Helicopter crash New York City
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,081
Likes: 189
From: Redding CA, or on a fire somewhere
The NTSB are better, and, can draw on a very broad scope of resource, and skilled people. They will get whomever they need - all skills and disciplines. That said, there are also very knowledgeable posters here, who within their discipline will have great wisdom, which they may contribute. But, the people outside the investigation will not have access to all of the information gathered until a report is issued. Thus, though they might have great knowledge, and could actually hit upon causal factors, cannot be comprehensive compared to the assigned investigators. And, there will be posters here, who simply speculate, based upon whatever they think they know about whatever. It'll be up to the readers here to sift wheat from chaff. Speculation which is way off base, and has no foundation, will usually be removed by one of the moderators, just to keep the baseline up.
In the past, I have been asked by both the NTSB, and the Canadian TSB to contribute to investigations with my specific knowledge in a related discipline. But, what I could offer was just one piece of the puzzle - it takes a team, the NTSB gathers teams really well....
In the past, I have been asked by both the NTSB, and the Canadian TSB to contribute to investigations with my specific knowledge in a related discipline. But, what I could offer was just one piece of the puzzle - it takes a team, the NTSB gathers teams really well....
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 148
Likes: 17
From: UK
dragon6172: When I play the Forbes Breaking News clip posted by Gordy in #251, I see different things when using different screens and different playback speeds. For slow playback speeds, like x0.25, you will probably see the entire body of the helicopter sometimes comes and goes or jumps. What might seem like a puff of smoke that is left behind by the helicopter (I certainly see that at some speeds and on some screens) might just be the previous position of the fuselage fading out in a following frame and might relate to a video compression processes? NTSB should have the benefit of gaining access to the original recordings.
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 221
Likes: 2
From: Hampshire, UK
I read this story in the NYT, this section caught my eye; I was not aware of any abnormality in the vertical profile the aircraft recorded:
I'm aware this might just be craptacular journalism. Regain control? I didn't know there was loss of control. Apologies if already covered.
Source: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/13/n...h-escobar.html
I'm aware this might just be craptacular journalism. Regain control? I didn't know there was loss of control. Apologies if already covered.
Source: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/04/13/n...h-escobar.html
Last edited by JamesT73J; 17th April 2025 at 04:31. Reason: Commentary, added source
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,124
Likes: 16
From: GC Paradise
https://www.flightaware.com/live/fli.../91NJ/tracklog
Squawk7700 is correct...the ADS-B data looks normal...apparently just dreadful speculative journalism from NYTimes.
Squawk7700 is correct...the ADS-B data looks normal...apparently just dreadful speculative journalism from NYTimes.
Joined: Oct 1999
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 7,371
Likes: 926
From: Den Haag
https://www.flightaware.com/live/fli.../91NJ/tracklog
Squawk7700 is correct...the ADS-B data looks normal...apparently just dreadful speculative journalism from NYTimes.
Squawk7700 is correct...the ADS-B data looks normal...apparently just dreadful speculative journalism from NYTimes.
Joined: Jan 2009
Aviation Qualifications: ATP+Mil
Posts: 344
Likes: 105
From: Sweden
Originally Posted by [email protected]
Yes, 588.23 fpm descent - how reckless
= Case closed, NTSB can go home for Easter. Thanks to NY Times for the help with this.
Joined: Oct 1999
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 7,371
Likes: 926
From: Den Haag
Yes, along with including "majestic", "hugging" and "Billionaires' row" (at least they got the apostrophe in the right place!)
Avoid imitations
Joined: Nov 2000
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 15,110
Likes: 1,083
From: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
Originally Posted by [email protected]
Yes, 588.23 fpm descent - how reckless
Joined: Jan 2009
Aviation Qualifications: ATP+Mil
Posts: 344
Likes: 105
From: Sweden
https://apnews.com/article/new-york-...3d92dcbf05a28d
The helicopter was spinning uncontrollably with “a bunch of smoke coming out” before it slammed into the water, said Lesly Camacho, a hostess at a restaurant along the river in Hoboken, New Jersey.
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 221
Likes: 2
From: Hampshire, UK
Seeing the transmission and mounts largely intact, the clevis ends holding, and pulling away the underlying structure, I am so curious as to what on earth happened. That is a very strong structure, and it's been opened up and pulled apart like it's nothing.
Joined: Oct 1999
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 7,371
Likes: 926
From: Den Haag
you and many of us! Bizarre. Also so strange that in 60 years, or so, of 206 ops this seems to be a unique event.
Joined: Dec 2000
Aviation Qualifications: Non-Aircrew
Posts: 724
Likes: 40
From: Arlington, Tx. US
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 221
Likes: 2
From: Hampshire, UK
One little nugget from that NYT article was a hotlink to the FlightAware database for that Aircraft: Flight Aware log for the accident aircraft
They work those things hard. I have no idea if that's a big deal for a utility helicopter, but it seems like a lot from my casual observer's point of view. 10 flights on the day of the incident, 18 the day before. I suppose that's not very different to a flying school or the like. It's a money printer for the owner.
They work those things hard. I have no idea if that's a big deal for a utility helicopter, but it seems like a lot from my casual observer's point of view. 10 flights on the day of the incident, 18 the day before. I suppose that's not very different to a flying school or the like. It's a money printer for the owner.
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 2,081
Likes: 189
From: Redding CA, or on a fire somewhere
They work those things hard. I have no idea if that's a big deal for a utility helicopter, but it seems like a lot from my casual observer's point of view. 10 flights on the day of the incident, 18 the day before. I suppose that's not very different to a flying school or the like. It's a money printer for the owner.
In utility, it is not uncommon for my aircraft to fly 6 or 7 hours per day on revenue Hobbs which can equate to 3 or 4 hours on the collective Hobbs depending upon type of work. Hay-bombing it is common to see 11-12 hour flight days in summer.
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 52
Likes: 46
From: Maryland
Not a big deal---most of those flights are only 20-30 minutes. When I flew tours in Hawaii, a standard day was 8 x 55 minute tours per aircraft, and we would do that year round. There were obviously slow days in there too.
In utility, it is not uncommon for my aircraft to fly 6 or 7 hours per day on revenue Hobbs which can equate to 3 or 4 hours on the collective Hobbs depending upon type of work. Hay-bombing it is common to see 11-12 hour flight days in summer.
In utility, it is not uncommon for my aircraft to fly 6 or 7 hours per day on revenue Hobbs which can equate to 3 or 4 hours on the collective Hobbs depending upon type of work. Hay-bombing it is common to see 11-12 hour flight days in summer.