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Sadly, Air Support falls in the 'nice to have' column, although many on here think that society will fall appart and chaos reign without Air Support Everyone agrees savings have to be made, but I do wonder if they are being made in the right places? How much does a PCSO cost per annum? |
Everyone agrees savings have to be made, but I do wonder if they are being made in the right places? How much does a PCSO cost per annum? |
Spoken like a true Cop, one that sits in the crew roon looking at a 50inch plasma( we need it for flight safety videos and to show officers pursuits etc) pontificating on how poor officers at division are and how it should be done. If your going to start looking at what is and isn't needed have a look around the crew room and in a mirror. When was the last time you worked for the whole of a shift, and I don't mean just monitoring logs. Two or three hours flying is a busy shift. What do you do for the other five? We are in a glasshouse, we shouldn't be throwing stones! |
Well done Chasps
Police_helicopter_called_in_to_rescue_girls_trapped_by_tide_ at_Easington
A POLICE helicopter was called into action last night to rescue two young girls trapped by the tide in Easington Colliery. The alarm was raised shortly after 7.30pm when the pair, both 12-years-old found themselves caught out by the incoming tide. One of the girls had called the police from her mobile phone and given brief details, but efforts to contact her again for more information were initially thwarted when the phone kept diverting to voicemail. In the meantime, the North-East police helicopter, which is shared between the Northumbria and Durham forces, was dispatched to the area and a call made to the coastguard on the Humber. The police air observer soon located the two girls who were by now sheltering in a cove. The helicopter then landed on the beach and collected the pair, who were unharmed. After landing in a nearby car park the crew handed the friends over to their parents fit and well. |
Wagging Finger Quote: Wagging Finger. I'm not sure what point you are trying to make. What's more I'm not sure that you grasped the point I was trying to make! However, I am sure that Sid knows the point I was trying to make. So, point made!! :D:D Point well made, whatever point it was in the first place, is there a point to all this? |
Health and safety dept.
Corporate communications dept. Diversity department. Business change directive. Are these departments essential, or also shiny things that we don't need. Well my force are keeping them, not chopping them. ie ring fenced..!!! WF, If your force haven't ring-fenced certain depts, then they should have. You may well support NPAS, but personally I can't wait for it all to fall on its a@rse, so I can laugh my socks off. And the people that will pull the plug, will be the bean counters. Because financially (amongst the rest of it) its all bollox. The lack of hard facts and figures is showing what a farce it all is. |
but personally I can't wait for it all to fall on its a@rse, so I can laugh my socks off Morris. If we assume that the service we provided before the demise of Merseyside, Cambridge and Hampshire was (for want of a better phrase), 'gold plated'. Your view appears to be that we should run either a gold plated service or none at all. :ugh: If you stop and think about it for a minute, that is an exceptionally arrogant view. Either NPAS do it in a way that you like or you want the whole organisation to crash and burn!:confused: It matters not whether other departments within the police service have been ring fenced, Air Support is destined to become a national organisation. So we (or they, if I'm not destined to be involved), either make the best of what we have left or we throw our collective teddies in the corner and sulk like you appear to be doing. I appreciate that we may not be able to compensate for the losses of units and aircraft but if we believe that we are there to provide a public service then that is what we are obliged to try and do. It is public money we are spending. I doubt there is a UEO, observer or pilot in the country who has not made every effort to try and preserve their own bit of air support for both altruistic and selfish reasons but EVERY Chief Constable has supported this change (and they are the ones empowered to make these decisions, not you or I) and it does actually seem to be happening. Other than the valiant attempts made by the unit, force and population of South Yorkshire you will notice that the press is devoid of huge long articles about the impending demise of air support in England and Wales. That is because 1. It won't be dead (it will be different) and 2. Nobody (outside of our own little community), cares. It doesn't help anybody who is in a unit that may close but given the scale of the spending cuts in the public sector, I still think NPAS is the least worst solution for maximising the number of police aircraft available to the police forces of England and Wales! |
Mightygem, thanks for the advice, suitably calm now and feeling better.
Handysnaks, well said, It doesn't help anybody who is in a unit that may close but given the scale of the spending cuts in the public sector, I still think NPAS is the least worst solution for maximising the number of police aircraft available to the police forces of England and Wales! No doubt the resident troll will be back to anger me again at some stage, until then I'm having a rest in a darkened room:ok: |
Handy, you sum up the situation perfectly with 1&2. Particularly 2.
Interesting seeing peoples comments like Lavas accusing people of accepting 2nd best. Get your head out of the sand (or lava) and think. Yes this is second best, but what EXACTLY other than griping, can you do about it? See 2 above, people don't care a toss! They don't even need to see a saving, they blindly accept that cuts are happening therefore money is being saved. Levels of service? Levels shevels! This is the situation that I accept in life. You need to as well. If you want to see the public fight back, then choose something they care about. Watch this space if Dave cuts more benefits.......:ugh: |
Handy's No2 has it in a nutshell.
