Helicopter Ferry Flight
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Join Date: Jul 2008
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Helicopter Ferry Flight
Good Morning folks,
There could be a chance to ferry a helicopter from
Middle East to Europe, North Italy. What are the
major things that we need to consider and how
is the weather at this time of the year specially
from south to north of Italy?
Thank you for your valuable input!
There could be a chance to ferry a helicopter from
Middle East to Europe, North Italy. What are the
major things that we need to consider and how
is the weather at this time of the year specially
from south to north of Italy?
Thank you for your valuable input!
and how is the weather at this time of the year specially from south to north of Italy?
Long Range Forecast Milano
It does get foggy around Gallarate and Cascina Costa this time of the Year....and stays that way for weeks sometimes. Most of Italy is fine otherwise.
The Advice about using a Professional Handling Agent is spot on....as proper coordination and a whole lot of patience and ability to deal with bureaucracy can go a very long way to making the trip a real pleasure.
Be careful to plan your Days so you are not pushing daylight getting to your destination....and give plenty of time for completing formalities at each end of your flights each day as there always seems to be some delays in getting paperwork done.
The flying part of the trip is the easy part....the Admin is what is the hard part.
If you make the trip....take lots of photos....and post them here.
The Advice about using a Professional Handling Agent is spot on....as proper coordination and a whole lot of patience and ability to deal with bureaucracy can go a very long way to making the trip a real pleasure.
Be careful to plan your Days so you are not pushing daylight getting to your destination....and give plenty of time for completing formalities at each end of your flights each day as there always seems to be some delays in getting paperwork done.
The flying part of the trip is the easy part....the Admin is what is the hard part.
If you make the trip....take lots of photos....and post them here.
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Toledo, OH
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I would suggest Universal Weather. I have used them for years and they have relationships with just about everyone. They also have peoples phone numbers and will call them directly if necessary. Something that many other handlers do not do.
Some of the big questions are, how are you planning to conduct the ferry flight? Will you re-register the aircraft before or after the flight? What nationality of certificates/licenses will the pilots have? Will you need to export and/or import the aircraft? The routing could be interesting with the normally short ranges of helicopters.
So you will also need a customs agents at both ends. Be aware that aircraft are considered controlled items so the customs paperwork and procedures may take a bit. If you re-register the aircraft prior to leaving the departure country, you will need proof that the aircraft was the previous registration and the departure country may have no record of it ever entering the country, which causes a lot of large red flags for officials and delays you. If you do de-register the aircraft you will need some sort of ferry permit. I'm not sure how JAA land does it. Plus insurance paperwork radio station licenses, etc.
It sounds like it could be an interesting adventure.
Some of the big questions are, how are you planning to conduct the ferry flight? Will you re-register the aircraft before or after the flight? What nationality of certificates/licenses will the pilots have? Will you need to export and/or import the aircraft? The routing could be interesting with the normally short ranges of helicopters.
So you will also need a customs agents at both ends. Be aware that aircraft are considered controlled items so the customs paperwork and procedures may take a bit. If you re-register the aircraft prior to leaving the departure country, you will need proof that the aircraft was the previous registration and the departure country may have no record of it ever entering the country, which causes a lot of large red flags for officials and delays you. If you do de-register the aircraft you will need some sort of ferry permit. I'm not sure how JAA land does it. Plus insurance paperwork radio station licenses, etc.
It sounds like it could be an interesting adventure.
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Plan (at least) one full week for this trip-you´re more likely going to spent two weeks on this tour…
Refueling and Paperwork can take hours-i have spent 7 hours waiting for the only fuel truck that broke down on the way to our helicopter; i have spent 5 hours waiting at the entrance of an airport before finally someone could give me the right stamp to enter (to start Preflight and filing a flight plan)…
Make sure you instruct the handling agent to sort out accommodation next to the airport-you don´t want to lose hours after a long day traveling to the hotel, only to get up 4 hours later again to start at first daylight..
Take your fuel testing kit (kolor kut….).
Make sure you have up-to-date maps, and avoid flying through military airspace (that-most of the time-is NOT on the international maps).
Make sure all licenses are 100% correct and valid-you will be ramp-checked (in some countries) until they find something (they can charge or fine you for)…
Bring enough money and credit cards-some airports don´t accept credit cards for handling or refueling; others don´t accept cash...
