Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Flight Deck Forums > Rumours & News
Reload this Page >

Cosmic Radiation & Flight Crew (merged)

Wikiposts
Search
Rumours & News Reporting Points that may affect our jobs or lives as professional pilots. Also, items that may be of interest to professional pilots.

Cosmic Radiation & Flight Crew (merged)

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 30th Oct 2003, 08:41
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Rockytop, Tennessee, USA
Posts: 5,898
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Solar Flares Cut Airplane Radio Contact - AP

I was over the pond a few days ago after another CME, signals were weak but noise levels were low so no problem with Shanwick and Gander.
_________________________________________


Solar Flares Cut Airplane Radio Contact

By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

Published: October 29, 2003

Filed at 7:48 p.m. ET

TORONTO (AP) -- Airplanes flying north of the 57th parallel experienced some disruptions in high frequency radio communications Wednesday due to the geomagnetic storm from solar flares.

Louis Garneau, spokesman for the company that handles Canada's civil aviation navigation service, described the disruptions as an ``inconvenience'' for air traffic controllers at Canadian stations that handle an average of 300 northern flights daily.

``The solar flares are causing some disruption on our high frequency voice-radio communications,'' he said.

Flights that go north of latitude 57 degrees, which runs from northern Scotland across Hudson Bay to the lower tip of Alaska and across Russia, were required to stay on specific routes Wednesday, Garneau said. Those flights include commercial jets crossing the North Atlantic and transport planes flying over the Arctic.

By prohibiting route changes, such as altitude shifts to deal with high winds, air traffic controllers can pinpoint a specific plane's location more easily, Garneau said.

``It reduces the complexity of the airspace,'' he said. ``We're not stopping any traffic movement, we're just restricting the routes taken by aircraft so we can ensure we have a better estimate of their position.''

High frequency, or HF, communications involve the radio contact between planes that are out of radar range or very high frequency -- VHF -- range. That generally applies to planes crossing oceans or flying over vast undeveloped regions such as the Arctic. On approaching airports, the planes have radar and VHF contact.

Planes also have satellite tracking devices and emergency VHF communications to make contact in the event of a problem, Garneau said.

Even if the solar flares knocked out all satellite and HF radio contact, he said, it was likely a troubled plane could make VHF contact with another aircraft or military monitoring station.


___________________________________

From www.spaceweather.com:

STORM IN PROGRESS: A severe geomagnetic storm is in progress. Sky watchers at all latitudes should be alert for auroras after local nightfall. (Auroras are visible right now over Ireland and England.) Meanwhile, another powerful solar flare (X11-class) has erupted from giant sunspot 486 at 2049 UT on Oct. 29th. The blast hurled a coronal mass ejection toward Earth, which could excite more auroras when it arrives on or about Halloween.
Airbubba is offline  
Old 30th Oct 2003, 12:03
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Avondale Heights
Posts: 21
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Danger FAA CAMI suggests FL250 Max above 35' North due solar activity

ZCZC SWXALTPAV
TTAA00 KWNP 292128

Space Weather Message Code: ALTPAV
Serial Number: 862
Issue Time: 2003 Oct 29 2128 UTC

UPDATE ALERT: Altitude Update for Solar Radiation Alert
Alert Conditions Began: 2003 Oct 29 2105 UTC

Comment:
A solar proton event in progress may lead to excessive radiation doses to air travelers at Corrected Geomagnetic Latitudes above 35 degrees north or south.

See map at http://www.cami.jccbi.gov/radiation.html

See article at http://www.usatoday.com/weather/news...ar-storm_x.htm

Current recommended maximum flight altitude: 25 000 feet.

Solar radiation
Altitude effective dose rate
(feet) (millisieverts/hour) *
-------------------------------
20 000 >0.0049
30 000 >0.023
40 000 >0.062
50 000 >0.11
60 000 >0.17
70 000 >0.25
80 000 >0.36
-------------------------------

* Estimates for high-latitude locations. Dose rates are based on near real-time GOES satellite measurements and are recalculated every three minutes.

