Landing on common land / national parks in UK
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Landing on common land / national parks in UK
Does anyone know what the law is about landing on common land or in national parks in the UK? For example, can you land in the Brecon Beacons?
Obviously all taking Rule 5 etc into account.
Obviously all taking Rule 5 etc into account.
No aviation law saying that you can't ! However civil law is different. Bear in mind National Parks, the land is owned by someone ! Please do not land anywhere and give us all a bad name ! Google farmers Brecon Beacons or local rugby clubs for somewhere and permission to land !
Or, if you are forced to land,then a letter/phone call,explaining sick pax/weather /etc,soonest to owner/police will be better(or a thank you).`cos you can bet someone will have seen it,and it`ll appear on utoob.......
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Way back in 2004 or was it 2005 I rang up the Brecon Beacons Parks HQ and asked for permission to land a chartered R44 on the edge of one of their car parks, to my amazement they said yes and promptly followed up with a confirmation email...!
Not sure that would happen in this day and age mind you?
If you want to come to the North York Moors, you can land in my back garden if you want, Google "Goathland Helicopter Landing"
Also I've found the local parish council a great source of land owners names and phone numbers, all the Clerks of the Council numbers can be found online, give them a ring, I've done it quite a few times with success - sometimes costs a pint or two behind the bar and once a donation to the local church flower fund but well worth it
Cheers
Kev.
Not sure that would happen in this day and age mind you?
If you want to come to the North York Moors, you can land in my back garden if you want, Google "Goathland Helicopter Landing"
Also I've found the local parish council a great source of land owners names and phone numbers, all the Clerks of the Council numbers can be found online, give them a ring, I've done it quite a few times with success - sometimes costs a pint or two behind the bar and once a donation to the local church flower fund but well worth it
Cheers
Kev.
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In my experience, if in the event you wish to land somewhere unexpected for example and did not arrange prior permission, it is not illegal. You will most likely not have an issue if the area is secluded and no one about. If you see a park ranger coming up then perhaps lift and land somewhere else might be the best bet. If the warden catches you, you may be committing a civil offence if you refuse to leave after being asked to do so three times.
I often have reason to land on common land for short periods. If I see the warden coming over and my rotors are still running I usually lift and clear off behind another hill!
I often have reason to land on common land for short periods. If I see the warden coming over and my rotors are still running I usually lift and clear off behind another hill!
Notify the local police and get the landowner's permission and you should be OK.
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Requirement is land owner's permission only. In normal circumstances there's absolutely no need to talk to the police, it has nothing to do with them. Might be wise if crowds were expected to come to gawp.
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A call to the local national parks office normally gets a positive response. As a rule we let the local police know about landing on their patch (AOC) ops as it can help with any noise complaints or phone calls about helicopters crashing at the local cricket club etc.
Alternatively, adopt chopjocks method and hope not to get found out. From his previous posts he is either taking the p*** or really doesn't know/care about the rules.
SND
Alternatively, adopt chopjocks method and hope not to get found out. From his previous posts he is either taking the p*** or really doesn't know/care about the rules.
SND
Gawd. You folks in the UK sure make things complicated.
As a remark anytime I land anywere in Canada and a Cop or Ranger approaches I shut down and talk to them instead of departing.
Never a problem.
As a remark anytime I land anywere in Canada and a Cop or Ranger approaches I shut down and talk to them instead of departing.
Never a problem.
Things are different in Europe...
Landing anywhere for PPL ? Nope, airports only (some exceptions may apply).
landing anywhere for commercial purpose requires a special permission that involves money and record keeping of when landed where.
Going below minimum safe altitude (500ft): Special permit, bla bla bla.
Somebody calls the cops and you have to prove you're legal...
Landing anywhere for PPL ? Nope, airports only (some exceptions may apply).
landing anywhere for commercial purpose requires a special permission that involves money and record keeping of when landed where.
Going below minimum safe altitude (500ft): Special permit, bla bla bla.
Somebody calls the cops and you have to prove you're legal...
Telling the Police is handy for when Mrs Miggins rings to say that a helicopter just "crashed". They can say, "Yes, we know about that."
Then again, if you have just crashed.
Then again, if you have just crashed.
Avoid imitations
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Some of the Rule 5 permissions I've obtained from the UK CAA (congested area landings, "1,000 foot rule") mandate a requirement to inform the relevant police authority.
On these occasions I ring the police and request that they generate an "incident" number, so it's logged on their computer system. TBH, they are seldom interested and I have often had to explain why they need to log it.
On these occasions I ring the police and request that they generate an "incident" number, so it's logged on their computer system. TBH, they are seldom interested and I have often had to explain why they need to log it.
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I believe in the UK we have a very liberal approach. Observe the RoA, seek exemptions or permission if required and land with the landowners permission. Common curtesy and common sense really.
However, I was doing a HEMS task one day in Cumbria and got interviewed at the landing site by Customs who asked lots of questions that I declined to answer referring them to the Office wallahs instead. Two very scruffy oddballs who could not muster up an official ID card. They were quite insistent so I gave them my "Name, rank and Number".
A few days later I received a polite snottagram from some high ranking Desk Jockey in HMRC who laid out in quite strong language the full powers of a customs officer in such circumstances. Turns out they could have searched my ringpiece for narcotics right there at the HLS and some other invasive stuff as well. They could have detained me and seized the helicopter and probably burned my wallet as well.
The Desk Jockey pointed out that the only reason I did not get the full treatment was because it was a HEMS helicopter although he was keen to point out that this in itself provided no immunity.
