Civilian Helicopter down in Iraq
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Can you name some of these evil "Neo-con's" that seem to have it in mind to steal your gold crowns?
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Can you name some of these evil "Neo-con's" that seem to have it in mind to steal your gold crowns?
Look at the signatories at the bottom of this page; Statement of Principles
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Gatvol
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"My argument is that a few people, called Neo-Cons, are becoming excessively wealthy, satisfying their 'Need for Greed'. "
Dave,
Thats good, but it applies to just about every business in the U.S. Last time I checked the gap between the Rich and the rest of us is getting wider. I guess we can say God Bless America, but I think its going to be an issue down the road. Maybe if a few of those "Golden Parachutes" didnt open, some would get a wake up call.
And Yes, I also accept free Beer........for any reason.
Dave,
Thats good, but it applies to just about every business in the U.S. Last time I checked the gap between the Rich and the rest of us is getting wider. I guess we can say God Bless America, but I think its going to be an issue down the road. Maybe if a few of those "Golden Parachutes" didnt open, some would get a wake up call.
And Yes, I also accept free Beer........for any reason.
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Nick,
OK, but two requests;
SASless comes along to buy the beer (or tea), and provide lively conversation.
Plus, we get the same waitress and Xray glasses that we had a few years ago.
Dave
a beer on meeting night
SASless comes along to buy the beer (or tea), and provide lively conversation.
Plus, we get the same waitress and Xray glasses that we had a few years ago.
Picture of waitress
http://www.unicopter.com/Temporary/X-mas_drink.SHS
http://www.unicopter.com/Temporary/X-mas_drink.SHS
Dave
Thread Starter
... many of the movement's founders, originally liberals, Democrats or from socialist backgrounds, were new to conservatism.
From Wikpedia as you suggested Dave....."NeoCons" appear to be "failed" Liberals.
I fail to see how you could call Dick Cheney a "neo"....he has always been a conservative.
Below the Glidepath - not correcting
Dick is not so much a conservative, as he is a would-be Alzheimer's case. He simply has no recollection of his 5 years at Haliburton as CEO, or the $44m it earned him, and what a senseless tragedy that is. Nothing wrong with any of that by the way, after all, getting rich and being successful are enshrined in the constitution, it's just that whole Organizational Conflict of Interest thing that Uncle Sam is so keen on that bothers me.
When Dick turns up at the Haliburton Old Boys meeting and announces, "Great news guys, we've negotiated a truce with the Iraqi Militia's, the Iranians and Syrians have offered to provide peace keeping troops, and we begin withdrawing US troops tomorrow" do you think he will be treated like the new Saviour, or as a complete pariah who has blown Haliburton's profit margin for the next 10 years?
It doesn't matter whether it is Haliburton, Blackwater, or any one of the Defense companies making an honest buck delivering misery in the name of democracy. What matters is that individuals who stand to make personal gain from the activities of these companies are serving in this administration. If that is not an Organizational Conflict of Interest, then Scooter Libby is my next character reference.
When Dick turns up at the Haliburton Old Boys meeting and announces, "Great news guys, we've negotiated a truce with the Iraqi Militia's, the Iranians and Syrians have offered to provide peace keeping troops, and we begin withdrawing US troops tomorrow" do you think he will be treated like the new Saviour, or as a complete pariah who has blown Haliburton's profit margin for the next 10 years?
It doesn't matter whether it is Haliburton, Blackwater, or any one of the Defense companies making an honest buck delivering misery in the name of democracy. What matters is that individuals who stand to make personal gain from the activities of these companies are serving in this administration. If that is not an Organizational Conflict of Interest, then Scooter Libby is my next character reference.
"Enjoy your cool-aid, Loser"
Its nice to see that we're getting some grown-up arguments on here!
Seriously though, I'm personally disinclined to take seriously any post that starts out that way, however well informed the rest of it may be.
Agreed. Post removed.
Interesting way of introducing himself to the forum.
Heliport
Its nice to see that we're getting some grown-up arguments on here!
Seriously though, I'm personally disinclined to take seriously any post that starts out that way, however well informed the rest of it may be.
Agreed. Post removed.
Interesting way of introducing himself to the forum.
Heliport
Thread Starter
44 million....gee that is a lot of money....until one compares it to the just the severance package for the head of Exxon who got over 400 million just in severance pay.
He pulled down over a Billion dollars in his career with Exxon.
Conflict of Interest....not quite. If Cheney used his position as Veep to steer contracts to Halliburton I would agree but that did not happen.
Brown and Root, along with many other such outfits have been doing business with the DOD since the 1960's for sure....and clear back to WWII days. Recall civilian construction workers were at Wake Island at the outset of WWII and assisted in the defense of the island only to be taken POW with many of them being murdered by the Japanese at the very end of the war.
While we are talking about the topic....let's discuss William Jefferson, D-LA, who takes cash bribes, Duke Cunningham ex-R-CA who is serving prison time for extorting bribe money, and a host of other folks in Washington that have their hands out.