More information at http://www.cami.jccbi.gov/radiation.html
25 000 feet
Clipper811 is offline  
Old 30th Oct 2003, 15:52
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: 50N30W
Posts: 63
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts


And naturally all the airlines are keeping
their a/c at low altitudes. Not!

Money comes first and they don't care about the
occupants. I'm going to be an accountant. Much safer.
(unless you did the Enron audit).

Rgds
A/P Disc is offline  
Old 30th Oct 2003, 17:22
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 336
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Since airlines know about this and are not prepared to prevent their customers and staff from the known hazard, they may pay the price in a few years time when someone claims compensation for the result of their unnecessary exposure, be it a passenger or a crew member.

An interesting article about this can be found HERE .

Imagine the publicity coup available to any airline actually flying lower for the relatively short duration of such storms. "We take more care of you" perhaps!
snooky is offline  
Old 30th Oct 2003, 18:37
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Europe
Posts: 3,261
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Powerful solar flare collides with earth
By Christine Hauser/NYT (NYT)
Thursday, October 30, 2003


A powerful blast of gas from the sun has hit the earth's magnetic field, affecting power grids and airplane radio communications but posing no danger to air travel, experts said Wednesday.

"We got the real McCoy today," said the chief of space weather operations at the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, Joe Kunches. "The eruption from the sun yesterday just squared up with the earth and it has caused the Earth's magnetic field to become extremely disturbed."

On Tuesday, the third-most powerful solar flare ever observed in X-ray wavelengths erupted from a spot on the sun, propelling electrically charged gas at the Earth, said scientists with the National Aeronautic and Space Administration, and the European Space Agency.

Kunches said the space-weather storm was the strongest since July 14, 2000. "This is a big deal," he said.

For a brief period early Wednesday Eastern time, gusts in the solar wind as it blew by the Earth caused a geomagnetic storm of G-5 magnitude on the NOAA Space Weather Scales, a systemized measuring index, like the Richter scale for earthquakes. G-5 is the highest category.

But Kunches said the storm had since weakened from the G-5 level, which meant it was capable of degrading satellite and high-frequency radio communications as well as causing power blackouts.

A radiation storm Wednesday morning strong enough to expose people on aircraft in high latitudes to elevated radiation also tapered off.

Scientists have been monitoring unusually fierce eruptions from the Sun since last week and have stayed in contact with power-grid operators in the Northeast United States to inform them of the potential for disturbances.

"They have told us they are seeing induced currents in their power grids, but they are able to work their way through them," Kunches said. "They are running their power systems in a much more conservative fashion that is not nearly as profitable but more resilient."

He said the agency had also discussed the solar storms with radio communications operators working with aircraft. "We know there have been difficult conditions at times over the North Atlantic," Kunches said. "They can't use the frequencies that they normally use."

This means that as some of the frequency paths become disrupted, the aircraft must switch to others. For passengers, it could mean only enduring a bumpy ride for a little longer if there is turbulence.

An official with the high-frequency radio provider to the Federal Aviation Administration said that the normal radio path for aircraft is impaired, but that there is access to other channels.

Gaffney said it usually took three minutes to deliver messages between the aircraft and the FAA, but over the last day or so, a few had run over three minutes.

The New York Times
flyblue is offline  
Old 30th Oct 2003, 19:09
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Ayrshire, Scotland
Posts: 474
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Nice show of the Northern lights last night and another expected after 2300 tonight. Another solar flare detected yesterday with resulting arrival of X,Y and Z rays in the next 36 hours (in non technical speak)


You don't think the world is going to end with 57 days until Christmas just when I started my shopping early for once ??
Findo is offline  
Old 30th Oct 2003, 22:27
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 462
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
interesting topic - how does this affect power grids ?
Golden Rivet is offline  
Old 30th Oct 2003, 23:11
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
How does this also affect the on-board computers? Isnt high energy radiation more likely to upset them than the passengers?
birdofprey is offline  
Old 31st Oct 2003, 03:09
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: the Tearooms of Mars
Posts: 206
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I was on the ground for this one, but the storm in 2001 produced some of the most spectacular auroras I’ve seen. Strangely enough during that one we couldn’t HF to Gander for peanuts, but VHF worked out to 40W.

