North Sea Mechanical Rescue Devices
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DC - Daughter Craft. Bigger and more substantial than an FRC.
PFEER - Prevention of Fire and Explosion and Emergency Response.
Dacon Scoop - worth a Google if you have a minute.
PFEER - Prevention of Fire and Explosion and Emergency Response.
Dacon Scoop - worth a Google if you have a minute.
Last edited by RedWhite&Blue; 30th Jan 2008 at 07:47.
A close relation of mine works North Sea SBV's. He has told me that they only train the crews for rescues to 3.5m swell. Over that, it's down to the experience and willingness of the Capt and crew to launch or not. He also said he wouldn't fancy being the person being recovered by Dacon scoop in heavy seas, unless it was just for recovery of bodies!!
This from someone who has been working at sea for 40+years!!
This from someone who has been working at sea for 40+years!!
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Apologies for not replying sooner (pressure of work etc etc )
Apparently two meetings were held yesterday on the subject – any feed back ? nothing from this end I’m afraid.
Hellimut – what exactly does your close relative do? Is he the cook, and Engineer, Seaman ??? Yes they only EXERCISE up to about 3.5 metres to give them a margin against injuring themselves – the real deal and risk parameters change. Also 3.5m is a fairly arbitrary figure – see previous on water depth, tides etc.
Whether he fancies it or not it gives a good prospect of recovery.
RW&B Thanks for the bigger picture regarding SNS ops.
I would not even try to put a quantification on what 's “good prospect of recovery” . All I can say is that flying is perhaps the most prescriptive industry there is and that the “definitive point” model does not always translate to other spheres. Also perhaps the “good prospect of flying / arriving” is still one of your mental processes; whilst virtually all your risk has been engineered out of decisions making progress I bet you still think twice before flying in marginal conditions.
Ref your observation on manoeuvrability I don’t want to quote rules but the vessels themselves must be able to (and in reality are capable of) “without headway / sternway hold its desired position while carrying out rescue operations, to avoid hazard to persons in the water in all but exceptional weather”. Couple that to a good ship handling Captain and his team and you have something that will save you, not finish you off.
This, I don’t believe, is going to be the right medium to re-assure you that dacon scoops are okay, hopefully BALPA will do hat with the right resources being supplied to them by the stand-by industry – I’m not holding my breath though !
Safe Flights
SM
Apparently two meetings were held yesterday on the subject – any feed back ? nothing from this end I’m afraid.
Hellimut – what exactly does your close relative do? Is he the cook, and Engineer, Seaman ??? Yes they only EXERCISE up to about 3.5 metres to give them a margin against injuring themselves – the real deal and risk parameters change. Also 3.5m is a fairly arbitrary figure – see previous on water depth, tides etc.
Whether he fancies it or not it gives a good prospect of recovery.
RW&B Thanks for the bigger picture regarding SNS ops.
I would not even try to put a quantification on what 's “good prospect of recovery” . All I can say is that flying is perhaps the most prescriptive industry there is and that the “definitive point” model does not always translate to other spheres. Also perhaps the “good prospect of flying / arriving” is still one of your mental processes; whilst virtually all your risk has been engineered out of decisions making progress I bet you still think twice before flying in marginal conditions.
Ref your observation on manoeuvrability I don’t want to quote rules but the vessels themselves must be able to (and in reality are capable of) “without headway / sternway hold its desired position while carrying out rescue operations, to avoid hazard to persons in the water in all but exceptional weather”. Couple that to a good ship handling Captain and his team and you have something that will save you, not finish you off.
This, I don’t believe, is going to be the right medium to re-assure you that dacon scoops are okay, hopefully BALPA will do hat with the right resources being supplied to them by the stand-by industry – I’m not holding my breath though !
Safe Flights
SM
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Ship Manager, you say the vessel must be able to;
“without headway / sternway hold its desired position while carrying out rescue operations, to avoid hazard to persons in the water in all but exceptional weather”.
Is this not the crux of the matter? We, as pilots, are concerned here with operating in exceptional weather.
I accept that should a platform find itself with a man overboard, in exceptional weather, the Scoop may well offer a very welcome rescue of the last resort.
Would it not be more sensible to choose to fly in less exceptional weather when a more acceptable level of risk is available for all those involved?
I rest my case.
ATB
Red
“without headway / sternway hold its desired position while carrying out rescue operations, to avoid hazard to persons in the water in all but exceptional weather”.
Is this not the crux of the matter? We, as pilots, are concerned here with operating in exceptional weather.
I accept that should a platform find itself with a man overboard, in exceptional weather, the Scoop may well offer a very welcome rescue of the last resort.
Would it not be more sensible to choose to fly in less exceptional weather when a more acceptable level of risk is available for all those involved?
I rest my case.
ATB
Red
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Where you draw the line and refuse to operate is a matter of professional judgement. It's the classic superior pilot - superior judgement - avoids need for superior skill - debate. I'm glad that when I have to make it there is no commercial element!
As regards the skills of the rig safety vessel crews. The last time I saw this was August 2005 in the SNS when the crew of the Puttford Provider manouvered close enough to the very small sailing yacht Molly Louise to hold a voice conversation over their bow with the one person on board. As a result of that conversation they established that 3 people were in the water. They gave us a position to go to, and within 30 seconds of arrival there we found the people in the water - 2 recovered alive. Our crew collected several awards. I have always felt that Puttford Provider should have had more recognition. Their seamanship was first-rate. I felt that, had the job been close in under a rig, they could probably have done better than we could (given a 63 ft rotor diameter) in closing a survivor. To watch a very substantial vessel close on a tiny little yacht in seas around 15-20 ft without error was impressive.
Sven
As regards the skills of the rig safety vessel crews. The last time I saw this was August 2005 in the SNS when the crew of the Puttford Provider manouvered close enough to the very small sailing yacht Molly Louise to hold a voice conversation over their bow with the one person on board. As a result of that conversation they established that 3 people were in the water. They gave us a position to go to, and within 30 seconds of arrival there we found the people in the water - 2 recovered alive. Our crew collected several awards. I have always felt that Puttford Provider should have had more recognition. Their seamanship was first-rate. I felt that, had the job been close in under a rig, they could probably have done better than we could (given a 63 ft rotor diameter) in closing a survivor. To watch a very substantial vessel close on a tiny little yacht in seas around 15-20 ft without error was impressive.
Sven
