The difficulty in finding a school to learn to fly...
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,817
Likes: 1
From: Hotel Gypsy
I have little experience of the rotary training world but more than a few years in the fixed wing GA scene (UK).
I must admit that some of the anecdotal stories ring true. Too many schools/clubs treat the customer as an inconvenience. They forget that people with significant disposable income normally have more than a few brain cells and can smell dodgy financial techniques at a mile. Furthermore, customers don't react well to being inconvenienced due to club ineptitude ("sorry, the aircraft is on maintenance/the instructor forgot to come in/we've run out of fuel/the FI is running 2 hours late etc etc").
The UK industry needs to wake up (there are a few good ones out there) and remember that it should provide a service.
I must admit that some of the anecdotal stories ring true. Too many schools/clubs treat the customer as an inconvenience. They forget that people with significant disposable income normally have more than a few brain cells and can smell dodgy financial techniques at a mile. Furthermore, customers don't react well to being inconvenienced due to club ineptitude ("sorry, the aircraft is on maintenance/the instructor forgot to come in/we've run out of fuel/the FI is running 2 hours late etc etc").
The UK industry needs to wake up (there are a few good ones out there) and remember that it should provide a service.
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 458
Likes: 0
From: Kings Caple, Ross-on-Wye.orPiccots End. Hertfordshire
Training
Well here's a fresh idea for prospective pilots to try ...
If you find your local school too offhand, or don't like the MD/CFI or lots of etceteras ... one option is to find a 'freelancer' .. and there are a few of us out there with 10k instructional hours plus.
They will devote 100% of their time to your personal training ... will get you through the PPL(H) in around four weeks ... who won't want money 'up-front' or even a cheque every day you fly ... but normally a 'settle up' perhaps at the end of each week ... and will make sure the flying is fun, challenging and professional, AND take you to a service standard of helicopter handling. You will get to know your instructor really well and latterly as a friend. You may be taught to actually land the beastie 'engine-off' and to cope with the dreaded T/R failure.
You might even get one that doesn't have to charge VAT.
PS ... Not offering my service as mostly booked for 2011.
If you find your local school too offhand, or don't like the MD/CFI or lots of etceteras ... one option is to find a 'freelancer' .. and there are a few of us out there with 10k instructional hours plus.
They will devote 100% of their time to your personal training ... will get you through the PPL(H) in around four weeks ... who won't want money 'up-front' or even a cheque every day you fly ... but normally a 'settle up' perhaps at the end of each week ... and will make sure the flying is fun, challenging and professional, AND take you to a service standard of helicopter handling. You will get to know your instructor really well and latterly as a friend. You may be taught to actually land the beastie 'engine-off' and to cope with the dreaded T/R failure.
You might even get one that doesn't have to charge VAT.
PS ... Not offering my service as mostly booked for 2011.
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 130
Likes: 0
From: On the flip side
Yaaahoo! I have had an introductory helicopter flying lesson which was fantastic! I would love to get my PPL(H) - have the ground study books....not flyin' again yet though....I am helpin' out in the hangers at another local company - ebg Helicopters whose pilots/instructors all seem very friendly and busy! Thanks DennisK for the info re: training..am not surprised you are booked already- I have seen videos of your display flying.......awesome does not even begin to cover it! Will have to look out for your next display. All the best!
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 68
Likes: 0
From: London
I always thought that the internetz was specifically designed so people could criticise other's speeling and grammer...
I had a similar experience when job hunting (was an Irish outfit), the MD very excited about new aircraft and jobs, while a staffer was moping about.
Could just have been he didn't want the competition though!
Keep hunting until you find a place that combines a good instructor, with an organisation that cares well for its aircraft and students. There are, I believe, still plenty about, and it's not all doom and gloom in the UK.
I had a similar experience when job hunting (was an Irish outfit), the MD very excited about new aircraft and jobs, while a staffer was moping about.
Could just have been he didn't want the competition though!