The power grid phenomenon also affects pipelines etc, and indeed any conducting circuits. The disturbance to the Earths magnetic field, which can cause 10 deg heading changes in compasses, also induces powerful currents in conductors. On a large grid, these currents can either add to or counter the current flowing in the wires which if they exceed the design current will trip the protection. In pipelines, the current might cause arcing, which has obvious implications for petrochemical installations.

I’m always amazed by Mother nature, and her ability to cause Man to be humbled when he doesn’t understand her.
Capt H Peacock is offline  
Old 31st Oct 2003, 06:18
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Ayrshire, Scotland
Posts: 474
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I'm going outside to look .................. I may be sometime
Findo is offline  
Old 31st Oct 2003, 06:36
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: n/a
Posts: 1,425
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
fantastic aurora , bright red band and several green lines on a white background. Visible from overhead dutch/german border at 25,000 feet bout an hour ago.
Daysleeper is offline  
Old 31st Oct 2003, 07:22
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Toronto
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Intense pink display seen in the east just after sunset in Toronto. Reduced in intensity and moved west over a 45 min period. Keep an eye on the sky, it's a beautiful sight if you are so lucky to catch one!

Last edited by slsman; 2nd Nov 2003 at 01:40.
slsman is offline  
Old 31st Oct 2003, 11:34
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: UK
Age: 49
Posts: 52
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Just back from flying to Glasgow at 20000ft, my first real sight of the aurora, a red glow above and to the north with green and white bands, beautiful and most humbling...........
JOSHUA is offline  
Old 31st Oct 2003, 14:04
  #14 (permalink)  
nec
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Chocolateland
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Question...I felt so sad Wednesday..is it possible the storm affects your emotions and/or electrical circuits/hormones? I was on the verge of tears the whole day. Weird. Had no idea why i felt so weepy and sad..Felt fine the next day..anyone else feel sad?
nec is offline  
Old 31st Oct 2003, 16:06
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 737
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I did want to cruise at lower levels yesterday, but prevented by turbulence. Fantastic show with the aurora last night, best I've ever seen, going past NTS about 2100Z, most impressive. Glad I've had my kids though, don't want any coming out with two heads!
squeaker is offline  
Old 31st Oct 2003, 19:15
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: In my own little world
Posts: 1,477
Likes: 0
Received 8 Likes on 2 Posts
FL320 over Asturias (N. Spain) last night about 00Z the display was really nice, reds and whites. Lasted about 45 minutes. Nice to be able to see it without going over Greenland.
lurkio is online now  
Old 31st Oct 2003, 20:54
  #17 (permalink)  

Rainbow Chaser
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: At home, mostly!
Posts: 608
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Wink

and ... did anyone have a camera with them? if not .. please do try and remember if you are flying before the end of the current series! It would be great for us land-bound folks to see aerial shots of auroras (aurorae?) for a change!

Well .. what I mean is I would like to see some aerial pics of them
brockenspectre is offline  
Old 1st Nov 2003, 15:55
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Northwich
Posts: 179
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
BS - Tried to take a photo with my digital camera but it was just a mass of ionised clutter....time to descend.

Going to Oslo tomorrow.....full tanks...and will have a closer look at the oil rigs.
alosaurus is offline  
Old 1st Nov 2003, 16:28
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Australia
Posts: 45
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Clipper 811, where did you get that CAMI alert from? I have checked the page you gave and canot find it.
FlareArmed2 is offline  
Old 2nd Nov 2003, 00:09
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Avondale Heights
Posts: 21
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
FlareArmed2,
The message was issued to crews during flight planning. Msg contents confirmed by company. Latest msg issued was "ops normal" with assurances that further disturbances would be monitored "appropriately." Here is a link from USAToday that mentions FL250, regarding the disturbance.
http://www.usatoday.com/weather/news...ew-flare_x.htm
Clipper811 is offline  


Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.