Helicopter over Grand Canyon - which company wont kill me ?
 

going to vegas in august and i want to do a helicopter trip over the grand canyon ...

which helicopter company wont kill me !!
i looked at www.papillon.com/
then i read the acident report s !

cheers

I flew with Sundance helicopters and I'm still here !!

wrong answer ;-)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/3130220.stm


you were lucky :-p

Just out of interest--How are you getting to Las Vegas from the UK? Did you check all the airlines accident reports?

Maybe you should stay home---it would be safer.

My wife flew with Sundance a couple of years ago and enjoyed it. We're going over in the next couple of weeks but we're driving up to the canyon. Don't even want to think about the stats of the driving side!!

i'll be flying in one of mr boeings aircraft , damm site safer than some of these tour opperators seem to be .
type into google :
sundance helicopter crash
or
papillon helicopter crash

see what you get !

now try and type in Premiair helicopter crash ... nothing comes up , thats because the UK 's biggest (private) helicopter opperator doesnt seem to crash all that much ..

go figure ...

No have not studied it, but there is lots of data out there. Be careful on the road to the airport:

Road casualties UK

Make sure to go to one of the viewpoints at sunset - the colours are fantastic, and the low light shows all the wonderful relief. In the middle of the day the light doesn't do anything for it and the sun is very high in the sky which flattens it all out. I was really disappointed at first, but thrilled with it at sunset.

(the large version at Flickr is more impressive, but this gives you the idea)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/171/3...a90d5b3fe7.jpg

What a ridiculous post.

You better check your diet, if you smoke, your marital status, your socio-economic group, your other hobbies and your occupation to see what's going to kill you first.

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...60#post3716360

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...39#post2760939

Neil,

What are you implying..that UK operators don't crash. Just look on this site and you will be proved wrong---do we really want to start pulling up every crash in the history of UK registered helicopters.

With comments like yours, ..... never mind--its not worth arguing with you. Have fun on your vacation.

Maverick
 

As I understand it they are the only operator (major one) that hasnt had a Fatal. They also go the furthest into the Canyon flying EC130s.
An old instructor / employee of ours flies for them now, flew with him about a month ago - highly recommend them - very slick operation.
Geoff

Hey guess what? Nothing comes up if you type in 'Stupid English a**hole helicopter company crash' either. Go fly with them. Take your finger out of your hole first though, won't you?

Sorry, Americans. Like you we have some idiots this side of the pond too.


We try not to elect them like you do, although sometimes they still get into power;)

"Inadequate maintenance and pilot error by employees of Papillon Grand Canyon Helicopters caused separate crashes that injured eight people and destroyed two canyon-touring aircraft, federal investigators determined. "

if you want to fly with that sort of firm thats up to you . i think it was a valid question, i'm asking which company on the strip has the best safety record.

not oooOoooo isnt flying such a dangerous sport.. i'm not afraid of dangerous sports just dangerous companies...

I scuba dive a lot , i just dont scuba dive with instuctors that have killed anyone or forgot to service regs etc... same with flying .

I should have guessed i'd get the arrogant idiot comments on pprune !

Well all I can say flight was excellent with a very professional flight and ground crew, I'd definatley fly with them again !! :ok:

anti-talk .. thanks for this , i have my answer .. i'll be booking with maverick

"Maverick has the top safety record of any helicopter company in the world "

The reason the UK's largest private helicopter operator doesn't crash too often is that they probably fly in a year what the Vegas fleet do in an afternoon.

Oh... I thought you started by asking who wouldn't kill you? That, and the UK-US thing you mentioned is probably why you got....

But... you still got the answer you sought anyway. Result! Pprune aint so bad :ok:

Maverick gets my vote
 

Did a night circuit of Vegas with some people from my company last year.

The EC130 has to be the best sightseeing machine by far - modern, smooth, and fantastic visibility.

What really amazed me was how many helis turned up on the Maverick pad at sundown, they've got loads of them :ok:

Maybe one at Maverick should take note of Neil C. and have the gentleman drug-screened before take-off as HE could be a serious safety-risk!!

What an excellent "chap":ugh:

I FLEW WITH MAVERICK A COUPLE OF MONTHS AGO VERY NICE OUTFIT ASK FOR BEN NICE PILOT DEFINATLY 5 STAR . :ok:

what's all this then????,

is this an ad for maverick ????????????????????:=

an opportunity to bag the other operators perhaps?????????????

this kind of crap has no place on this forum.

