Jayrow (incl. Pay & Conditions/EBA)
Join Date: May 2008
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An EBA would have more chance of being negotiated if there were some folks to talk to in senior management in the big glass office next to the airport.........
Might need to Stentcil some new phone numbers on the PBX
Might need to Stentcil some new phone numbers on the PBX
Join Date: May 2008
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Thats a pity and commercially significant GG
If what you say is true, there are only two options available to the pilot body.
1. Stay with the process and HOPE that there will be a favourable outcome.
2. Vote with your feet and move on.
Marching feet have an incredible amount of measured power. Troops marching in time across bridges in WW1 and 2, have been known to set up vibrations that have destroyed bridges and large infrastructure that seemed well built and well enginered...............
Might be time to explore the power of marching feet...............
If what you say is true, there are only two options available to the pilot body.
1. Stay with the process and HOPE that there will be a favourable outcome.
2. Vote with your feet and move on.
Marching feet have an incredible amount of measured power. Troops marching in time across bridges in WW1 and 2, have been known to set up vibrations that have destroyed bridges and large infrastructure that seemed well built and well enginered...............
Might be time to explore the power of marching feet...............
Join Date: Feb 2006
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Jayrow vs reality
Guys,
Interesting stuff - it appears as a thread that Jayrow has picked up where Bristow's left off. Anyone remember Bristow's EBA / Pilots leaving?
Here is what is probably going to happen if the BHA case is anything to go by.
1. Management will refuse to negotiate or their offer will be so inadequate that it'll be laughed at out loud by the Pilot Committee / Body.
2. Some pilots may need to walk in order for management to get the message (remember 6 pilots left BHA in approx 9 months prior to the EBA getting through).
3. Manangement will realise their Pilots and their reps are serious and get back to talking, or, they will test the resolve of their Pilots, realise that they are not prepared to take approapriate action and call their bluff.
The thing here is unity amongst the Pilot Group. If management can spot that there is no real resolve then your doomed from the start. Remember guys, the BHA Committee and the pilots they represented were 100% committed and stuck to their guns throughout - so much so that the company wouldn't even bother to put the EBA to vote unless the Committee endorsed it whole heartedly.
Do the boys at Jayrow have that kind of resolve?
This is what is at stake in case there is any doubt as to who earns what is this game.
CHC - currently under negotiation. Their current EBA is on http://www.wagenet.gov.au/WageNet/Search/search.asp.
Jayrow - likewise.
BHA - for year 8 Capts / SFOs / FOs.
Capt - $157,770 (includes $19,992 of DTAs grossed up).
SFO - $141,187 (as above).
FO - $105,333 (includes $16,464 of DTAs grossed up).
Of course there are a number of other items such as supervisory allowances, O/T (3 x your daily salary) and my personal favourite, the sunglasses allowance ($270 every 2 years). A 15 year Training Capt will be on about $189,000.
What's more, a further 5% increase will occur in Jul next year and then we go back into negotiations at the beginning of 2010 to do it all again!
In the meantime, the company is growing at an (almost) alarming rate. Last time I heard, we needed 20 new pilots last week. So what are you all waiting for?
The Domicile Policy to be resolved no doubt - sorry I can't help you there.
Good luck. Remember, "You don't get paid what you deserve, you get paid what you can negotiate".
P68
Interesting stuff - it appears as a thread that Jayrow has picked up where Bristow's left off. Anyone remember Bristow's EBA / Pilots leaving?
Here is what is probably going to happen if the BHA case is anything to go by.
1. Management will refuse to negotiate or their offer will be so inadequate that it'll be laughed at out loud by the Pilot Committee / Body.
2. Some pilots may need to walk in order for management to get the message (remember 6 pilots left BHA in approx 9 months prior to the EBA getting through).
3. Manangement will realise their Pilots and their reps are serious and get back to talking, or, they will test the resolve of their Pilots, realise that they are not prepared to take approapriate action and call their bluff.
The thing here is unity amongst the Pilot Group. If management can spot that there is no real resolve then your doomed from the start. Remember guys, the BHA Committee and the pilots they represented were 100% committed and stuck to their guns throughout - so much so that the company wouldn't even bother to put the EBA to vote unless the Committee endorsed it whole heartedly.
Do the boys at Jayrow have that kind of resolve?
This is what is at stake in case there is any doubt as to who earns what is this game.
CHC - currently under negotiation. Their current EBA is on http://www.wagenet.gov.au/WageNet/Search/search.asp.
Jayrow - likewise.
BHA - for year 8 Capts / SFOs / FOs.
Capt - $157,770 (includes $19,992 of DTAs grossed up).
SFO - $141,187 (as above).
FO - $105,333 (includes $16,464 of DTAs grossed up).
