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AW169

Old 24th Mar 2017, 08:42
  #121 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by KiwiNedNZ
Nooby - LinFox's 169 has already been sold back to the UK to another owner and recently arrived at Sloanes for delivery. Seems Lindsay Fox wasn't happy about something with it so he got rid of it - heard he either had another 169 on the way or something else.
Ned,

Not true: Lindsay's AW169 is going strong and actually has the 4.8 tonne upgrade along with RNAV approaches. The undercarriage problems are also fixed.

The sale to UK was another Australian VIP AW169 about 5 months ago
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Old 24th Mar 2017, 18:24
  #122 (permalink)  
 
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Thanks John, I think the confusion was Lindsay's friend had his 169 painted the same colours
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Old 4th Apr 2017, 10:20
  #123 (permalink)  
 
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Hi all,
Please someone could let me know what could be the max. payload for AW169 O&G configuration?
Thanks
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Old 4th Apr 2017, 15:31
  #124 (permalink)  
 
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John, do you know what sort of speed Linfox are getting out of their 169?? How slow are these things?

Is it just slow for an Agusta, or is it actually slow?
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Old 2nd May 2017, 22:48
  #125 (permalink)  
 
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Hello all,
Are there any AW169's in the US?
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Old 27th Jul 2017, 17:00
  #126 (permalink)  
 
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AW169

Anyone been through the aw169 course here? Pm if so.
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Old 17th Aug 2017, 15:25
  #127 (permalink)  
 
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Hey guys! I was wondering,... looking through the AW169 manual and not finding any charts, can anyone share a practical crusing speed for MCP at lower altitudes and fuel burn at that setting?

Also, can somebody confirm a clean airframe with external hoist would be around 3000kg?

Thanks!

Last edited by Phoinix; 17th Aug 2017 at 16:13.
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Old 21st May 2019, 07:14
  #128 (permalink)  
 
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So, whilst starting my typerting in Sesto, I got a glimps into the 169. First impression; it's far from what I knew by now. Flying EC135P2+, A109E, B212/412/206... helicopter is not a hardware part that will not need changing for a while, the software however, it adds new functions and it's now the heart of the whole thing. Phase 4 now, Phase 5 (software) is expected to bring Electronic checklists, ECO mode (cruise NR below 96%) and SAR autopilot modes. I have a feeling of looking at my phone or a computer. Whole different mindset.

And for the guys comparing the EC145 and AW169 - hoist, NVIS, dual controls and some stuff... The 169 has 1650 kg useful load and the EC145 1400 kg. Performance wise (OGE at altitude and in cruise), 169 wins hands down...the useful load drops only 80 kg at 8000 feet but it was never in the class to compete with 145 to start with. But it is an amazing replacement for 212/412.
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Old 21st May 2019, 13:15
  #129 (permalink)  
 
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Not sure if you are comparing a T2 or not, but quick glance of your number does not seem right. And after the 5 blade mod kicks in, 169 may not has a lot meaningful load advantage either.
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Old 21st May 2019, 13:44
  #130 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Mee3
Not sure if you are comparing a T2 or not, but quick glance of your number does not seem right. And after the 5 blade mod kicks in, 169 may not has a lot meaningful load advantage either.
like I said, it’s altitude performance we are looking for, and 3800 inprovement on T2 does nothing to that but reduction. From the words of AH Donauwort instructor, H145 with 4-blade rotor could handle 3800 just the same. No change.
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Old 29th Jan 2020, 20:41
  #131 (permalink)  
 
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Big News!!!

Leonardo Helicopters announced at HAI a significant increase in performance for the AW169...
Take a look at the article from AINonline:
---------------

Performance Packages Increase Power, Payload for AW169

by Mark Humber - January 28, 2020, 12:01 AM

Leonardo is developing two performance packages for the AW169 medium twin that will increase engine shaft horsepower (shp), transmission rating, and available payload. The "Enhanced" and “Superior” performance packs rely on software updates and minor aerodynamic modifications to deliver increased performance. Leonardo expects EASA approval for the packages by the end of 2020 and will make them available on new deliveries and as a retrofit to existing helicopters beginning in 2021.

Retrofit pricing was not disclosed, but a company spokesman said he expected the retrofits to require 16 man-hours of labor. Available payload would increase from 440 to 770 pounds, depending on phase of flight and external conditions; more than 770 pounds for hovering, over 660 pounds for CAT. A-PC1 operations, and 440 pounds for one-engine-inoperative (OEI) hover. Shortly after initial EASA certification approval for the helicopter, Leonardo certified the AW169 for a maximum gross weight increase from 4.6 to 4.8 tons in 2016. That increased-gross-weight kit upped the aircraft’s maximum takeoff weight from 10,141 to 10,582 pounds, a capability that could add up to 100 nm of additional range from the original ferry range of 431 nm (no reserve).

Leonardo’s Samuele Tosi, head of product marketing for dual-use helicopters, said the performance packs produce an increase of approximately 144 shp on the 1,000-shp Pratt & Whitney PW210A Fadec-controlled engines, and an increased transmission rating of approximately 150 shp. He said the differences between the packages is price and the amount of shp increase—with the Enhanced pack delivering approximately two-thirds the power increase of the Superior pack. He said the power increases would give the AW169 “the highest power-to-weight ratio in its class.