As we have seen, the Government let alone the public, are quite anti when it comes to Police pay, conditions, pensions, cutbacks etc etc, do we really expect them to give a hoot about the officers and staff flying about in helicopters? In the words of a 'senior suit' when a particular units ac went up in flames, "Looks like you've lost your 'boys toy' for a while then". With morris saying things like "I can't wait for it all to fall on its a@rse, so I can laugh my socks off ", I wonder if he will be allowing, nay encouraging his unit to under perform to prove a point... in which case the rest of us might be safe when the next round of closures come along, because bet your bottom dollar they will and which units would you get rid of if you were at the helm !! |
For the record.
After 24 years service I've seen lots of schemes come and go. I've also seen lots of "new" working practices further the careers of many a senior officer, only for them to be reinventing the wheel. Throughout all, I keep doing my job despite the interference and meddling, and keep catching baddies with whatever tools I have. The helicopter says "police" on it. While ever that's the case, that's what I'll do because Im an attested Officer of the crown. Call me a troll if you like but I reserve the right to criticise a development which lessens my ability to catch bad people doing bad things. If there are people out there who think that cops would deliberately run a unit down and not go out there day after day and keep trying to catch the baddies, despite npas, then you just don't get the point of it all. |
Nice words morris, nice words;
The helicopter says "police" on it. While ever that's the case, that's what I'll do because Im an attested Officer of the crown. Call me a troll if you like but I reserve the right to criticise a development which lessens my ability to catch bad people doing bad things. |
It hasn't yet in my area because it doesnt exist yet.
I'll keep you posted. |
So how do you know it will lessen that ability?
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Silsoe I really don't have time to be drawn into a bun fight with you.
I know your a fan because of how cross border work has improved in your region. That's been happening elsewhere for years. October I believe is your entry date into npas. I'll bid you good day and safe flying. |
Morris, if you really believe your own words about the future of Police Aviation and the lessening of your ability to catch the bad guys, why don't you do the decent thing, because I'm sure that after 24 years you also know that cars, vans, motorcycles and even bicycles have 'Police' written on them?
http://www.kitinfo.co.uk/images/Police-Bike-3.jpg |
NPAS Motto
source: Waypoint AirMed and Rescue Magazine
................'E pluribus unum'................ ................................"Out of many, one"...................................... Ring any bells? http://macquirelatory.com/Dollar%20B...ed_states_.jpg http://avbtab.org/rc/rev/pluribus.gif Who said it wasn't about the money anymore :suspect: |
Article in local paper
Since the Cambs aircraft went, people starting to notice the loss of it's presence. This article is from the local paper, don't shoot me for any inaccuracies over flight times etc. mentioned. Just a reflection of the public feeling in this neck of the woods.
Cambridge News article - "Fears as use of police helicopters drops by 80 per cent" |
Not really public outcry RJC, just a newspaper hack looking for a story, getting some data and asking a couple of people 'in position' who could have done something about it earlier, but chose not to, despite knowing the concerns.
All this article needs is one reply that says 'we've noticed no change in local crime' and the last nail is driven. |
Not really public outcry RJC, just a newspaper hack looking for a story, getting some data and asking a couple of people 'in position' who could have done something about it earlier, but chose not to, despite knowing the concerns. All this article needs is one reply that says 'we've noticed no change in local crime' and the last nail is driven. Often the local TV/Radio pick up the same story and put a more balanced article out a day or two later. |
I think CambsPol already have;
Local crime rates fall again | St Neots People Statistics produced by the force for the year ending March 31, show there were 51,658 crimes in 2011/12, an 8.6 per cent drop on the year before when there were 56,527. It also represents a drop of more than 20 per cent in total crime in the past three years. In 2008/09, there were 64,663 offences. In the past year, there have been significant, double-digit percentage falls in crimes including burglary, robbery, vehicle crime, violent crime and criminal damage. There was a 25.9 per cent rise in the number of drugs offences, from 2378 to 2994 offences, which is believed to be a result of the force's ongoing campaign against those supplying and producing drugs. Chief Constable Simon Parr said: "The force has undergone significant changes in the past year so I am very pleased that we have maintained our focus on tackling crime. "It is particularly pleasing to see nearly 5000 fewer victims, especially of offences such as burglary and robbery, which cause so much distress. "However, we are not complacent and I am looking forward to see the force's restructure bedding in and helping us to improve further. The force still faces significant financial challenges but our commitment remains to improve our performance and make Cambridgeshire a more hostile place for criminals to operate." Statistics for number of offences: All crime fell from 56,527 to 51,658, a drop of 8.6 per cent. Burglary fell from 3317 to 2772, a drop of 16.4 per cent. Robbery from 617 to 417, a drop of 32.4 per cent. Vehicle Crime fell from 5326 to 4531, a drop of 14.9 per cent. Theft from vehicle fell from 4191 to 3631, a drop of 13.4 per cent. Theft of vehicle fell from 1029 to 818, a drop of 20.5 per cent. All recorded violence with injury fell from 4550 to 3754, a drop of 17.5 per cent. Serious sexual offences fell from 592 to 535, a drop of 9.6 per cent. All violent crime fell from 12,185 to 10,272, a drop of 15.7 per cent. Criminal damage fell from 9171 to 8232, a drop of 10.2 per cent. All drugs offences rose from 2378 to 2994, an increase of 25.9 per cent. |
As the first round of units joining NPAS is about to start is the management and command structure all in place? Where are their offices and contact details to be found? Anyone have any ideas or info?
