Surrey Air Ambulance
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Jim
Both www.SurreyAirAmbulance.co.uk and www.SussexAirAmbulance.co.uk continue to say April 2007 start, you're right. However, a leaflet was circulated a few weeks back in some parts of Surrey which gave the start date as 8th June.
This could well tie in with the availability of G-WMID, the current West Midlands Police aircraft which is shortly to be replaced by a Pratt-engined EC135P2i G-WMAO. Given Kent AA's like of the Explorer and the photos on the Sussex website (the Surrey one features the AS355 they used for the fundraising launch), everything points to that helicopter type being the one, and WMID is the only available airframe short of importing one from somewhere - and I'm not aware of any imported Explorer in the UK recently.
Cheers
ppheli
Both www.SurreyAirAmbulance.co.uk and www.SussexAirAmbulance.co.uk continue to say April 2007 start, you're right. However, a leaflet was circulated a few weeks back in some parts of Surrey which gave the start date as 8th June.
This could well tie in with the availability of G-WMID, the current West Midlands Police aircraft which is shortly to be replaced by a Pratt-engined EC135P2i G-WMAO. Given Kent AA's like of the Explorer and the photos on the Sussex website (the Surrey one features the AS355 they used for the fundraising launch), everything points to that helicopter type being the one, and WMID is the only available airframe short of importing one from somewhere - and I'm not aware of any imported Explorer in the UK recently.
Cheers
ppheli
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well, I guess the UK's second biggest city would be the next one in line to justify a second aircraft - while noting that the third largest is already at that point with one fixed and one rotary wing. So, 222, seems very feasible!
But it reopens the question - which helicopter for the Surrey/Sussex Air Ambulance?
But it reopens the question - which helicopter for the Surrey/Sussex Air Ambulance?
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cptjim
You're absolutely correct regarding the new Surrey Air Ambulance, it will
definitely NOT be G-EHMS!
I remember talking to one of the London Hems pilots and specifically specified the London Hems Trust/NHS Trust were hoping to raise, and to get further funding to obtain an EC145.
G-EHMS was even advertised for sale in the hope to recoup some finances to inject funding for a new aircraft. However, I was informed due to the aircraft's high component times and due to the lack of interest from potential purchasers the idea was boshed and the current aircarft was kept and has now been upgraded regarding the tail cone and thrust system.
Captain Cop!
definitely NOT be G-EHMS!
I remember talking to one of the London Hems pilots and specifically specified the London Hems Trust/NHS Trust were hoping to raise, and to get further funding to obtain an EC145.
G-EHMS was even advertised for sale in the hope to recoup some finances to inject funding for a new aircraft. However, I was informed due to the aircraft's high component times and due to the lack of interest from potential purchasers the idea was boshed and the current aircarft was kept and has now been upgraded regarding the tail cone and thrust system.
Captain Cop!
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The fact the tail boom has been done is nothing to do with the fact that they are "now keeping G-EHMS". I think you will find the whole UK fleet is being done, and may be even _for free_! Well, that's what I heard anyway!
The G-EHMS lack of sale could also have been due to the price being asked, I suppose?
The G-EHMS lack of sale could also have been due to the price being asked, I suppose?
Explorer prices remain depressed. With under 100 being available you might expect them to attract a better price [HAI give price ranges in the order of $1.7M to $2.7M] when compared to the more numerous alternatives [the same source gives EC135 in the range of $2.5M to $3.25M and the 109 Power $2.9 to $4.5N] but clearly the availability factor continues to bite hard.
It seems strange that the other thread current at the moment relating to S92 and AW139 aircraft availability rates [CHC complaining publicly about low introductory availability rates] is not causing the same furore that attended the disclosure of MD900 rates in the same league! Obviously each draws their Ppruners from a very different fanatic base!
When Yorkshire AA bought their Explorer recently they appeared to pay top $$ but that was still apparently too low for the aspirations of such as London HEMS.
Although West Mids Police have publicly declared they are hanging on to their 900 and indicated that it is to be used as a back up it is pretty much public knowledge that price is a factor. You just cannot sell at the prices you can get when you may well have to then explain a terrific loss. And that is an organisation that saw the writing on the wall a long time ago and wrote off the airframe in financial terms long before ordering another machine. Equally the second aircraft [the reorder] for GMP may well have to hang around at Barton until values move upward.