SORRY IMABELL BUT MY VOTE IS WITH MAVERICK i flew with them they were good

I flew with Sundance in 2004 with some friends. Nice outfit, I even bought one of their hats.
Jarvy

type into www.ntsb.gov
NTSB ID # LAX04LA261
# LAX06CA003
# LAX 07LA281
# SEA08CA027

guess it's all in what you are looking for, isn't it now.:ugh::rolleyes:

Nigel,

Read on, and save you the hassle and chance of that the numbers catch up with you!!:{

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=326710

Seem to remember an aircraft , made and flown only by the UK/france, which was THE safest aircraft in the morning of july 25,2000, but was by sun-down THE most unsafe referred to pax-mile (or something) and ultimately grounded for good after nearly 30 years in service without a fatality! How many 747's have crashed in the same time, without being grounded?

Ive flown with Papillon (from Boulder city) and Sundance from the strip! Both were top notch and very enjoyable flights :)

neilcharlton
For a person who has been posting since 17 Feb 2006, it must appear that you either don't watch the forum often, or are blind when you do.

There is a gentleman who often scribes here, but not of late, who would be an excellent reference in matters 'Grand Canyon'. I follow his scribes with some reverence.

There have been at least a couple of threads on the subject (at least) since you were a newbie on PPRUNE.

I do suggest, have a good look about, peripheral awareness you know old boy, lack of it and you may die, or be kicked in the backside, as you deserve, until your bleeding bloody nose bleeds.
have a nice day.
tet

Grand Canyon heli tour
 

I am hoping to visit the US later this year and would like to fly over the Grand Canyon by helicopter from Las Vegas. I was just wondering if anyone had any experience of this and who is a good operator and who (if any) to avoid and what tour would people recommend.

Thanks http://static.pprune.org/images/smilies/thumbs.gif

(appologies if I have put this in the wrong thread)

You also need to see the canyon from the ground, south rim is easiest to get to and has the touristy things and also gives a great view. If you have time you should drive from Vegas (take the best part of a day but a few things to see on the way, Route 66 is part of it) and take a helicopter tour from Grand Canyon airport itself.

A few years back I rode into the Grand Canyon valley floor in one of the larger heli tour operators from Las Vegas airport (I apologise for forgetting their name now).

About 4 or 5 helicopters from the same company took off in a convoy at the same time. The chopper in front of us was flown by an ex US-army veteran. He flew very low along the nap of the earth and scraped from cliff edge to edge.

I was in the last chopper in the convoy flown by a soft-spoken Latin-American gentleman who was obviously civilian trained. He flew all sectors at least 1000 ft AGL and did no low-G or wingovers or anything like that - just absolutely straight and level with no frills whatsoever.

Yet these two pilots worked for the same company and flew the same mission at the same time. I still have the whole thing on video and occasionally I review it and wonder whether the pax in the other chopper got sick or realised how many close calls they had that afternoon.

Excellent, now upload it for us to see :}:ok:

Dave

Does anyone operate the S-55QT 'Whisperjet' jobber, Grand Canyon-wise?

I took a helicopter from Las Vegas once that actually lands in the canyon. You go for a short hike and then have lunch on the canyon floor before flying back to LV. Can't remember the name though it was a great time.

I did extensive research to answer the original question, it seems that all companies conducting Grand Canyon tours, from Grand Canyon and from Las Vegas haved pretty good records. All companies that I checked on have actually carried more tourists that they did not kill than ones that they did kill. Probably safer to do the flight than the drive up to the Canyon!
Keep in mind that this was not a scientific research project, but I do think the results were extreemly accurate.

Mark

Davy07, the video is too long to upload and so I won't bother.

It may have been the same company our mod (weasil) took by the sounds of it.

Maverick
 

Another vote for Maverick. I flew with them a few years ago and it was a very pleasant flight. Great pilots, both personable and skilled. Excellent safety and nice ships. Would definitely recommend.

I actually became good friends with the pilot I flew with and I am at the school I'm at now because of him. He's a great guy and superb pilot now flying EMS in Des Moines, IA.

... and another vote !
 

... for Maverick that is, or rather Maverick AirStar Helicopters - all very professsional when I flew with them ( as PAX ) in 2001 ...