I replied in a somewhat grovelling fashion (as my ringpiece is a one way street) but did tell him about the lack of ID. His response was that Customs officers did not have an ID nor any requirement to produce one. Although sorely tempted to reply with an indignant and incredulous response, my twitching ringpiece moderated me to a bland acceptance.
The funny thing is I have not really smuggled anything anywhere and not done anything illegal to the best of my knowledge. Still it loosened my bowels somewhat to realise that HMRC are powerful m****f****rs that I did not want sniffing around my ****!
One phrase stood out in his letter "most people are hiding something". I immediately went home and searched my wife's handbag but only found some boiled sweets and a lipstick.
Beware of the beast that is HMRC. (Damn I hope they don't read this.....(
However, I was doing a HEMS task one day in Cumbria and got interviewed at the landing site by Customs who asked lots of questions that I declined to answer referring them to the Office wallahs instead. Two very scruffy oddballs who could not muster up an official ID card. They were quite insistent so I gave them my "Name, rank and Number".
A few days later I received a polite snottagram from some high ranking Desk Jockey in HMRC who laid out in quite strong language the full powers of a customs officer in such circumstances. Turns out they could have searched my ringpiece for narcotics right there at the HLS and some other invasive stuff as well. They could have detained me and seized the helicopter and probably burned my wallet as well.
The Desk Jockey pointed out that the only reason I did not get the full treatment was because it was a HEMS helicopter although he was keen to point out that this in itself provided no immunity.
I replied in a somewhat grovelling fashion (as my ringpiece is a one way street) but did tell him about the lack of ID. His response was that Customs officers did not have an ID nor any requirement to produce one. Although sorely tempted to reply with an indignant and incredulous response, my twitching ringpiece moderated me to a bland acceptance.
The funny thing is I have not really smuggled anything anywhere and not done anything illegal to the best of my knowledge. Still it loosened my bowels somewhat to realise that HMRC are powerful m****f****rs that I did not want sniffing around my ****!
One phrase stood out in his letter "most people are hiding something". I immediately went home and searched my wife's handbag but only found some boiled sweets and a lipstick.
Beware of the beast that is HMRC. (Damn I hope they don't read this.....(
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Customs officers most certainly do have ID. From the HMRC Assistant Director of Criminal Investigation:
"We would always urge people to check the identification of those wanting to enter their home or business. Any legitimate law enforcement officer or caller will not mind waiting outside while their identity is verified. If you are suspicious, call the police."
Although Customs powers derive from the Police & Criminal Evidence Act, there are still certain activities only a policeman can perform.
I also seem to remember that the problem with landing sites in UK is not the permission to land but the permission to take off.
Phil
"We would always urge people to check the identification of those wanting to enter their home or business. Any legitimate law enforcement officer or caller will not mind waiting outside while their identity is verified. If you are suspicious, call the police."
Although Customs powers derive from the Police & Criminal Evidence Act, there are still certain activities only a policeman can perform.
I also seem to remember that the problem with landing sites in UK is not the permission to land but the permission to take off.
Phil
On these occasions I ring the police and request that they generate an "incident" number, so it's logged on their computer system. TBH, they are seldom interested and I have often had to explain why they need to log it.
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I'm not at all sure that informing Plod will have any affect if Mrs Miggins does call in and say a helo has "crashed". Just like the fire brigade if an emergency is reported I think they have to respond - viz the daily fire brigade attendance at 1 Canada Square (Canary Wharf) where every time the aircon was on the steam coming fro the top of the tower invariably generated a 999 call to say Canary Wharf was on fire. I'm sure they got over that somehow eventually but is was a major pita for a long while.
Re land owner's permission. Pretty sure it's a trespass thing, certainly not laid down in "law" anywhere (as trespass is Common Law, and a pretty dubious one to action at that). Glider pilots often fall foul of awkward farmers on the make when they land out as without prior agreement to land the landowner has the right to charge pretty much what he sees fit for access to his land for the recovery crew, or can put a chain around your tail rotor if he wishes until you cough up. Pretty unpleasant way to behave I know but some do it.
As it's trespass it's nothing whatsoever to do with Plod. Both the original "offence" of arriving uninvited and any detention of your property pending payment is purely a civil matter.
Take bolt croppers to his chain though and it's Criminal Damage and Plod will be very much interested when the farmer calls...
Re land owner's permission. Pretty sure it's a trespass thing, certainly not laid down in "law" anywhere (as trespass is Common Law, and a pretty dubious one to action at that). Glider pilots often fall foul of awkward farmers on the make when they land out as without prior agreement to land the landowner has the right to charge pretty much what he sees fit for access to his land for the recovery crew, or can put a chain around your tail rotor if he wishes until you cough up. Pretty unpleasant way to behave I know but some do it.
As it's trespass it's nothing whatsoever to do with Plod. Both the original "offence" of arriving uninvited and any detention of your property pending payment is purely a civil matter.
Take bolt croppers to his chain though and it's Criminal Damage and Plod will be very much interested when the farmer calls...
@ Double Bogey.
- Possibly. 
Six jailed for 'drug ambulance' smuggling plot - BBC News
Keep up the good work though.
Beware of the beast that is HMRC. (Damn I hope they don't read this.....(
A few days later I received a polite snottagram from some high ranking Desk Jockey in HMRC who laid out in quite strong language the full powers of a customs officer in such circumstances. Turns out they could have searched my ringpiece for narcotics right there at the HLS and some other invasive stuff as well. They could have detained me and seized the helicopter and probably burned my wallet as well.
Keep up the good work though.
