word on the street is still no AOC yet,

ec135driver - good to hear that the 135 will be starting on 1 Jan - heard rumours that it has been having payload problems.

JP

Let me just add one here please. 68k is NOT comparable with the onshore salaries for captains. You are tens of thousands out there!! I have just been taken on by Bond, they have a set pay scale and I am receiving a substantial pay rise from my present post with a major UK onshore company. I am very happy with the terms and conditions offered, but I would crawl over broken glass for that 68k mentioned. My initial impressions are that BAS are well organised, pilot friendly (views of current pilots) and very competetive on T&Cs.

Cork is running on the present BAS AOC I have been told.

So, are the salaries really low because they will have to offset the cost of running an N3 in place of the proposed 135's? Rumours of only 155kg of available payload with the 135's out of Cork?? Surely an operator should be able to carry more than that? :eek:(nothing to do with the only suitable alternates/ diversion airfields and fuel requirements for same i'm sure)

Has someone got their figures wrong somewhere or is the rumour closer to the truth than Bond would like to admit? :E

Anyone care to say what an offshore equipped 135T2+ weighs? I'd guess at about 2000kg.

BAS AOC does not allow for Offshore work only windfarm stuff, also spot on with payload, must have been some big fibs on the tender form,:=

Bond Cork
 

After speaking with one of the pilots last week he said The contract will be up and running with no problems and they also thought they would have payload issues but the aircraft has come in at just under 1940kgs so they can take 4 paxs with baggage ifr reserves, the client loves the new aircraft and pays way less than the current old aircraft. They may have to do two trips but that has all been agreed and the client is very happy. They have submitted the aoc manuals as they are going to get their own stand alone Irish aoc as they have a lot of contracts they are looking at so could be good news for pilots I personally hope so.

I stand corrected. Cheers.:ok:

Ragman, out of interest, can you tell me what IFR alternate they are using and any chance of a breakdown on the weights for planning purposes?

Are any of the CHC guys staying on?

Hi Helimutt, All I was told was that they would be most likely be using Shannon as the alternate for IFR, I dont know the breakdown on the weights other than they were happy the aircraft came in at 1940kgs and all up weight is 2910kgs with 20 minute transit time to the rig at 30 nm from airport.

For Serf no chc guys joined they turned down the positions and are getting re located within chc.

Brialliant stuff your are semi correct actually as they are going to operate on bond offshore helicopters aoc untill the stand alone Irish aoc is issued

Cheers.:ok:

2910-1940 = 970 kg's

Oh well then, the rumours were just that.:ok: Don't know where they got the figure of 155kg's from. ;)

2910 Kgs - 1940 Kgs = 970 Kgs
20 mins transit time at 200 Kgs per hour = 70 Kgs
20 mins back = 70 kgs
Deck Fuel = 20 Kgs or so
Alternate Cork to Shannon 20/25 mins = 70/85 Kgs
Approach at Rig and at Shannon = 50 Kgs
2 Crew at Standard weights 85 Kgs =170 Kgs

970 Kgs - 465 Kgs = 505 Kgs Payload

Standard weights for Offshore worker 90 Kgs and we all know the average offshore worker weighs more than 90 Kgs

Class II enhanced? How much of a weight penalty will that incur.

I take it that Cork is a small operation, with a couple of shuttles per day?

Bond 135
 

I take we are referring to the new Bond 135T2+ G-CGHP ? can anybody advise if it will be operating on G-reg or will it have to change to Irish marks ?

some nice pics would be lovely too !

Have to say that 300kg an hour would be around 100kg an hour more than any 135 I know :sad:

NF Stable
 

Weights duly adjusted but even at 505 Kgs payload its still only four passangers plus baggage and that is before taking into acount any weight penalty there will if operating to class II enhanced performance standards.

Norunway.

If Irish IFR fuel regs are same as UK you have forgotten to add 10% of calculated fuel usage and 1/2 hr loiter time at Vy which would equal about 130kgs in the Cork - rig - Cork - Shannon route. I also believe that the weight penalty for Class 1 onto the rig is 200kgs so as 100kgs of fuel is used to reach and IFR approach rig then another 100kgs needs to be taken off disposable load ex Cork. A total of 230kgs off your figs.