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...11/AirStar.jpg

But whatever you do, if you should book a room overnight at one of the motels near the Grand Canyon Airport DO NOT leave your passport in the room after checking out, and then not realise until you have ridden for 250 miles on your rented Harley, broken down with a snapped throttle cable, done a gash running repair and limped into the Harley shop at Flagstaff, and then have to ride all the way back to collect said document ! :uhoh:

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...1/HDRiding.jpg

Totally agree about taking photographs, evening prior to / at sunset is best - the harsh mid-day sunlight, especially from the air will give washed out pictures like this :

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...GCAirborne.jpg

The trip is well worthwhile - the vastness of the canyon is awesome -
crossing over the rim the altimeter went from 500 feet to a mile :)

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1.../Coconutty.jpg

Yes, first light or last light is best for photographs at the canyon. If possible, bring a tripod and a remote release.

Companies
 

Hi All.
Firstly, i am one of the pilots that fly to the Canyon on a daily basis, secondly, i am a Brit so i see and hear the differences between the styles of flying between the two sides of the pond.
In regards to companies, go online and read up on them all, EACH ONE has either had and accident or incident at sometime.
I fly for Sundance and i could preach and sing my companies praises and i will if you ask me directly, but i'm not here to advertise for them.
I'm sorry to say this but the main question that started this thread is a bulls@*t question. If you are that conserned about dying, then stay on the ground.
Anyone who has done their homework will see that the last fatal accident was 51/2 years ago and the one prior was 71/2 years ago. Tours have been flown to the Canyon for close to 25 years and just Sundance alone flies over 18000 trips a year, thats a hell of alot of safe flights to one fatality and there are 4 other companies as well.
Sundance and Maverick have cameras onboard their aircraft that are used to make DVDs of the tours for the guests and as i can't speak for Maverick i can tell you that Sundance watches the trips on a regular basis to check quality of the tours but mainly to see how each pilot is flying and are they keeping to the tour routes and company standards. If not, that pilot will be let go... no 2 weeks notice or finish out the week..... gone that day.
There are no thrill rides out here in the Canyon... you might be on a flight with a pilot that throws the aircraft around and thats great to you but he/she will be spotted by one of the other 20+ aircraft that fly out at the same time and it will be reported or recorded. If you want one of those rides then you'll have to go to the top of the Stratosphere and you have 3 to choose from.

Sorry to sound a bit punchy on this subject but this is my job and i love what i do and topics like this aren't what i want to see or hear from in this industry regardless of what side of the pond it is on.
The styles of flying and aviation rules on either side are very different and even though i have never flown in the UK i have sat in one of the safety meetings at Red Hill and listen to the way things are done over there. You guys have a ton of rules and alot different to us over here.
For those interested, you will have 20+ helicopters flying the canyon at any one time... this includes decents and departures to and from the bottom and this is EVERY hour. There is NO tower in the Canyon and it is all monitered by the pilots at set reporting points and altitudes.
There is nothing i have seen or heard of in the UK or Europe that can compare to this level of aircraft activity condensed in to a corridoor that is just under a mile wide (edge of Colorado River to the Canyon wall), 15 miles long with an altitude change of 3500' in a space of 4 miles.
Regardless of who they fly for, all the boys and girls that fly in the Canyon are safety orientated. No one wants to crash, they all give good tours and want to keep their jobs.
Please come over and see us, you won't be disappointed regardless of who you fly with (prefer it to be me). It is an eye opener to see how the other half do things and if you fly let me know and i'll try and hook you up in the co-pilots plug and you'll get a first hand look at what we have to do and why we enjoy it .
Fly safe.

I guess since my name is on this I can prepare for a some flack. I flew for a couple of the companies up through 2008. About 7 years mostly part time, Im still alive. Yes there have been a few accidents, but if you check the stats you will find you have a better chance of hitting the Mega Bucks slot than getting hurt there.

Four main Companies left, Heli-USA, Papillon, Sundance, and Maverick. In looking around I think I would opt for Maverick and no, I did not work for them. Also if your going to be in Vegas look for some discounts or coupons. Nobody should get spanked for the fees they all charge. All have websites for further info.

For those who frequent the Just Helos forum you will always see morons from the companies bad mouthing each other, it goes with the territory when most of these kids are fresh off the training tit from their robbies. Just about all the pilots use tour jobs as a stepping stone or first turbine transition. The rest live in Las Vegas and like the work or the area and have done other things in their lives. It now becomes good Beer money.

Enjoy Vegas try and save a few dollars, if you have any questions My PM works. And Yes I live in Vega$.