EC 135 Empty Weight
Joined: Oct 1999
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 7,371
Likes: 926
From: Den Haag
Malaprop, you're not living up to your title! Shirley you should have written:
"About 2100kg with [currantly] a 2835 MTOW; take a weigh 270kg for crewe leaves 465kg, so say just over 2hrs be four it all goes quite." ?
"About 2100kg with [currantly] a 2835 MTOW; take a weigh 270kg for crewe leaves 465kg, so say just over 2hrs be four it all goes quite." ?
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,951
Likes: 90
From: After all, what’s more important than proving to someone on the internet that they’re wrong? - Manson
EC135 P2 Current AC with the following:
3 Screen (SMD 68 LHS)
Autopilot
Wire Strike Protection
Air Conditioning (Mechanical Not ECD)
Pop Out Floats
FM VHF UHF
Sat Com Iridium
TCAS
Dual Garmin installation
VIP Interior
Empty Weight = 1958 kg direct from RFM not a guess
2850 - 1958 = 892 kg Useful
OEI HOGE 1000' +20C ~ 2570 kg
Fuel Flow 185~195 kg/hr
Certain P2's and T2's are economic to upgrade to P2+ or T2+ which gives same performance as P2i or T2i i.e 60 kg increase in MTOW
3 Screen (SMD 68 LHS)
Autopilot
Wire Strike Protection
Air Conditioning (Mechanical Not ECD)
Pop Out Floats
FM VHF UHF
Sat Com Iridium
TCAS
Dual Garmin installation
VIP Interior
Empty Weight = 1958 kg direct from RFM not a guess
2850 - 1958 = 892 kg Useful
OEI HOGE 1000' +20C ~ 2570 kg
Fuel Flow 185~195 kg/hr
Certain P2's and T2's are economic to upgrade to P2+ or T2+ which gives same performance as P2i or T2i i.e 60 kg increase in MTOW
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 103
Likes: 0
From: USA
Compare to PC1 requlation
So, if you have:
- Empty weight (with HEMS equipments) = 2100 kg
- 3 crew = 255 kg
- fuel 1h 20 min (190 kg/h) ~ 253 kg
Total mission weight is 2608 kg. Can you meet all CAT A segments (1 and 2) with this weight?
Examble OAT 20 C, PA 500 ft, Weight 2608kg:
If you lose one engine before LDP with CAT A helipad landing procedure to Hems Hospital Site. What would be the Vtoss that enables you to continue your flight to meet segment 1 (ROC 100ft/min to 200 ft) in CAT A?
Hostile
- Empty weight (with HEMS equipments) = 2100 kg
- 3 crew = 255 kg
- fuel 1h 20 min (190 kg/h) ~ 253 kg
Total mission weight is 2608 kg. Can you meet all CAT A segments (1 and 2) with this weight?
Examble OAT 20 C, PA 500 ft, Weight 2608kg:
If you lose one engine before LDP with CAT A helipad landing procedure to Hems Hospital Site. What would be the Vtoss that enables you to continue your flight to meet segment 1 (ROC 100ft/min to 200 ft) in CAT A?
Hostile
Last edited by hostile; 19th May 2007 at 03:15.
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,951
Likes: 90
From: After all, what’s more important than proving to someone on the internet that they’re wrong? - Manson
Vtoss would be 40 KIAS and doesnt change!
I think the answer you are looking for is the gradient in those conditions for Segment 1.
2 MIN Power OEI
My calculations say it would be ~20% ~ 11.3 degrees.
At 1.5% Segment 1 the aircraft could be at MTOW and ~ 42 C
You would achieve 200' in 1000' horizontal at 40 KIAS ~ 4000 H fpm~ 15 seconds ~ 800 V fpm.
Segment 2 MCP OEI Vy 65KIAS at those numbers would be ~ 6% or more all the way up to ~ 12-13,000'
1000' above departure at MTOW and 42 on the ground, the gradient would be ~ 2%.
NIL WIND in all of the above and data is for P2.
I think the answer you are looking for is the gradient in those conditions for Segment 1.
2 MIN Power OEI
My calculations say it would be ~20% ~ 11.3 degrees.
At 1.5% Segment 1 the aircraft could be at MTOW and ~ 42 C
You would achieve 200' in 1000' horizontal at 40 KIAS ~ 4000 H fpm~ 15 seconds ~ 800 V fpm.
Segment 2 MCP OEI Vy 65KIAS at those numbers would be ~ 6% or more all the way up to ~ 12-13,000'
1000' above departure at MTOW and 42 on the ground, the gradient would be ~ 2%.
NIL WIND in all of the above and data is for P2.
Last edited by RVDT; 19th May 2007 at 08:57.
Thread Starter
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 124
Likes: 0
From: Finland
I have heard from some people that the EC-135P2 is so powerfull OEI that you don't have to comply with the JAR-OPS 3 obstacle clearance and take-off /landing distance requirements i.e. it is able to climb vertical OEI at MTOW?
On the other hand I have heard some pilots saying that during warm summer days they have had problem to have enought power AEO to become airborne with a patient onboard (4 persons onboard)?....Maybe they have just been overweight??
On the other hand I have heard some pilots saying that during warm summer days they have had problem to have enought power AEO to become airborne with a patient onboard (4 persons onboard)?....Maybe they have just been overweight??
Last edited by Vertolot; 20th May 2007 at 09:54.
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 496
Likes: 4
From: Norfolk
Eddie is right in his first paragraph; don't confuse the 135's OEI capabilities [which are very good] with its AEO, which at MTOM are much less impressive. Not sure where he gets his empty weights from, even though it's a DPIFR; ours is a police one SPIFR but I know the earlierl statement of UK HEMS ones being about 2100kg is fairly accurate - of course it depends on what you specify as an "EMS fit".