Of course there are a number of other items such as supervisory allowances, O/T (3 x your daily salary) and my personal favourite, the sunglasses allowance ($270 every 2 years). A 15 year Training Capt will be on about $189,000.
What's more, a further 5% increase will occur in Jul next year and then we go back into negotiations at the beginning of 2010 to do it all again!
In the meantime, the company is growing at an (almost) alarming rate. Last time I heard, we needed 20 new pilots last week. So what are you all waiting for?
The Domicile Policy to be resolved no doubt - sorry I can't help you there.
Good luck. Remember, "You don't get paid what you deserve, you get paid what you can negotiate".
P68
Well said Papa!!!
You sound like a wise aviator. Probably not funny looking either.
The Jayrow guys need to stick together.
I believe CHC pilots are at this point now.
Exambohugethighs I believe it's better to attempt to improve your conditions with your current employer than just say "Oh stuff 'em" and move on to greener pastures. There wouldn't be greener pastures if no group of employees had the resolve and unity to improve their conditions. At least today if it look like management still don't give toss there are numerous opportunities available.
The Bristow guys and girls have done this and their company isn't going to go broke.
We are all an asset not a cost, so it's time each respective management acknowledged this.
You sound like a wise aviator. Probably not funny looking either.
The Jayrow guys need to stick together.
I believe CHC pilots are at this point now.
Exambohugethighs I believe it's better to attempt to improve your conditions with your current employer than just say "Oh stuff 'em" and move on to greener pastures. There wouldn't be greener pastures if no group of employees had the resolve and unity to improve their conditions. At least today if it look like management still don't give toss there are numerous opportunities available.
The Bristow guys and girls have done this and their company isn't going to go broke.
We are all an asset not a cost, so it's time each respective management acknowledged this.
Join Date: Oct 2005
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.......we needed 20 new pilots last week.
Thanks for all that P68.....:
You wrote:
"In the meantime, the company is growing at an (almost) alarming rate. Last time I heard, we needed 20 new pilots last week. So what are you all waiting for?"
.....it would/could have been 19 (and maybe even less !) if your HR Dept had got back to me (and maybe others !) at any time over the last 8 weeks since my application has been sitting in the "In" tray !
Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't want to work in HR for quids..., but a "Got that, wait out" would be good.....
RB
You wrote:
"In the meantime, the company is growing at an (almost) alarming rate. Last time I heard, we needed 20 new pilots last week. So what are you all waiting for?"
.....it would/could have been 19 (and maybe even less !) if your HR Dept had got back to me (and maybe others !) at any time over the last 8 weeks since my application has been sitting in the "In" tray !
Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't want to work in HR for quids..., but a "Got that, wait out" would be good.....
RB
Join Date: Jan 2005
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...growing at an ( almost ) alarming rate
Talking with those in the southern division of Jayrow things are very similar for them.They are getting by with overseas crews (ERA C++ Karratha
COUGAR S61 Geraldton).
If they want to ATTRACT and RETAIN Australian crews word is Jayrow Management will need a big change in thinking.Offering CPI for the next few years will not do this.
Pilots will walk as Pilot's do and talking to the guys a number have resumes in with other companies.So with crew shortages everywhere expect some movement sooner rather than later.
Greener Grass is more than just a PPRuNe handle.
Plonkey Pilot.
COUGAR S61 Geraldton).
If they want to ATTRACT and RETAIN Australian crews word is Jayrow Management will need a big change in thinking.Offering CPI for the next few years will not do this.
Pilots will walk as Pilot's do and talking to the guys a number have resumes in with other companies.So with crew shortages everywhere expect some movement sooner rather than later.
Greener Grass is more than just a PPRuNe handle.
Plonkey Pilot.
Join Date: Oct 1999
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So where are Jayrow at with the negotiations? - has the company offered more than CPI or are they content to haemorrage all their pilots elsewhere before having to pay a disproportionate amount of cash to retrain a new aircrew body?
More foresight everyone..more foresight...
More foresight everyone..more foresight...
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They are getting by with overseas crews (ERA C++ Karratha COUGAR S61 Geraldton).
I thought that Cougar and ERA would cross hire aircraft with the contract condition that they are crewed by their own pilots.
Correct me if I am mistaken...
.
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Jayrow pay and conditions
If the Jayrow boys want to move plenty of jobs around for experienced IFR Pilots.
Also with the MPT industry now going down the IFR road even they have recognised the need to compensate appropriately.
Jayrow doesn't even make the top 3 when it comes to salaries for qualified IFR Pilots in Australian now.
Also with the MPT industry now going down the IFR road even they have recognised the need to compensate appropriately.
Jayrow doesn't even make the top 3 when it comes to salaries for qualified IFR Pilots in Australian now.
