Blackhawk pilot roles
Avoid imitations
Joined: Nov 2000
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
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From: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
From what I recall, it's a two pilot machine as far as the flight manual goes, but there is a procedure for single pilot ground runs.
I believe it was made so mainly because of the practicalities of engine control handling in emergency situations.
I believe it was made so mainly because of the practicalities of engine control handling in emergency situations.
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 147
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From: USA
The Hawk could be flown single pilot if you absolutely had to, but as alluded to above with a governor failure, manipulating the throttles without another body up front would be hard to say the least. Basically one pilot flies and the other navigates and handles the radios.
EDIT: I agree with the post below, EPs would suck single pilot.
EDIT: I agree with the post below, EPs would suck single pilot.
Last edited by busdriver02; 29th February 2008 at 01:31.
Joined: May 2002
Aviation Qualifications: ATP+Mil
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From: Downeast
Care to tell us what other emergencies in the BlackHawk require two pilots as a minimum? I guess a Fort Rucker blessed Instructor Pilot is suitably trained to fly the machine solo as he would have to do so with two brand new to the Blackhawk student pilots along on their first flight.
Joined: Dec 2006
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From: yes
While I've trained new pilots and flown demos with non-rated individuals, I've never flown one with the opposite seat empty. Several emergencies in critical modes of flight are easier/safer when handled by a crew of two or more. Engine failures, fires, governing problems along with hydraulic/flight control malfunctions occurring at inopportune times could quickly lead to pilot overload, and respect the dreaded multiple emergency situation too. However, if properly trained, all but the worst situation could probably be survived by a competent single-handed pilot. Remember to consider visibility, mission and environment. While almost any decent pilot could solo a UH-60 on a day VFR hop between two airports, don't forget to think in terms of an NVG sling-load off a hostile Afghanistan mountain top in a snow storm.
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 378
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From: Australia
In Australia the Blackhawks used to be able to be flown single pilot/two crew ie: (single pilot with competent person in left seat) but after a couple of accidents they are flown only dual pilot now, I have about 60-70 hrs left seat in Blackhawk as all the test flying used to be done with a Pilot right seat and Technician in left seat (me!!!). but those days are over its been dual pilot since about 1995, I used to be able to do APU runs and engine runs with rotor brake on but once again those days are gone ,only pilots can run APU's and Engines on Australian Blackhawks now.
Avoid imitations
Joined: Nov 2000
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 15,110
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From: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
The collective pitch boost failure could be an interesting one to deal with. 80 lbs push / pull depending on the stage of flight. My voice goes funny whilst weight lifting 
Of course, I'm sure there are some macho men out there who used to fly like that all the time, just for fun, as well as doing a one-armed paper hangar act and juggling plates to make it more interesting.
Of course, I'm sure there are some macho men out there who used to fly like that all the time, just for fun, as well as doing a one-armed paper hangar act and juggling plates to make it more interesting.
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 19
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From: Townsville
Blackhawk9: As a former Blackhawk maintainer from ASGW for the last 6 years can I please correct a few things you have written.
Firstly all Test Flights are done by a UMTP single seat (can be dual but usually single - it is hard enough to get one pilot for maintenance test flights let alone two - unless it means the aircrew cannot fly to the beach on the weekend for a jolly, then its all pilots on deck!!) The UMTP will sit in the RHS. And thats since 2002 when I started on working on them. Any vibe test flights, transmission, hover checks etc that I have been on, involved with or had to manage more recently, have all been single pilot, same goes for 5AVN where I am currently located. I too have flown LHS in a fair few test flights - all logged in my aircrew logbook as well
Maintainers promulgated under local SI's, and having passed the appropriate course IAW the 059 can also carry out APU ground runs as well. Thats been in since about 2004. You still need a pilot (they do not need to be UMTP qualified) for any engine ground runs rotor turning or not.
I would suggest that times have changed a lot since you last had hands on with the BH
, the 059 alone has been changed a lot in the last 2-3 years!