Using your basic figures this gives a disposable load ex Cork of approx 275Kgs or 2 workers and their bags or at a push 3 workers and no bags.

Jigspy
 

Good spot not a very good payload is it.

As per FODCOM 27/05 standard weights for offshore are male = 98 female = 77 but in the case of the 135 it will be more like actual weights due to the narrower margin.
For what it is worth.:}

Norunway

Having got your fuel burn wrong and your basic IFR fuel calculations wrong are you really in a position to comment?

Cheers

TeeS

Hi TeeS

Are my calculations nearer the mark - only thing I wasn't sure of was the penalty for operating Class 1 to the rig (which I believe is part of the contract terms).

Now I am retired it keeps my mind active doing these theoretical sums:confused:

Sorry JIGSPY

I have no idea of what the contract terms are, I just got the impression that there was a random number generator producing a lot of the figures quoted by Norunway.

Regards

TeeS

The posted calculation of 505 kgs payload didn't take into account the 110 reserve fuel or the 10%. Someone already posted this but was rudely discounted. Also 20kgs of deck time only allows for one landing when they regularly have more than that. With 8 pax possible shuttling they will need two shuttles which is more like 100kgs deck fuel.

In any case, Bond do a good job of making the numbers look better. The gas company is in for a bit of a shock.

Also heard the aircraft hasn't been approved yet for the operation, but again is only rumor.

JIGSPY - We do not operate Class 1 to offshore elevated helipad locations (PC1), due to hugely restrictive payloads, inappropriately high TDP's (cannot guarantee rejected take off outcome) amongst other issues. It will be PC2 with exposure or PC2 if the sea state can be considered suitable for a 'Safe forced landing'.

Lenticular you are spot on with your statement, the guys say it will be a minimum of two shuttles but client is very happy as they get a brand new aircraft at half the cost of the previous heli. The aircraft has been out to the rig with the CAA and completed all the necessary paperwork so it looks on target for the Jan 1st start date

Ragman 20
 

Half the cost of the previous heli but twice the number of flights.

Maybe it was

If the weather is suitable I'm sure the flights could VFR, so an onshore diversion will be sufficient, with VFR reserves. Even with an S76 payloads are reduced in the poor weather seasons due to all the IFR reserves. Over the course of a year things average themselves out.

The ROI is very expensive to live in at the moment, hope they are paying enough!

I always thought Shannon was 'onshore'??? :E

Wonder how many days a year there are which would require IFR out of Cork.

Either way, it will be interesting come january 1st, to see how well the contract runs as the customer expects.

Who knows. Who cares? It'll either be acceptable or a bag of sh*te, and the contract will go to someone else in the big game of swings and roundabouts which is the wonderful helicopter industry in the UK and immediately surrounding islands.

psst - DeltaNg, check your geography book. The one with a date AFTER 1922...! ;)

"Half the cost of the previous heli but twice the number of flights."

In the eyes of the customer that makes it "cost neutral" , might mean more flights but it doesn't cost anymore overall - a result as far as they will be concerned - they will only be interested in the bottom line ;)

They used to use the SA365 FYI.

If the 135 does not work out it will be a doddle for Bond to change it for a AS 365.
I would have thought the important thing for Bond is that they have got the contract keeping it for them shouldn't be too difficult.

Remembering how they work.

But a 365N3 at 135 rates - not a sound financial proposition. The customer is unlikely to pay 365N3 rates when the contract specifies a 135. Afterall you don't expect to pay the increased cost of a hire car if the renter has to upgrade you. Also 365N3 qualified pilots are more likely to leave when the oil exploration climate improves as the Bond Irish pay is low compared to the N Sea.

Bond Cork
 

Has anyone heard how this has panned out? Should have started Jan 1st I believe.

Yep, I wos wondering alos if anyone has seen the new ec135 or better has a pic to share.