UK: CAA prosecution: Infringement
Joined: Aug 2000
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Silsoe
Two bridges is better, certainly better food and there is a field next to the pub you can land in. Oh hang on a moment I haven't been there as it is in a NP and it is within the curtilage of a public house !!!
Two bridges is better, certainly better food and there is a field next to the pub you can land in. Oh hang on a moment I haven't been there as it is in a NP and it is within the curtilage of a public house !!!
Joined: Jan 2005
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From: yorkshire uk
I just take a view that if there is a strip of green you can fly over to get in and out then it is not congested area ...if there are back to back houses and no green all the way around then it is . Having said that if the landing site is big enough to be able to transition and climb to 1000ft before going over the houses go for it !!!
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From: UK
So who is going to answer the questions then
is a golf course a congested area ? I know lots of golf courses that have non approved helipads !!!!
is a hotel pad next to the hotel a congested area ?
is a rugby pitch with no one playing a congested area ?
is a golf course a congested area ? I know lots of golf courses that have non approved helipads !!!!
is a hotel pad next to the hotel a congested area ?
is a rugby pitch with no one playing a congested area ?
The Air Navigation Order defines a congested area as being ‘any area of a city, town or settlement which is substantially used for residential, industrial, commercial or recreational purposes’
Joined: Apr 2010
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From: Lost again...
CrazyBroadsword.
That was, indeed, the CAA's positions several months ago and they did stop issuing rule five permissions for congested area landings for a time after SERA was introduced which, as you say, did remove the requirement.
They have now back peddled on this and rule five permissions ARE REQUIRED for congested area landings. Rules of The Air 2015 (March 2015) Section 2 para5(1).
That was, indeed, the CAA's positions several months ago and they did stop issuing rule five permissions for congested area landings for a time after SERA was introduced which, as you say, did remove the requirement.
They have now back peddled on this and rule five permissions ARE REQUIRED for congested area landings. Rules of The Air 2015 (March 2015) Section 2 para5(1).
Avoid imitations
Joined: Nov 2000
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From: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
It would have been too optimistic to expect the CAA to surrender an income stream for long (Ł113 per application). 
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From: Do I come here often?
Hughes;
Take a look at Leicester Race Course (N51 35.5 W001 05.44) I was in there one evening a few years ago when the Feds arrived and took a Gazelle, a 206 and 4 Robbie 44 owners/pilots to bits for landing in a congested area without permission.
I was in one of two AOC twins in there with all the correct permissions and was amazed that three of the pilots had CPL's and no idea of the requirements, the Feds spent a LOT of time with those guys, especially as the 206 was on a public transport flight.
SND
Take a look at Leicester Race Course (N51 35.5 W001 05.44) I was in there one evening a few years ago when the Feds arrived and took a Gazelle, a 206 and 4 Robbie 44 owners/pilots to bits for landing in a congested area without permission.
I was in one of two AOC twins in there with all the correct permissions and was amazed that three of the pilots had CPL's and no idea of the requirements, the Feds spent a LOT of time with those guys, especially as the 206 was on a public transport flight.
SND
Avoid imitations
Joined: Nov 2000
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From: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
I once arrived back at work (non AOC operator with a bit of a reputation) from leave to discover that ops had scheduled me to fly into Leicester racecourse a couple hours later. I asked where the CAA permission was and received a blank look......
I was put under some company pressure (
) but I point blank refused to go, for exactly the reasons above. It's always the Captain's responsibility and Ops staff don't get taken to court, do they?
I was put under some company pressure (
) but I point blank refused to go, for exactly the reasons above. It's always the Captain's responsibility and Ops staff don't get taken to court, do they?
Joined: Aug 2000
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SND
Leicester race course you have to overfly / flying into a built up area so obviously. Think the issue is when is an area congested and when is it not ?
To use the rugby pitch/s scenario as an example. If no one is playing on it / them and the club is not surrounded by houses etc etc is it congested ?
You could argue that it is used for substantially recreational use as the pitch isn't used for anything else so therefore it has a sole use of playing rugby on.
Like all things in life common sense has to prevail ( although if sense was common everyone would have it )
Leicester race course you have to overfly / flying into a built up area so obviously. Think the issue is when is an area congested and when is it not ?
To use the rugby pitch/s scenario as an example. If no one is playing on it / them and the club is not surrounded by houses etc etc is it congested ?
You could argue that it is used for substantially recreational use as the pitch isn't used for anything else so therefore it has a sole use of playing rugby on.
Like all things in life common sense has to prevail ( although if sense was common everyone would have it )
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From: Do I come here often?
Hughes;
For God's Sake Man. This helicopter aviation post EASA. Write out 100 times "I must not mention common sense."
Then see me in the library with your trousers over your left arm.
SND
For God's Sake Man. This helicopter aviation post EASA. Write out 100 times "I must not mention common sense."
Then see me in the library with your trousers over your left arm.
SND
Joined: Jan 2005
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From: yorkshire uk
A congested area has no route in or out that doesn't involve overflying property .
If a town/city was in a U shape , you could fly right into the centre of the U as it wouldn't involve overflying property ..a bit like the route to City Airport from the North . A rugby pitch or golf course in itself cannot be a congested area , but it could be landlocked inside a congested area . You need to look at the reason for the rule . It is all to do with having a safe landing spot in the event of engine failure on approach or landing . That is how I have decided over 30 years and never had any problems !!
If a town/city was in a U shape , you could fly right into the centre of the U as it wouldn't involve overflying property ..a bit like the route to City Airport from the North . A rugby pitch or golf course in itself cannot be a congested area , but it could be landlocked inside a congested area . You need to look at the reason for the rule . It is all to do with having a safe landing spot in the event of engine failure on approach or landing . That is how I have decided over 30 years and never had any problems !!
Tightgit
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From: The artist formerly known as john du'pruyting
Handysnaks think recreational purpose as per the ANO
H500, The ANO specifies that the rule (in this case), applies to any city, town or settlement, not any and every area of countryside!
As just about every National Park is there because it is an area of spectacularly beautiful countryside, then the rule doesn't apply. The caveat of course, is that it does apply to a city, town or settlement that does happen to be in a national park!
