. There are few new airlines in SE Asia using old 727s , so I hope the maintenance is ok. There is a new one operating between Changi and Medan now. This is Jatayu airlines who are using just one 727 to fly between Surabaya - singapore - medan and batam. I do hope its well maintained.
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Who was right?
Overloading blamed for air crash
Lebanon says overloading may have caused Thursday's plane crash in Benin that killed over 130 people, many of them Lebanese residents of West Africa.
After returning to Beirut with 15 survivors, Lebanon's Foreign Minister Jean Obeid said there seemed to have been too many people and bags on board.
Fifteen Bangladeshi UN peacekeepers were among those who died in the crash.
The Beirut-bound plane plunged into the sea shortly after taking off from Cotonou, the main city in Benin.
Twenty-two people survived, including the Lebanese pilot of the Boeing 727, which was carrying 161 people.
Most of those on board the plane were Lebanese nationals returning to Lebanon during the Christmas holiday. Cotonou has a large Lebanese community.
Mr Obeid said there should be an investigation in Lebanon, in addition to one already launched in Benin.
"It appears that the number of passengers exceeds the normal number, in addition to the load, which it appears was very much in excess," he told reporters in Beirut.
Bodies laid out on beach
A military spokesman in the Bangladesh capital, Dhaka, said its soldiers had been returning home on leave.
Thirteen of them had been serving as UN peacekeepers in Sierra Leone. Two others had been stationed in Liberia, he said.
Hundreds of emergency workers, troops and fishermen in Benin joined the recovery effort on Friday.
One of the aircraft's flight recorders was recovered and investigators hope it will help to identify the reasons behind the crash.
On Friday Lebanese divers and medical staff joined the rescue efforts. Thousands of Beninois looked on as the divers pulled the plane's wreckage out of the Atlantic Ocean.
Bodies were laid out on the beach, which was thronged by onlookers as well as emergency workers.
Many of the survivors were in the back of the aircraft and managed to swim the hundred metres or so to shore after it crashed into the sea.
One survivor said: "Everything went blank in front of us. I found myself in the sea, I looked around and I saw my son.
"I took him to the beach, I went back to the sea, saw my wife and took her to the beach as well. I couldn't find my little girl."
Investigation
The plane belonged to a charter airline called Union des Transports Africains (UTA).
It is reportedly controlled by Guinean and Lebanese owners, and is unrelated to the former French airline UTA.
The company operates between Africa, Lebanon, and Dubai.
It had been denied registration in Lebanon for failing to fulfil "technical requirements", the Lebanese press quoted Transport Minister Najib Miqati as saying.
UTA Flight 141 originated in Conakry, the capital of Guinea, and had stopped in Freetown in Sierra Leone, before landing in Cotonou. It was bound for Beirut and Dubai.
Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/h...ca/3351083.stm
Published: 2003/12/27 12:59:30 GMT
© BBC MMIII
Lebanon says overloading may have caused Thursday's plane crash in Benin that killed over 130 people, many of them Lebanese residents of West Africa.
After returning to Beirut with 15 survivors, Lebanon's Foreign Minister Jean Obeid said there seemed to have been too many people and bags on board.
Fifteen Bangladeshi UN peacekeepers were among those who died in the crash.
The Beirut-bound plane plunged into the sea shortly after taking off from Cotonou, the main city in Benin.
Twenty-two people survived, including the Lebanese pilot of the Boeing 727, which was carrying 161 people.
Most of those on board the plane were Lebanese nationals returning to Lebanon during the Christmas holiday. Cotonou has a large Lebanese community.
Mr Obeid said there should be an investigation in Lebanon, in addition to one already launched in Benin.
"It appears that the number of passengers exceeds the normal number, in addition to the load, which it appears was very much in excess," he told reporters in Beirut.
Bodies laid out on beach
A military spokesman in the Bangladesh capital, Dhaka, said its soldiers had been returning home on leave.
Thirteen of them had been serving as UN peacekeepers in Sierra Leone. Two others had been stationed in Liberia, he said.
Hundreds of emergency workers, troops and fishermen in Benin joined the recovery effort on Friday.
One of the aircraft's flight recorders was recovered and investigators hope it will help to identify the reasons behind the crash.
On Friday Lebanese divers and medical staff joined the rescue efforts. Thousands of Beninois looked on as the divers pulled the plane's wreckage out of the Atlantic Ocean.
Bodies were laid out on the beach, which was thronged by onlookers as well as emergency workers.
Many of the survivors were in the back of the aircraft and managed to swim the hundred metres or so to shore after it crashed into the sea.
One survivor said: "Everything went blank in front of us. I found myself in the sea, I looked around and I saw my son.
"I took him to the beach, I went back to the sea, saw my wife and took her to the beach as well. I couldn't find my little girl."
Investigation
The plane belonged to a charter airline called Union des Transports Africains (UTA).
It is reportedly controlled by Guinean and Lebanese owners, and is unrelated to the former French airline UTA.
The company operates between Africa, Lebanon, and Dubai.
