Police helicopter crashes onto Glasgow pub
JR,
Go back and read what I wrote.
Or take a photo in the cruise when the fuel is below the "fence".
i.e. the lines between the SUPPLY and MAIN.
As the 135 flies Left Hand down the numbers will be different to what is in your photo on the ground.
Be very careful reading the TRAINING MANUAL and confusing it with facts.
I think at last count there are about 16 variations or more of the EC 135.
Go back and read what I wrote.
Or take a photo in the cruise when the fuel is below the "fence".
i.e. the lines between the SUPPLY and MAIN.
As the 135 flies Left Hand down the numbers will be different to what is in your photo on the ground.
Be very careful reading the TRAINING MANUAL and confusing it with facts.
I think at last count there are about 16 variations or more of the EC 135.
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RVDT, thats exactly what I did as I thought that surely it can't be a good thing to have a rad alt unavailable in such circumstances. On ours the Rad Alt is still on, does yours drop off, as your earlier pits suggests?
Cheers
TeeS
Edited to say I've just seen your post 1103 SS and I think that answers my question.
For anyone following CJ Romeo's description of the area, Bing Maps gives a good overview; zoom into Glasgow and along the river, select 'bird's eye' for an oblique view from the SE,
Bing Maps - Driving Directions, Traffic and Road Conditions
Bing Maps - Driving Directions, Traffic and Road Conditions
DoubleBogey is probably correct to suggest that as the Nr reduce ,due to a high blade pitch angle,the hydraulic output of the pump(s)?) will reduce and be unable to overpower the loading on the jacks,leading to jackstall and then loss of all hydraulic pressure as the Nr reduce further.
It is possible to recover RRPM also by rolling into a descending turn and applying `g`; also helps in situations where ice may be building ,not shedding,on the blades,and the drag rise following an engine failure may well drag RRPM rapidly down.
It is possible to recover RRPM also by rolling into a descending turn and applying `g`; also helps in situations where ice may be building ,not shedding,on the blades,and the drag rise following an engine failure may well drag RRPM rapidly down.
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sorry for some question which I guess must have been raised before: the other new thread regarding 1 or 2 pilots mentioned the left hand seats of UK police 135's has no pedals and cyclic control. But the collective is still fully exposed and accessible to the right hand of any person in the left seat? by accident, when the pilot tries to recover from an engine failure or so and needs his left hand on some switches?
Last edited by xlsky; 11th Dec 2013 at 22:09. Reason: getting tired typing nonsense
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xlsky wrote:
Let's hope he's talking about the Collective.
sorry for some question which I guess must have been raised before: the other new thread regarding 1 or 2 pilots mentioned the left hand seats of UK police 135's has no pedals and cyclic control. But the cyclic is still fully exposed and accessible to the right hand of any person in the left seat? by accident, when the pilot tries to recover from an engine failure or so and needs his left hand on some switches?
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Once enjoying a landing in the jump seat of an airbus the captain was very insisting all the straps had been used and secured tight. I was told about an incident during a landing when somebody in the jump seat slipped thru the straps after the wheel brakes and reverse was fully applied and then hit the throttle.. the airbus nearly took off again..
so what if the observer wasn't 'secured' in the straps and whilst the heli went into some unusual position due to fuel, fenestron, engine failure ect the left seat person tried to hold on to something?
so what if the observer wasn't 'secured' in the straps and whilst the heli went into some unusual position due to fuel, fenestron, engine failure ect the left seat person tried to hold on to something?
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"Just a thought.
How often does AAIB release preliminary findings in less than a fortnight?"
In the old days they never used to release preliminary reports, but they started doing it in the last decade or so.
They tend to do it with any high profile or high interest incident or where they discover a serious issue that may affect airworthiness on a type.....the 777 at Heathrow had a number of preliminary reports as did the spate of puma incidents in the north sea. There have been quite a few other instances of preliminary reports too.
Here's a list of them Air Accidents Investigation: Special bulletins
How often does AAIB release preliminary findings in less than a fortnight?"
In the old days they never used to release preliminary reports, but they started doing it in the last decade or so.
They tend to do it with any high profile or high interest incident or where they discover a serious issue that may affect airworthiness on a type.....the 777 at Heathrow had a number of preliminary reports as did the spate of puma incidents in the north sea. There have been quite a few other instances of preliminary reports too.
Here's a list of them Air Accidents Investigation: Special bulletins
control during "tumbling"
In relation to witnesses describing the tumbling motion.
During a tumbling or spinning like descent is it possible for the pilot to have any influence over the direction of the flight?
If some directional or descent control is possible during a spinning or tumbling descent, can a pilot keep enough situational awareness to manoeuvre the aircraft toward a particular spot?
Mickjoebill
During a tumbling or spinning like descent is it possible for the pilot to have any influence over the direction of the flight?
If some directional or descent control is possible during a spinning or tumbling descent, can a pilot keep enough situational awareness to manoeuvre the aircraft toward a particular spot?
Mickjoebill
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Police helicopter crashes onto Glasgow pub
Re CJ Romeo's posting on crash site. I doubt the roof of the pub was the target LS however, if Peter Gillies is right, and if Glasgow green or one of the other nearby sites was the first target LS then as things deteriorated in the descent options would narrow. My own view is that the intersection may have been the last resort but they didn't have enough forward speed to make it.
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Not sure whether the radar tapes are going to be much use regarding the speed at which the aircraft descended (fell).
Don't know the 135's systems, but unless the transponder and therefore the Mode C altitude encoding, is wired to the battery bus, when both generators went offline (either by double engine failure or deliberate shutdown), the transponder would have stopped.
Also given the rotational speed of the secondary radar (2-3 secs/rotation?) and the known high rate of descent from a relatively low altitude, the margin of error is going to be large for radar even if the transponder was still online.
Don't know the 135's systems, but unless the transponder and therefore the Mode C altitude encoding, is wired to the battery bus, when both generators went offline (either by double engine failure or deliberate shutdown), the transponder would have stopped.
Also given the rotational speed of the secondary radar (2-3 secs/rotation?) and the known high rate of descent from a relatively low altitude, the margin of error is going to be large for radar even if the transponder was still online.
Sotiras,
From 400Kgs total, (310 in the main), C of G moves 41mm aft as Main Tank fuel reduces to empty. Slight move forward again, (13mm) as Supply tanks reduce to aircraft MLA of 50 Kgs. There is plenty of "slack" in the envelope at those levels.
Aeromys - you are incorrect about the HG aircraft, it was on it's way back to HG yesterday afternoon.
From 400Kgs total, (310 in the main), C of G moves 41mm aft as Main Tank fuel reduces to empty. Slight move forward again, (13mm) as Supply tanks reduce to aircraft MLA of 50 Kgs. There is plenty of "slack" in the envelope at those levels.
Aeromys - you are incorrect about the HG aircraft, it was on it's way back to HG yesterday afternoon.
Last edited by Fortyodd2; 12th Dec 2013 at 07:54.