Keep hunting until you find a place that combines a good instructor, with an organisation that cares well for its aircraft and students. There are, I believe, still plenty about, and it's not all doom and gloom in the UK.
Joined: Jul 2001
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL(H)
Posts: 508
Likes: 31
From: UK
Dennis
Well said.
However, if the prospective PPL(H) wants to learn in a turbine, they must now use an FTO/TRTO as our ever safety conscious CAA have deemed it unacceptable to train on a turbine anywhere else. It makes me laugh that in my experience, many FTOs and TRTOs are often (but not always) staffed by less experienced instructors prepared to work for a pittance. The more experienced instructors have either gone do more lucrative work or, like you and I, free-lance for a living.
How can it be safer for an individual to train with a relative novice at an FTO/TRTO than to train with a 'master' like you at an RTF? It's nonsense.
Also not advertising as I too am booked up for a significant proportion of 2011.
JJ
Well said.
However, if the prospective PPL(H) wants to learn in a turbine, they must now use an FTO/TRTO as our ever safety conscious CAA have deemed it unacceptable to train on a turbine anywhere else. It makes me laugh that in my experience, many FTOs and TRTOs are often (but not always) staffed by less experienced instructors prepared to work for a pittance. The more experienced instructors have either gone do more lucrative work or, like you and I, free-lance for a living.
How can it be safer for an individual to train with a relative novice at an FTO/TRTO than to train with a 'master' like you at an RTF? It's nonsense.
Also not advertising as I too am booked up for a significant proportion of 2011.
JJ
Guest
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 191
Likes: 0
From: UK
The whole way the CAA operates with FTOs and RFs is a joke. To teach someone their PPL from scratch, and instill important lessons to them, you need only to be a RF (ie operate out of a campervan in the corner of an airfield).
Yet for a 5 hour type rating you need to be a TRTO with all the associated training manuals, post holders, nominated aircraft etc. Go figure that one out.
I really despair the way the UK flight training industry has gone, no-one wants to instruct as the pay and terms/conditions are terrible (still £45 per hour for the last ten years).
It's viewed as a "stepping stone" job to build hours, you are stuck doing trial lessons for years, pushing aircraft around, acting as unpaid ground handler/refueller/cleaner, exploited by the company
Maybe if you're lucky you might get a sniff of charter work (after paying for your own turbine rating of course). Often the best instructors are the ones doing it for fun/part-time (with another income), they haven't got the extra pressure of trying to earn a living/pay debts off.
Yet for a 5 hour type rating you need to be a TRTO with all the associated training manuals, post holders, nominated aircraft etc. Go figure that one out.
I really despair the way the UK flight training industry has gone, no-one wants to instruct as the pay and terms/conditions are terrible (still £45 per hour for the last ten years).
It's viewed as a "stepping stone" job to build hours, you are stuck doing trial lessons for years, pushing aircraft around, acting as unpaid ground handler/refueller/cleaner, exploited by the company
Maybe if you're lucky you might get a sniff of charter work (after paying for your own turbine rating of course). Often the best instructors are the ones doing it for fun/part-time (with another income), they haven't got the extra pressure of trying to earn a living/pay debts off.
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 235
Likes: 0
From: uk
Thanks all, for your input and thoughts, especially the PM's. I feel I am making good progress, I am managing to hold the hover and even completing 360 turns. The written studies appear daunting (lots to read!!) The instructor is great and I have been assured that I will have one instructor through my PPL - unless I want to change instructor.
It has amazed me how much harder it becomes on a windy day!!
It has amazed me how much harder it becomes on a windy day!!
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 3,670
Likes: 1
From: UK
Girly ignore these cynics. Stick with your gut feelings and listen to Whirly - shes a proper helo pilot and an accountant, too....you'll have a lot in common.
Who cares what your intentions are - people on pprune will always say what they think and too right.....
Enjoy the barracking
Who cares what your intentions are - people on pprune will always say what they think and too right.....
Enjoy the barracking