It had been denied registration in Lebanon for failing to fulfil "technical requirements", the Lebanese press quoted Transport Minister Najib Miqati as saying.
UTA Flight 141 originated in Conakry, the capital of Guinea, and had stopped in Freetown in Sierra Leone, before landing in Cotonou. It was bound for Beirut and Dubai.
Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/h...ca/3351083.stm
Published: 2003/12/27 12:59:30 GMT
© BBC MMIII
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Rodiano,
You have some very accurate background on the owner of this aircraft. He is based in Sharjah, but he is originally from Palestine and holds a US passport. His home is in Miami and he hides under the name J Taylor Investments.
I hate to say this but I saw something like this coming when on 7 Nov I made a post about his Dangerous B747 operation flying pilgrims out of Tripoli to Jedah. I contacted the authorities in the countries where he is operating his aircraft and where it is registered with no response.
I believe the cockpit crew was from Syria-not sure. He focuses on crews that are "Down and Out in Aviation" and are willing to work for cheap wages. They are more willing to take his bullying and will accept an aircraft that is overweight and not on the "UP and Up" when it comes to maintenance.
I am very sorry to see the loss of life that this man has caused and I hope he is unable to sleep at night and is unable to look at himself in the mirror every morning.
The Plumber
You have some very accurate background on the owner of this aircraft. He is based in Sharjah, but he is originally from Palestine and holds a US passport. His home is in Miami and he hides under the name J Taylor Investments.
I hate to say this but I saw something like this coming when on 7 Nov I made a post about his Dangerous B747 operation flying pilgrims out of Tripoli to Jedah. I contacted the authorities in the countries where he is operating his aircraft and where it is registered with no response.
I believe the cockpit crew was from Syria-not sure. He focuses on crews that are "Down and Out in Aviation" and are willing to work for cheap wages. They are more willing to take his bullying and will accept an aircraft that is overweight and not on the "UP and Up" when it comes to maintenance.
I am very sorry to see the loss of life that this man has caused and I hope he is unable to sleep at night and is unable to look at himself in the mirror every morning.
The Plumber
Regarding the earlier report(s) that the a/c experienced "...trouble retracting its undercarriage..."
Unless this came from the F/O, who is reported in this forum as having survived, upon what basis would an observer be able to make such a determination??
D&W
Unless this came from the F/O, who is reported in this forum as having survived, upon what basis would an observer be able to make such a determination??
D&W
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Hate to get on my 'West Africa hobby horse' again but overloading is just another example of the many and varied ways they'll try to kill you down there.
I once had to operate a 'round the houses' domestic 737 duty in Lagos. Due to fuel being unavailable at one of the down route ports of call we had to carry through fuel. This meant we were right up to max RTOW out of Lagos. We informed the so called 'load controller' that we couldn't take the regular newspaper load on this run.
Later while sitting in the cockpit we were amazed to see the three tons of newspapers being driven out to the aircraft. I opened my window and told the ****** in no uncertain terms to clear off with his newspapers. He drove away reluctantly.
Later, when I did the walkaround at the first outstation, what do I see being off-loaded from the aircraft? You got it...the goddamn three tons of newspapers! The bastards had just driven them round the back where we couldn't see 'em and put them in the hold!
We were at least three tons overweight on take-off in 35deg temperatures!
Every time I rotated an aircraft in Lagos I'd wonder if we were going flying....or farming today.
I once had to operate a 'round the houses' domestic 737 duty in Lagos. Due to fuel being unavailable at one of the down route ports of call we had to carry through fuel. This meant we were right up to max RTOW out of Lagos. We informed the so called 'load controller' that we couldn't take the regular newspaper load on this run.
Later while sitting in the cockpit we were amazed to see the three tons of newspapers being driven out to the aircraft. I opened my window and told the ****** in no uncertain terms to clear off with his newspapers. He drove away reluctantly.
Later, when I did the walkaround at the first outstation, what do I see being off-loaded from the aircraft? You got it...the goddamn three tons of newspapers! The bastards had just driven them round the back where we couldn't see 'em and put them in the hold!
We were at least three tons overweight on take-off in 35deg temperatures!
Every time I rotated an aircraft in Lagos I'd wonder if we were going flying....or farming today.
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So far we have had 3 pages of speculation and anecdotes about overloading in Africa, forgeting that there have also been incidents/accidents related to overloading in Europe/America/Asia.
If this crash had happened in Europe, we would no doubt have had 3 pages of condolences and sympathies instead.
If this crash had happened in Europe, we would no doubt have had 3 pages of condolences and sympathies instead.
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obiukwu, rubbish!
overloading in darkest Africa in no speculation, it's the rule!
and if you knew by how much!
You know why airplanes manage to takeoff here, and why we don't have a crash everyday?
Because God is Congolese.
overloading in darkest Africa in no speculation, it's the rule!
and if you knew by how much!
You know why airplanes manage to takeoff here, and why we don't have a crash everyday?
Because God is Congolese.