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Getting a bit worried there. 8 days and no posts. :}
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While we're back here, any truth that the well discussed 20 minute flying time circles, have now been transformed to;
'15 minutes from receipt of call at the control centre? :suspect: |
From the 'Waypoint' article;
Schedule and timetable for NPAS roll out to air support bases. Southeast Region - 1 Oct 2012 Redhill (new base) RAF Honington (new base) Boreham Airfield RAF Benson Northwest Region - 7 Jan 2013 Rhuddlan Hawarden City of Manchester Airport BAE Warton Northeast Region - 1 April 2013 Newcastle Airport Durham Tees Valley Airport Humberside Airport Carr Gate Sheffield Southwest Region - 1 July 2013 Exeter Bournemouth (new base) Filton MOD St Athan Pembrey Central Region - 1 Oct 2013 Halfpenny Green Airport Birmingham International Airport Husbands Bosworth Ripley London - 1 April 2014 Lippitt's Hill |
... any truth that the well discussed 20 minute flying time circles, have now been transformed to; '15 minutes from receipt of call at the control centre? so drastically, considering the 20 minutes response time was originally calculated ( IIRC ) on flying time alone. 15 minutes from receipt of call at the NPAS Control Room ( in Hampshire :rolleyes: ), will probably equate to around 12 or 13 minutes of that call being received by the crew, and by the time they get airborne it will only leave them 10 minutes from the original 20 to get on scene. Here comes the spin - That's a FANTASTIC 50% saving on flight time with a mere stroke of the pen ! Well done :D :confused: Or is the 15 minutes now going to be the MINIMUM time to arrive on scene ? ( More likely ? ) http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...conuttySad.jpg |
Re earlier post by Helinut - CC Marshall worked for TVP, but never had responsibility for air support in that force. Cambs perhaps?
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Any news on whether West Yorkshire Police did recruit an additional ACC to hold the NPAS Portfolio ?
On 25th July West Yorkshire Police Authority announced that temporary ACC John Robins had been appointed as ACC, but this was to take up the post vacated by ACC John Parkinson, on his promotion to Deputy Chief Constable. ( Who in turn took up the post vacated by David Crompton who moved to SOUTH Yorkshire as their new Chief Constable ). http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1.../Coconutty.jpg |
SS - (your post #510) is interesting in that the Cambridge figures are up to 31st March 2012, and therefore include the aircraft as one of their tools to reduce crime, until the following day when they waved goodbye to it.
I wonder how the statisticians will ma/n/ss/age the figures over the current year?? :confused: |
It would appear that the "NPAS effect" has taken its toll at south yorks and their engineers have voted with their feet and walked..!
I hear they're AOG right now with NO engineering staff to do the work.! |
Another aircraft for ECPM at Wattisham to look after then.
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Either that or the sales director at PAS will be looking for a Xmas bonus..!
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Perhaps the engineers have simply moved over to ECPM.
Full story required methinks :rolleyes: |
Only got info third hand.
However the info I got was that they (engineers) weren't convinced by npas HR people about future of the unit and tupe situation. Thus gone to pastures new (outside of police aviation). They defo AOG at the moment, WYP been doing jobs for them. |
SS check PM
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Morris. Only one has gone and he was leaving to go back to NZ anyway. We are allowed holidays you know and will return when our AOG part arrives.
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Just heard it's the Gearbox - fond memories of a visit to the European Distribution Centre -
where a newly delivered Transmission took pride of place ( in days gone by when they were in short supply ! ). http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1.../Coconutty.jpg |
Ah the rumour mill got ahead of itself ooop north then. Our unit heard the last one out had turned off the lights.
lol. Glad to hear SYP still fighting..! |
observer job description
Part A - job description.
Sec 4. "to participate in the promotion of NPAS to the public and to the client police services in order to maintain a positive perception of the national police air support service role". |
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