HEMS limitations?
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HEMS limitations?
Hi everyone, I am new in this community.
I found this 2018 news on the net saying that HEMS Bell 412 helicopters in Spain can't land on rooftop helidecks with only one rated pilot at the controls (I assume the copilot lacks of paperwork).
Can anybody explain what does it exactly mean and what law specifically prevents it?
In the same text, it also say sthat A109E Power legally cannot fly over cities at 24º celsius or above. Same thing here, if someone can tell me the european law that doesn't allow this?
I just can't understamd because the HeliTours A109A, with not so powerful engines than an E, flies over Barcelona with more than 24ºC...
I'm not allowed to share URLs yet so to read the article just google "El nuevo helicóptero del SUMMA no puede aterrizar en el 12 de Octubre"
Thank you!
I found this 2018 news on the net saying that HEMS Bell 412 helicopters in Spain can't land on rooftop helidecks with only one rated pilot at the controls (I assume the copilot lacks of paperwork).
Can anybody explain what does it exactly mean and what law specifically prevents it?
In the same text, it also say sthat A109E Power legally cannot fly over cities at 24º celsius or above. Same thing here, if someone can tell me the european law that doesn't allow this?
I just can't understamd because the HeliTours A109A, with not so powerful engines than an E, flies over Barcelona with more than 24ºC...
I'm not allowed to share URLs yet so to read the article just google "El nuevo helicóptero del SUMMA no puede aterrizar en el 12 de Octubre"
Thank you!
Hi everyone, I am new in this community.
I found this 2018 news on the net saying that HEMS Bell 412 helicopters in Spain can't land on rooftop helidecks with only one rated pilot at the controls (I assume the copilot lacks of paperwork).
Can anybody explain what does it exactly mean and what law specifically prevents it?
In the same text, it also say sthat A109E Power legally cannot fly over cities at 24º celsius or above. Same thing here, if someone can tell me the european law that doesn't allow this?
I just can't understamd because the HeliTours A109A, with not so powerful engines than an E, flies over Barcelona with more than 24ºC...
I'm not allowed to share URLs yet so to read the article just google "El nuevo helicóptero del SUMMA no puede aterrizar en el 12 de Octubre"
Thank you!
I found this 2018 news on the net saying that HEMS Bell 412 helicopters in Spain can't land on rooftop helidecks with only one rated pilot at the controls (I assume the copilot lacks of paperwork).
Can anybody explain what does it exactly mean and what law specifically prevents it?
In the same text, it also say sthat A109E Power legally cannot fly over cities at 24º celsius or above. Same thing here, if someone can tell me the european law that doesn't allow this?
I just can't understamd because the HeliTours A109A, with not so powerful engines than an E, flies over Barcelona with more than 24ºC...
I'm not allowed to share URLs yet so to read the article just google "El nuevo helicóptero del SUMMA no puede aterrizar en el 12 de Octubre"
Thank you!
So I can explain both.
The pilot problem is a limitation from teh Bell 412 RFM Cat A supplement. It states:
Minimum crew for Category A elevated helipad operation consists of two pilots.
So not a regulation but rather a limitation of the aircraft.
The limitation about 24 degrees needs to be viewed in context and again relates to the RFM (a performance chart this time). In this instance it's actually talking about landings above 24 degrees and in cities (congested areas). It is also specific to Madrid which is at 2200 ft elevation. In order to fly to a helipad in a hostile congested area (Madrid) at that elevation and temperature, the performance graph gives a maximum mass of 2300kg. This is a whole 550 kg below max mass for an A109E. That's not a practical figure to do anything useful in HEMS.
Hope that helps.
G
Last edited by gipsymagpie; 25th May 2022 at 21:54.
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hi
So I can explain both.
The pilot problem is a limitation from teh Bell 412 RFM Cat A supplement. It states:
Minimum crew for Category A elevated helipad operation consists of two pilots.
So not a regulation but rather a limitation of the aircraft.
The limitation about 24 degrees needs to be viewed in context. In this instance it's actually no landings above 24 degrees and in cities (congested areas). It is also specific to Madrid which is at 2000 ft elevation. In order to fly to a helipad in a hostile congested area (Madrid) at that elevation and temperature, the performance graph gives a maximum mass of 2300kg. This is a whole 550 kg below max mass for an A109E. That's not a practical figure to do anything useful in HEMS.
Hope that helps.
G
So I can explain both.
The pilot problem is a limitation from teh Bell 412 RFM Cat A supplement. It states:
Minimum crew for Category A elevated helipad operation consists of two pilots.
So not a regulation but rather a limitation of the aircraft.
The limitation about 24 degrees needs to be viewed in context. In this instance it's actually no landings above 24 degrees and in cities (congested areas). It is also specific to Madrid which is at 2000 ft elevation. In order to fly to a helipad in a hostile congested area (Madrid) at that elevation and temperature, the performance graph gives a maximum mass of 2300kg. This is a whole 550 kg below max mass for an A109E. That's not a practical figure to do anything useful in HEMS.
Hope that helps.
G
Interesting the fact that the B412 RFM does not allow one pilot to perform a CAT-A takeoff from an elevated helideck. What makes it different from a street level helipad or any accident site like a factory where HEMS should be required to land and then takeoff from?
About the A109E 24ºC limitation, is it told by the RFM as well and applies worldwide?
Heli3, I can see you replyed but it's not showing for some reason.
The twin pilot limitation may be due to several reasons. It may be that in event of an autopilot malfunction, having an extra pair of eyes/hands is necessary to react to an excursion before it became a dangerous. This is usually for early model autopilots IFR so I think this is unlikely. Alternatively it may be that physically there's some controls necessary for Cat A that cannot be safely operated whilst flying the profile or that an extra pair of eyes are needed to monitor some flight parameters. Finally it could be that a single pilot cannot see round cockpit structure sufficiently for obstacle clearance.
In answer to your second question, yes the performance stuff is in the RFM too.
The twin pilot limitation may be due to several reasons. It may be that in event of an autopilot malfunction, having an extra pair of eyes/hands is necessary to react to an excursion before it became a dangerous. This is usually for early model autopilots IFR so I think this is unlikely. Alternatively it may be that physically there's some controls necessary for Cat A that cannot be safely operated whilst flying the profile or that an extra pair of eyes are needed to monitor some flight parameters. Finally it could be that a single pilot cannot see round cockpit structure sufficiently for obstacle clearance.
In answer to your second question, yes the performance stuff is in the RFM too.