Refueling and Paperwork can take hours-i have spent 7 hours waiting for the only fuel truck that broke down on the way to our helicopter; i have spent 5 hours waiting at the entrance of an airport before finally someone could give me the right stamp to enter (to start Preflight and filing a flight plan)…
Make sure you instruct the handling agent to sort out accommodation next to the airport-you don´t want to lose hours after a long day traveling to the hotel, only to get up 4 hours later again to start at first daylight..
Take your fuel testing kit (kolor kut….).
Make sure you have up-to-date maps, and avoid flying through military airspace (that-most of the time-is NOT on the international maps).
Make sure all licenses are 100% correct and valid-you will be ramp-checked (in some countries) until they find something (they can charge or fine you for)…
Bring enough money and credit cards-some airports don´t accept credit cards for handling or refueling; others don´t accept cash...
Hueyracer, why would you want to depart with licenses that are not ok or invalid?
When requesting entry/ferry clearances you have to submit the crew and helicopter paperwork way in advance to the respective authorities and you will not be cleared if they find any discrepancies. I never got ramp checked, by the way.
I always checked out the hotels in advance via HRS or Tripadvisor. Only once did I come across a hotel where my initial reaction was:" I should have brought a tent". It was the only hotel within 100+ miles.
Never had I problems with customs or AIS, in fact my ground time was never more than one hour, mostly less including fuelling.
When you have the proper handler the fuel guys know you're coming and they'll be filling you up within 15 minutes after touch down. And you never have to carry cash for the fuel because you do not pay him.
Your handler will give you a piece of paper which you hand over to the fueller and the juice starts flowing.
Have to pay him in advance, though.
From the comments I read I am happy to deal with Monia at AirWalser.
There's not read tape and the crew can do what they're supposed to, fly.
File flight plan, take off, land, pay landing fee, fuel, crank, repeat.
On two occasions we had to fill in a bloody form and sign a waiver because we did not have HF on board...
When requesting entry/ferry clearances you have to submit the crew and helicopter paperwork way in advance to the respective authorities and you will not be cleared if they find any discrepancies. I never got ramp checked, by the way.
I always checked out the hotels in advance via HRS or Tripadvisor. Only once did I come across a hotel where my initial reaction was:" I should have brought a tent". It was the only hotel within 100+ miles.
Never had I problems with customs or AIS, in fact my ground time was never more than one hour, mostly less including fuelling.
When you have the proper handler the fuel guys know you're coming and they'll be filling you up within 15 minutes after touch down. And you never have to carry cash for the fuel because you do not pay him.
Your handler will give you a piece of paper which you hand over to the fueller and the juice starts flowing.
Have to pay him in advance, though.
From the comments I read I am happy to deal with Monia at AirWalser.
There's not read tape and the crew can do what they're supposed to, fly.
File flight plan, take off, land, pay landing fee, fuel, crank, repeat.
On two occasions we had to fill in a bloody form and sign a waiver because we did not have HF on board...
Ferry flights can be either great fun or a nitemare. Planning, planning, planning.
The hotels can be booked for each nite. Don't push too far each day. I did one last year and we flew 2.5 hours AM and a refuel stop then 2.5 hours PM. Always on the ground before dark. And into the nearest hotel for refreshment.
We did 8 days and 4500miles and it was a really great experience.
Have plenty of alternates. If you can go IFR then do so, it makes it so much easier. Oh and look for the yellow and black C sign, and how to fill in a flight plan twice a day.
expect it to be changed often.
The hotels can be booked for each nite. Don't push too far each day. I did one last year and we flew 2.5 hours AM and a refuel stop then 2.5 hours PM. Always on the ground before dark. And into the nearest hotel for refreshment.
We did 8 days and 4500miles and it was a really great experience.
Have plenty of alternates. If you can go IFR then do so, it makes it so much easier. Oh and look for the yellow and black C sign, and how to fill in a flight plan twice a day.
expect it to be changed often.
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Germany
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Without too much thread drift...
Especially in Italy i would be very cautious with time planning ... arrived in Genoa for refuelling and told TWR on approach only to find they just started their lunch break and sat for hours on the apron at 30+ degrees.
Lunch break is lunch break...
Such a ferry trip should be fun ... plan accordingly and you will have lots of it.
Enjoy ... usually you do not do such a trip too often
Especially in Italy i would be very cautious with time planning ... arrived in Genoa for refuelling and told TWR on approach only to find they just started their lunch break and sat for hours on the apron at 30+ degrees.
Lunch break is lunch break...
Such a ferry trip should be fun ... plan accordingly and you will have lots of it.
Enjoy ... usually you do not do such a trip too often