Other Side Of The Fence
Looking over the fence from where I sit the grass definitely isn't greener in the Jayrow paddock.
Who wants to give up equal time for a four on two off roster and spend half your working days shut down on a rig in the middle of Bass Strait? All for substandard salaries.
Their management need to offer something better for those sort of working conditions. Won't get me there.
GG
Who wants to give up equal time for a four on two off roster and spend half your working days shut down on a rig in the middle of Bass Strait? All for substandard salaries.
Their management need to offer something better for those sort of working conditions. Won't get me there.
GG
Join Date: Feb 2006
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HR Depts et al...
Royal Blue,
I sympathise with your situation as it must be v frustrating.
I believe the problem of rapid expansion goes much further than just putting bums on seats - if it were that easy, BHA wouldn't have a crewing problem as I'm sure the pilots are out there. The reality is, the company is a 'little' stretched at the moment and that means in areas apart from the crewing of aircraft.
It is often a case of picking which part of the jigsaw is the most limiting and at BHA it's probably a race between engineers and tooling. The training dept is also flat out so whilst BHA would love to increase their crewing, and by default, the number of aircraft earning revenue, the reality is far more difficult to manage.
I agree a letter would be polite but i'm guessing your application is just one of many and the HR department simply can't respond to them all.
P68
I sympathise with your situation as it must be v frustrating.
I believe the problem of rapid expansion goes much further than just putting bums on seats - if it were that easy, BHA wouldn't have a crewing problem as I'm sure the pilots are out there. The reality is, the company is a 'little' stretched at the moment and that means in areas apart from the crewing of aircraft.
It is often a case of picking which part of the jigsaw is the most limiting and at BHA it's probably a race between engineers and tooling. The training dept is also flat out so whilst BHA would love to increase their crewing, and by default, the number of aircraft earning revenue, the reality is far more difficult to manage.
I agree a letter would be polite but i'm guessing your application is just one of many and the HR department simply can't respond to them all.
P68
Join Date: Oct 1999
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Sticking together gets better results for all, unless you're a bean-counter in a helicopter company Monsieur Nr....
I'm with you GG; well paid under-achievement whilst professionally meeting the client requirements is a good place to sit. Want me to over-achieve?...compensate me accordingly!
I'm with you GG; well paid under-achievement whilst professionally meeting the client requirements is a good place to sit. Want me to over-achieve?...compensate me accordingly!
High Nr
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Greener Grass
Looks like things are greening up.
The Tooradin boys and the East Coast tourers now have a couple of new options acording to the other threads.
Will Jayrow Management respond with an offer or just keep delaying.
Word across the fence is if they are too slow then they will be too late.
Plonkey Pilot
The Tooradin boys and the East Coast tourers now have a couple of new options acording to the other threads.
Will Jayrow Management respond with an offer or just keep delaying.
Word across the fence is if they are too slow then they will be too late.
Plonkey Pilot
Good Timing
Word is, the Jayrow pilots had an Australia wide meeting yesterday to discuss what to do about their management's willingness, or lack of, to negotiate with them. I'm sure we'll see their plan of action in due course.
Quite timely that Bristow announce a change to their domicile policy, and HA's new contract becomes common knowledge at the same time as the Jayrow meeting. If Jayrow management continue to stall I'm sure a few appropriately qualified drivers will be looking west, especially now that they won't have to move their families to Perth. Stay where you are boys and take the chance an EBA will be in place some time soon or move on and earn more now.
The salary figures Papa68 quoted must be very appealing.
Quite timely that Bristow announce a change to their domicile policy, and HA's new contract becomes common knowledge at the same time as the Jayrow meeting. If Jayrow management continue to stall I'm sure a few appropriately qualified drivers will be looking west, especially now that they won't have to move their families to Perth. Stay where you are boys and take the chance an EBA will be in place some time soon or move on and earn more now.
The salary figures Papa68 quoted must be very appealing.
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P72 vs GG
If you look at the two "hot" threads at the moment relating to BHA's and Jayrow's respective EBAs, it's interesting to note that:
1. Pepi72 reckons some of the guys at BHA have received a raw deal over the new domicile policy and may therefore leave, and;
2. GG reckons Jayrow's stalling on their yet to be agreed EBA will result in some of their guys moving on.
So there can only only be three possible scenarios, either they're both right, they're both wrong or one of them is right.
Start placing your bets...
P68
PS. For the record, I think GG is on the money.
1. Pepi72 reckons some of the guys at BHA have received a raw deal over the new domicile policy and may therefore leave, and;
2. GG reckons Jayrow's stalling on their yet to be agreed EBA will result in some of their guys moving on.
So there can only only be three possible scenarios, either they're both right, they're both wrong or one of them is right.
Start placing your bets...
P68
PS. For the record, I think GG is on the money.