Single Engine IR

[BHenderson]

I'm about to start on the theory side of the CPL/ATPL. Would it be worth doing the ATPL exams when in JAR-FCL 2.205 it states that 'at least 10 hours must be done on an IFR helicopter for a SE IR(H)... '

How then do you obtain a single engine instrument rating when all the IFR helicopters are multi engined? This suggests that I would need a type rating on a multi engined helicopter aswell, no?

This seems to be a bit of a cloudy area. Could this training be done on an R22 "IFR", though technically not IFR certificated?

I hope you'll have as much fun thinking about this as I'm having!

Bobby

[Aesir]

Not all IFR helicopters are multi engine aircraft. The Bell206 is a single engine helicopter that can be certified as IFR heli with certain equipment installed.

However JAR-OPS does not authorize single engine IFR transport category helicopters but that is a different story and not applicable to your question.

So, yes you can do your IR rating on a single engine helicopter as long as it has been tested and certified as per the manufacturer type data sheet. Which as far as I know is only applicable to Bell 206 helicopters in Europe.

No you can not complete your training on a IFR equipped R-22 but some flight schools can provide some of the training on R-22 and then the last 10hrs + checkride in IFR B206.

I can provide you with links to schools in Scandinavia that offer SE IFR training.

[Perro Rojo]

As far as I understand it, you only need an IFR "equipped" helicopter to demonstrate your IFR proficiency. The check ride can be performed during VFR conditions obviating the need for an IFR "certified" aircraft.

Also you don't need a type rating if there is a type certified pilot at the controls, either a safety pilot or the examiner. The check ride is about your IFR proficiency not your knowledge about that particular type.

I know, I know, you normally do your type proficiency and your IFR proficiency at the same time however you can do them seperately as well.

[Geoffersincornwall]

Suggest you talk to the guys at Bond Air Services at Staverton - they have a good STD and all the approvals to help you along the road to ME IR (which is where you really want to be I would venture).

The stepping stone of a SE IR is possible - try the Bristow Training Unit at Norwich. They have a fully equipped IR 206 for this very purpose.

G

[Aesir]

The check ride can be performed during VFR conditions obviating the need for an IFR "certified" aircraft.

Perro Rojo. No not in JAA land. The helicopter has to be IFR certified. But yes in US & Canada which I assume you meant then the helicopter does not have to be IFR certified.

[helicopter-redeye]

Bobby, for SE/IR, Scandanavia (DK/ NO/ SE) is the 'type locality' (pun intended) using FNTP 1 sim + 206B/L IFR certified.

There is a thread about this about 4/ 5 pages down.

h-r

[Wanna-be]

You can train on a Schweizer 330 at Heli Holland in the Netherlands for (I thought) 380 Euro per hour, but I dont know the preferences of helo companies ( Bigger training aircraft with more instruments).

[ThomasTheTankEngine]

As far as I remember the course at Heli Holland was a national IR not a JAA IR.

[Wanna-be]

You might be right but im not sure. They dont mention anything about it on their site or in the info packet. I sent them an email.

[madman1145]

What I understand is, as someone mentioned above, when doing IR training in JAA, the aircraft must be IFR certified - you can't fly VFR training IFR in JAA ..
For an aircraft to be IFR certified, the aircraft must be equipped with 2 generators ..

A list I saw last year from my FTO before they bought their Longranger when they were researching the market, that list showed single and twin engine helicopters and their IFR approval, and the only single engine helicopter that can be equipped and certified with 2 generators is the Bell Longranger ..

To carry pax IFR, the aircraft must be twin-engined in JAA - so only training is done IFR on this single engine helicopter - so basically what you can use a SE-IR for is a upgrade to ME-IR, something offshore companies do anyway during your TR course etc. ..

- madman, who is doing his JAA SE-IR in Denmark ..

[Wanna-be]

Heli-Holland emailed me that their IR courses result in a JAA IR not a national IR. But i think that companies prefer an ir on a bigger aircraft

[Aesir]

But i think that companies prefer an ir on a bigger aircraft

Wanna-Be. An IR is an IR it makes no difference whatsoever what size the aircraft is. All aircraft used for IR training must have minimum instrumentation for the training anyway.

The TC for the Schweizer 330 (269D) states "No instrument flight" so Heli Holland must be using a Bell 206 or some other instrument certified helicopter for the final 10 hrs of training on their IR program!