“The AW169 is designed to surpass customers’ expectations and set a new market standard within its category,” Tosi said, adding that it appeals to a wide variety of customers, including those upgrading from Part 27 helicopters (up to 7,000 pounds MTOW) and those switching from older, larger twins, including the BK117 and Bell 412. “Those designs are now showing their age,” he said.

Customers not only appreciate the AW169 and its newer design standards; more are attracted to it because of its flexible, multi-mission capabilities and quick-change configurations, a Leonardo spokesman told AIN. As an example, he pointed out the fleet of three AW169s acquired by Travis County, Texas, that will be used for a combination of firefighting, EMS, and law-enforcement missions. He also noted that the AW169 received military certification last year. “The market is showing increased interest in a range of missions. This upgrade provides a wide variety of applications spanning from civil to parapublic to military in all weather conditions.” The spokesman said that the helicopter had seen “very interesting success in more niche applications” such as wind farm support and electronic newsgathering in Japan.

Since the AW169 was first certified by EASA in 2015, more than 100 of these helicopters have been delivered and over 220 have been ordered. The in-service fleet has logged 45,000 flight hours with the fleet leader surpassing 2,000 hours. The aircraft features Collins glass-panel touchscreen avionics with capabilities that include a four-axis digital automatic flight control system and a dual flight-management system.

Top cruising speed is 155 knots, and the 222-cu-ft cabin can accommodate seven to 10 passengers. The aircraft is manufactured at Leonardo’s plant in Vergiate, Italy.

Last edited by heliguy77; 30th Jan 2020 at 08:32.
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Old 30th Jan 2020, 06:34
  #132 (permalink)  
 
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Just out of curiosity, what helicopter is currently overpowering the 169 “in it’s class”? H160 is underpowered, 412 had gained weight, AS365/EC155 is underpowered,... which one?

Last edited by Phoinix; 31st Jan 2020 at 12:28.
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Old 25th Feb 2020, 15:35
  #133 (permalink)  
 
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AW169 Sim

With Leonardo temporarily closing its training facility at Sesto Calende, due to the lockdown over Corona, are there any other AW169 Sims being developed? Coptersafety are close to sorting theirs in Helsinki but are there any others?
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Old 26th Feb 2020, 04:12
  #134 (permalink)  
 
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Nope!
The one in Coptersafety is nowhere near to be ready, and the second Leonardo should go to Philadelphia sometime later this September.
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Old 26th Feb 2020, 16:08
  #135 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Phoinix
Just out of curiosity, what helicopter is currently overpowering the 169 “in it’s class”? H160 is underpowered, 412 had gained weight, AS365/EC155 is underpowered,... which one?
Are you sure about this ? H160 power to weight ratio is quite the same as AW169 one (maybe better at the MTOW of 5670kg).
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Old 26th Feb 2020, 16:19
  #136 (permalink)  
 
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Safran Helicopter Engines has received EASA (European Aviation Safety Agency) Type Certification for its Arrano 1A engine, installed in the Airbus Helicopters H160. Arrano is a new generation engine in the 1,100 to 1,300 shp power range, perfectly suited for new four-to-six tonne helicopters. The H160 made its first flight with the Arrano in January 2016.
lets go for the best in arrano power range,...

H160
1300hp/5670kg = 0,23

AW169 (before the announced power boost)
1180hp/4800kg = 0,25
after power boost 1324hp/4800 = 0,28
after expected mtom increase
1324hp/5000 = 0,26

Using the increased GW for H160 calcs makes it a 412 “killer” material.

Last edited by Phoinix; 26th Feb 2020 at 16:49.
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Old 26th Feb 2020, 17:59
  #137 (permalink)  
 
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H145 Arriel 2e

1072bhp/3700kg = 0.29
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Old 26th Feb 2020, 18:03
  #138 (permalink)  
 
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It is only a '412 killer' if it can match or exceed the 412 in all other areas. I would be interested to see if it could fly 8 hours per day water bombing for weeks on end with minimal maintenance and few unserviceability issues. Very pretty though....
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Old 26th Feb 2020, 18:08
  #139 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Same again
It is only a '412 killer' if it can match or exceed the 412 in all other areas. I would be interested to see if it could fly 8 hours per day water bombing for weeks on end with minimal maintenance and few unserviceability issues. Very pretty though....
That we shall see, but I doubt in the first years. We have 212, 412, 169,... whenever the 100hrs check comes, it’s not exactly “minimum maintenance”, unless under some “non-easa” regs.

Last edited by Phoinix; 26th Feb 2020 at 18:21.
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Old 26th Feb 2020, 22:16
  #140 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Phoinix
lets go for the best in arrano power range,...

H160
1300hp/5670kg = 0,23

AW169 (before the announced power boost)
1180hp/4800kg = 0,25
after power boost 1324hp/4800 = 0,28
after expected mtom increase
1324hp/5000 = 0,26

Using the increased GW for H160 calcs makes it a 412 “killer” material.
If weight and power to weight ratio is the only parameter you take into account to determine a "412 killer" you are missing out on 40 years of technological and avionics advances.
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