Because Kent are pulling the strings in Kent/Surrey/Sussex it can be assumed that their preference will be for the 900. However with the numbers of good second hand 900s being low they may well start their extended operations with other more cost efficient types while JAROPS allows them to [355/105] but despite the ex-police types mentioned above I am not aware of many 900s being available in the UK.
It seems strange that the other thread current at the moment relating to S92 and AW139 aircraft availability rates [CHC complaining publicly about low introductory availability rates] is not causing the same furore that attended the disclosure of MD900 rates in the same league! Obviously each draws their Ppruners from a very different fanatic base!
When Yorkshire AA bought their Explorer recently they appeared to pay top $$ but that was still apparently too low for the aspirations of such as London HEMS.
Although West Mids Police have publicly declared they are hanging on to their 900 and indicated that it is to be used as a back up it is pretty much public knowledge that price is a factor. You just cannot sell at the prices you can get when you may well have to then explain a terrific loss. And that is an organisation that saw the writing on the wall a long time ago and wrote off the airframe in financial terms long before ordering another machine. Equally the second aircraft [the reorder] for GMP may well have to hang around at Barton until values move upward.
Because Kent are pulling the strings in Kent/Surrey/Sussex it can be assumed that their preference will be for the 900. However with the numbers of good second hand 900s being low they may well start their extended operations with other more cost efficient types while JAROPS allows them to [355/105] but despite the ex-police types mentioned above I am not aware of many 900s being available in the UK.
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Take a look at the SAS website, news relase dated 1 Dec 2006. It seems pretty clear that they will be using a 902:
http://www.specialist-aviation.co.uk/news011206.htm
Air Ambulance Service for Surrey and Sussex - A Step Closer
"Kent Air Ambulance Trust has selected Medical Aviation Services Ltd. to provide an MD Explorer which will be based at Dunsfold from early next year."
There could easily be a short term interim solution, but the final aircraft is pretty clear, especially given the operator and the AA trust involved.
http://www.specialist-aviation.co.uk/news011206.htm
Air Ambulance Service for Surrey and Sussex - A Step Closer
"Kent Air Ambulance Trust has selected Medical Aviation Services Ltd. to provide an MD Explorer which will be based at Dunsfold from early next year."
There could easily be a short term interim solution, but the final aircraft is pretty clear, especially given the operator and the AA trust involved.
Thread Starter
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Thanks to everyone for their replies, I know that the 'new' aircraft will be an MD902 but I was curious as to where it is coming from e.g. what airframe/serial.
Originally Posted by Flaxton Flyer
You need to be looking to a far off distant part of the world to see where this one is coming from...
Oh well, time will tell I suppose!
Regards
Jim
Originally Posted by Flaxton Flyer
You need to be looking to a far off distant part of the world to see where this one is coming from...
Oh well, time will tell I suppose!
Regards
Jim
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Quicemech - make that "there were a few spare airframes in Indonesia"
CptJim - the best laid plans and all that. See above as to why my original post is no longer valid!
CptJim - the best laid plans and all that. See above as to why my original post is no longer valid!
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Just to check we have this in proportion, there have only ever been two Explorers in Indonesia:-
#89 PK-OCR since sold and now operating in China as B-7740
#90 PK-OCS reported sold to _Yorkshire_ Air Ambulance
so.... question must be whether the report of YAA buying #90 as their second Explorer (deposit = Hammond money) is wrong, or Surrey are buying something else. Any clues?
#89 PK-OCR since sold and now operating in China as B-7740
#90 PK-OCS reported sold to _Yorkshire_ Air Ambulance
so.... question must be whether the report of YAA buying #90 as their second Explorer (deposit = Hammond money) is wrong, or Surrey are buying something else. Any clues?
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The MAS website seemed clear that the contract was for a 902. Maybe not at the start, but given the suitability of the 902 for HEMS, what others have indicated about Kent and that SAS are the 902 agent it is a fair bet that is what they will get idc
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You are all looking at 902's.....I think you will find out that they start with a BO105 G-WYPA, the old West yorkshire Police machine that has gone and had a role change in the last year or so.