Firstly all Test Flights are done by a UMTP single seat (can be dual but usually single - it is hard enough to get one pilot for maintenance test flights let alone two - unless it means the aircrew cannot fly to the beach on the weekend for a jolly, then its all pilots on deck!!) The UMTP will sit in the RHS. And thats since 2002 when I started on working on them. Any vibe test flights, transmission, hover checks etc that I have been on, involved with or had to manage more recently, have all been single pilot, same goes for 5AVN where I am currently located. I too have flown LHS in a fair few test flights - all logged in my aircrew logbook as well
Maintainers promulgated under local SI's, and having passed the appropriate course IAW the 059 can also carry out APU ground runs as well. Thats been in since about 2004. You still need a pilot (they do not need to be UMTP qualified) for any engine ground runs rotor turning or not.
I would suggest that times have changed a lot since you last had hands on with the BH
, the 059 alone has been changed a lot in the last 2-3 years!
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,017
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From: Hobe Sound, Florida
Collective Boost Failure/Single Pilot in UH-60
Good Afternoon Shytorque,
Some interesting relevant history:
When the USAF decided on adding the UH-60 to their helicopter fleet, they conducted a test program out at Edwards AFB, and the SA Project Pilot for this effort was Phil Pacini ( ex USAF Academy and Jolly Green Pilot ).
The USAF decided that it was necessary to perform air to air refueling with the boost off ( and in the A model, that meant: no collective boost, no yaw boost and no pitch boost ). So Phil went out and successfully did the refueling envelope with the boost off.
Phil is quite a pilot and is now the Chief Pilot at the Development Flight test Center at West Palm Beach.
Phil never tells people about this but he was a USAF HH-53 pilot during the Mayaguez rescue battle. Phil had his ship pretty shot up during the assault landing, so he did what the 1870's cavalry advised their troops when their horse was shot out from underneath them: he became and fought as infantry ( actually Phil probably didn't have much choice at the time ).
Appreciate your giving me the chance to " out " Phil Pacini.
John Dixson
Some interesting relevant history:
When the USAF decided on adding the UH-60 to their helicopter fleet, they conducted a test program out at Edwards AFB, and the SA Project Pilot for this effort was Phil Pacini ( ex USAF Academy and Jolly Green Pilot ).
The USAF decided that it was necessary to perform air to air refueling with the boost off ( and in the A model, that meant: no collective boost, no yaw boost and no pitch boost ). So Phil went out and successfully did the refueling envelope with the boost off.
Phil is quite a pilot and is now the Chief Pilot at the Development Flight test Center at West Palm Beach.
Phil never tells people about this but he was a USAF HH-53 pilot during the Mayaguez rescue battle. Phil had his ship pretty shot up during the assault landing, so he did what the 1870's cavalry advised their troops when their horse was shot out from underneath them: he became and fought as infantry ( actually Phil probably didn't have much choice at the time ).
Appreciate your giving me the chance to " out " Phil Pacini.
John Dixson
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,017
Likes: 165
From: Hobe Sound, Florida
Blackhawk Single Pilot
Sorry for the delay, but I had to confirm what I thought I remembered.
LA County FD was approved to fly their ships single pilot VFR ( approval recommended an observer in the other seat ). For single pilot IFR, we took a position that the same changes as the FAA approved for S-76 single pilot IFR were required. To date no one has requested/purchased that configuration.
John Dixson
LA County FD was approved to fly their ships single pilot VFR ( approval recommended an observer in the other seat ). For single pilot IFR, we took a position that the same changes as the FAA approved for S-76 single pilot IFR were required. To date no one has requested/purchased that configuration.
John Dixson
Avoid imitations
Joined: Nov 2000
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 15,110
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From: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
John, interesting stuff, thanks! The ones I flew were supposedly civilian S-70 models but were operated on a "Permit to fly". They are now back in the USA after a few years a lot further east.