He pulled down over a Billion dollars in his career with Exxon.
Conflict of Interest....not quite. If Cheney used his position as Veep to steer contracts to Halliburton I would agree but that did not happen.
Brown and Root, along with many other such outfits have been doing business with the DOD since the 1960's for sure....and clear back to WWII days. Recall civilian construction workers were at Wake Island at the outset of WWII and assisted in the defense of the island only to be taken POW with many of them being murdered by the Japanese at the very end of the war.
While we are talking about the topic....let's discuss William Jefferson, D-LA, who takes cash bribes, Duke Cunningham ex-R-CA who is serving prison time for extorting bribe money, and a host of other folks in Washington that have their hands out.
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Meanwhile, back in Washington DC, they are trying to figure out if Blackwater has a contract. It turns out Blackwater is a dining facilities contractor......
WASHINGTON - After numerous denials, the Pentagon has confirmed that a North Carolina company provided armed security guards in Iraq under a subcontract that was buried so deeply the government couldn't find it.
The secretary of the Army on Tuesday wrote two Democratic lawmakers that the Blackwater USA contract was part of a huge military support operation by run by Halliburton subsidiary KBR.
Vice President Dick Cheney ran Halliburton before he became vice president.
Several times last year, Pentagon officials told inquiring lawmakers they could find no evidence of the Blackwater contract. Blackwater, of Moyock, N.C., did not respond to several requests for comment.
The discovery shows the dense world of Iraq contracting, where the main contractor hires subcontractors who then hire additional subcontractors. Each company tacks on a charge for overhead, a cost that works its way up to U.S. taxpayers.
"This ongoing episode demonstrates the Pentagon's complete failure to safeguard taxpayer dollars," said Rep. Chris Van Hollen (news, bio, voting record), D-Md., one of the lawmakers who had asked about the Blackwater contract and received denials.
"They continue to look the other way in the face of overwhelming evidence that Halliburton was charging taxpayers for unauthorized security services," Van Hollen said.
The hidden contract not only cost taxpayers money, but it might have been illegal. The Halliburton subsidiary's main contract for military support services prohibited hiring subcontractors to provide armed security. That job is left to the U.S. military, unless the theater commander decides otherwise.
Rep. Henry Waxman (news, bio, voting record), chairman of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, scheduled a hearing Wednesday on the Blackwater contract.
Waxman, D-Calif., has cited examples in news reports that Blackwater paid employees $600 a day, and those charges increased to $1,500 a day by the time several layers of subcontractors tacked on their charges to the main contractor.
Waxman is at the forefront of Democrats who want to investigate fraud, waste and abuse in the Bush administration, and on Tuesday he promised two years of such scrutiny.
On Tuesday, Army Secretary Francis Harvey wrote Van Hollen and Waxman that on Jan. 30 the Army learned that ESS Support Services Worldwide, a dining facilities subcontractor under the KBR contract, hired Blackwater.
ESS didn't hire Blackwater directly, but did so through a hotel company, further obscuring the contract.
Harvey further said the security costs were not itemized anywhere, yet were factored into ESS' labor costs under KBR's contract, which in turn is financed by U.S. taxpayers.
"The U.S. Army is continuing to investigate this matter and we are committed to providing full disclosure of the results of our investigations to the committee," he wrote.
In July Harvey sent a letter to Rep. Christopher Shays (news, bio, voting record), R-Conn., then chairman of the committee's national security subcommittee, that cited KBR as saying it never had directly hired a private security contractor under its overall support contract.
Harvey added that KBR "has queried ESS and they are unaware of any services under the ... contract that were provided by Blackwater USA."
In September, an Army procurement official, Tina Ballard, appeared before the committee and said she verified that Harvey's prior letter — asserting that no contract could be found — was correct.
Van Hollen held up a copy of Blackwater's contract at the hearing, and Ballard still contended Blackwater provided no services to the Halliburton subsidiary.
At the end of November, the lawmakers received further evidence that the Pentagon was wrong. The parent firm of ESS, responding to questions posed by Republican committee staff, confirmed that it used Blackwater for security under the contract with Halliburton's subsidiary.
Van Hollen and Waxman pressed the Pentagon again, leading to the Army secretary's admission Tuesday that the contract existed.
Blackwater employees have suffered heavy casualties in Iraq. In 2004 an Iraqi mob killed four employees, dragged their bodies through the streets of Fallujah and hung two from a bridge.
In September 2005, the company said three of its employees were killed in Mosul.
And last month, Blackwater confirmed that five of its employees were killed in a helicopter that went down in Baghdad under heavy fire.
WASHINGTON - After numerous denials, the Pentagon has confirmed that a North Carolina company provided armed security guards in Iraq under a subcontract that was buried so deeply the government couldn't find it.
The secretary of the Army on Tuesday wrote two Democratic lawmakers that the Blackwater USA contract was part of a huge military support operation by run by Halliburton subsidiary KBR.
Vice President Dick Cheney ran Halliburton before he became vice president.
Several times last year, Pentagon officials told inquiring lawmakers they could find no evidence of the Blackwater contract. Blackwater, of Moyock, N.C., did not respond to several requests for comment.
The discovery shows the dense world of Iraq contracting, where the main contractor hires subcontractors who then hire additional subcontractors. Each company tacks on a charge for overhead, a cost that works its way up to U.S. taxpayers.
"This ongoing episode demonstrates the Pentagon's complete failure to safeguard taxpayer dollars," said Rep. Chris Van Hollen (news, bio, voting record), D-Md., one of the lawmakers who had asked about the Blackwater contract and received denials.
"They continue to look the other way in the face of overwhelming evidence that Halliburton was charging taxpayers for unauthorized security services," Van Hollen said.
The hidden contract not only cost taxpayers money, but it might have been illegal. The Halliburton subsidiary's main contract for military support services prohibited hiring subcontractors to provide armed security. That job is left to the U.S. military, unless the theater commander decides otherwise.
Rep. Henry Waxman (news, bio, voting record), chairman of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, scheduled a hearing Wednesday on the Blackwater contract.
Waxman, D-Calif., has cited examples in news reports that Blackwater paid employees $600 a day, and those charges increased to $1,500 a day by the time several layers of subcontractors tacked on their charges to the main contractor.
Waxman is at the forefront of Democrats who want to investigate fraud, waste and abuse in the Bush administration, and on Tuesday he promised two years of such scrutiny.
On Tuesday, Army Secretary Francis Harvey wrote Van Hollen and Waxman that on Jan. 30 the Army learned that ESS Support Services Worldwide, a dining facilities subcontractor under the KBR contract, hired Blackwater.
ESS didn't hire Blackwater directly, but did so through a hotel company, further obscuring the contract.
Harvey further said the security costs were not itemized anywhere, yet were factored into ESS' labor costs under KBR's contract, which in turn is financed by U.S. taxpayers.
"The U.S. Army is continuing to investigate this matter and we are committed to providing full disclosure of the results of our investigations to the committee," he wrote.
In July Harvey sent a letter to Rep. Christopher Shays (news, bio, voting record), R-Conn., then chairman of the committee's national security subcommittee, that cited KBR as saying it never had directly hired a private security contractor under its overall support contract.
Harvey added that KBR "has queried ESS and they are unaware of any services under the ... contract that were provided by Blackwater USA."
In September, an Army procurement official, Tina Ballard, appeared before the committee and said she verified that Harvey's prior letter — asserting that no contract could be found — was correct.
Van Hollen held up a copy of Blackwater's contract at the hearing, and Ballard still contended Blackwater provided no services to the Halliburton subsidiary.
At the end of November, the lawmakers received further evidence that the Pentagon was wrong. The parent firm of ESS, responding to questions posed by Republican committee staff, confirmed that it used Blackwater for security under the contract with Halliburton's subsidiary.
Van Hollen and Waxman pressed the Pentagon again, leading to the Army secretary's admission Tuesday that the contract existed.
Blackwater employees have suffered heavy casualties in Iraq. In 2004 an Iraqi mob killed four employees, dragged their bodies through the streets of Fallujah and hung two from a bridge.
In September 2005, the company said three of its employees were killed in Mosul.
And last month, Blackwater confirmed that five of its employees were killed in a helicopter that went down in Baghdad under heavy fire.
Gatvol
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"Meanwhile, back in Washington DC, they are trying to figure out if Blackwater has a contract. It turns out Blackwater is a dining facilities contractor......"
Be serious, those in the know,know.....Most of the public does not know because they cant read or care less.
Be serious, those in the know,know.....Most of the public does not know because they cant read or care less.
Below the Glidepath - not correcting
SAS,
I'm only highlighting Dick Cheney because he is the current VP and his name comes up a lot. I am by no means suggesting that you can't be a lying, cheating, scumbag if you are a Democrat, indeed, those seem to be mandatory qualifications for all politicians these days. Open Government, yeah, right on...
I'm only highlighting Dick Cheney because he is the current VP and his name comes up a lot. I am by no means suggesting that you can't be a lying, cheating, scumbag if you are a Democrat, indeed, those seem to be mandatory qualifications for all politicians these days. Open Government, yeah, right on...
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"delivering misery in the name of democracy"
Quaint. Simplistic. Jingoistic.
I best consume fruit juice at Steak&Ale.
Nah, single Malt confers enlightenment.
Cuban Cigars confers coolness.
Difference of opinion confers that others are wrong.
Maybe, I am right again.
Chas A
SirVivr
Quaint. Simplistic. Jingoistic.
I best consume fruit juice at Steak&Ale.
Nah, single Malt confers enlightenment.
Cuban Cigars confers coolness.
Difference of opinion confers that others are wrong.
Maybe, I am right again.
Chas A
SirVivr
