About the preflight check.
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Inspection or check?
Fortyodd2,
Again I can’t disagree with any of your points, they are all valid.
One of the issues that I raised earlier, and which PACO also indicated was an issue in UK, is the legality of a pilot carrying out a Daily Inspection. Please note I use the phrase Daily Inspection not Daily Check. I have had it explained to me that an Inspection is a maintenance function and can only be conducted / certified by a licenced engineer / certified maintenance personnel. We too can get a special authorisation for a pilot to carryout a Daily Inspection if we are out of the country on an international flight, but only for a very few days before a licenced maintainer has to be parachuted in.
Like other contributors I too like to have a good look around after any intensive maintenance but the issue I raise is should I be/am I required to check for chafing, freedom of movement of linkages when it is has just been checked and signed for by some ‘high priced help’?
Some contributors have expressed concern about tools being left behind on the aircraft after maintenance, and I agree that this could be a concern if your maintenance department does not have a close control on such items, but again the control of tools is a quality / engineering issue. However when was the last time one of us (pilots) went down to Standard Aero or H & S or similar when we had an engine in their shop to check, before they closed it up, if they had left a tool or rag inside the engine? Where does one draw the line? Maybe I have been fortunate with the quality of the operations I have previously been a part of that, in the main, these traditional concerns are a thing of the past.
Another aspect of the pre-flight check I would like to throw open for discussion is the fuel check? As part of your pre-flight check do you drain a sample of fuel, do you test it with a capsule or chemical (that is in date) for water, do you save the sample at least until the end of the day? Is the batch number of the fuel recorded in the tech log? What do you do with the fuel after you have sampled it? If you spilt any fuel on the ground during the check do you call for decontamination? If you got it on your hands do you go wash, if you got it on your clothing do you go change? Or do you decide that it is not required or there is too much downside and potential for delay, or perhaps that it is an ‘engineering / maintenance function’ and that somebody else should have done it, or that it is covered by Daily Inspection or the Turnaround signature?
Signing for the turnaround is something else the licenced maintainer can do too. I take it that you have a slot on your Tech Log for a turnaround signature, or is it only us that are ‘blessed’ with such bureaucracy?
Again I can’t disagree with any of your points, they are all valid.
One of the issues that I raised earlier, and which PACO also indicated was an issue in UK, is the legality of a pilot carrying out a Daily Inspection. Please note I use the phrase Daily Inspection not Daily Check. I have had it explained to me that an Inspection is a maintenance function and can only be conducted / certified by a licenced engineer / certified maintenance personnel. We too can get a special authorisation for a pilot to carryout a Daily Inspection if we are out of the country on an international flight, but only for a very few days before a licenced maintainer has to be parachuted in.
Like other contributors I too like to have a good look around after any intensive maintenance but the issue I raise is should I be/am I required to check for chafing, freedom of movement of linkages when it is has just been checked and signed for by some ‘high priced help’?
Some contributors have expressed concern about tools being left behind on the aircraft after maintenance, and I agree that this could be a concern if your maintenance department does not have a close control on such items, but again the control of tools is a quality / engineering issue. However when was the last time one of us (pilots) went down to Standard Aero or H & S or similar when we had an engine in their shop to check, before they closed it up, if they had left a tool or rag inside the engine? Where does one draw the line? Maybe I have been fortunate with the quality of the operations I have previously been a part of that, in the main, these traditional concerns are a thing of the past.
Another aspect of the pre-flight check I would like to throw open for discussion is the fuel check? As part of your pre-flight check do you drain a sample of fuel, do you test it with a capsule or chemical (that is in date) for water, do you save the sample at least until the end of the day? Is the batch number of the fuel recorded in the tech log? What do you do with the fuel after you have sampled it? If you spilt any fuel on the ground during the check do you call for decontamination? If you got it on your hands do you go wash, if you got it on your clothing do you go change? Or do you decide that it is not required or there is too much downside and potential for delay, or perhaps that it is an ‘engineering / maintenance function’ and that somebody else should have done it, or that it is covered by Daily Inspection or the Turnaround signature?
Signing for the turnaround is something else the licenced maintainer can do too. I take it that you have a slot on your Tech Log for a turnaround signature, or is it only us that are ‘blessed’ with such bureaucracy?
Brett,
In my Chinook unit in Vietnam....the entire maintenance crew went along for the first test flight after they worked on the old girls. Funny how things improved after that policy was implemented...funny thing to see the fellows swarming over the aircraft finding rolls of locking wire, the stray tool, and more than a few rags.
At my favorite British helicopter company we had the same policy...and still found rags and tools on the odd occasion. A 212 had a bed sheet sized rag once....and an S-58T had a drive shaft worn all but in half by a rubber covered torch (flashlight).
Thus no one,or no system is immune from those kinds of mistakes. It is the catching of them before something evil happens that makes the difference.
In my Chinook unit in Vietnam....the entire maintenance crew went along for the first test flight after they worked on the old girls. Funny how things improved after that policy was implemented...funny thing to see the fellows swarming over the aircraft finding rolls of locking wire, the stray tool, and more than a few rags.
At my favorite British helicopter company we had the same policy...and still found rags and tools on the odd occasion. A 212 had a bed sheet sized rag once....and an S-58T had a drive shaft worn all but in half by a rubber covered torch (flashlight).
Thus no one,or no system is immune from those kinds of mistakes. It is the catching of them before something evil happens that makes the difference.
Why shouldn't a pilot be trained and certified to issue the Certificate of Release To Service for a whole range of procedures? (including the daily inspection)
How else do you operate from a base that does not have a permanent engineer on site?
How else do you operate from a base that does not have a permanent engineer on site?
Join Date: Nov 2000
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Quite agree, Bertie - provided there is proper supervision. In Canada, the pilot does the 30 hour inspections on AS 350s and the 25s on 206s, including greasing the heads, etc, aside from being authorised to remove batteries, change bulbs, etc.
Can't see why it can't be done in UK myself, especially as the CAA seem to want the lesser qualified engineer to do the work on the aircraft anyway, with the more qualified one supervising. Myself, I would rather it be the other way round!
Phil
Can't see why it can't be done in UK myself, especially as the CAA seem to want the lesser qualified engineer to do the work on the aircraft anyway, with the more qualified one supervising. Myself, I would rather it be the other way round!
Phil
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The daily inspection vs the preflight
From reading the posts it seems to come down to a combination of;
The size of the company you work for,
The contract (client) the aircraft is on,
the country you operate in, &
whether you fly a Class B aircraft at a location with an engineer on site.
I agree, it would be great to have the Engineer (australian term meaning maintainer/mechanic that is used everywhere else) to do the daily inspection and sign the tech log and the pilot (us) do the pre-flight / fuel drain. But, going on the list above and the staffing levels and attitude of the "management / engineers" it just doesn't happen.
In Australia the CASA allows approved "pilot maintenance" to be carried out on Class B aircraft. http://www.casa.gov.au/download/CAAPs/ops/42zc.pdf
There is not supposed to be any pilot maintenance on Class A aircraft (ie Transport Category aircraft).
There used to be things called "Maintenance Authorities" where the pilot was trained to do specific things, like fit winches, hooks, duals and remove/inspect/reinstall chip plugs etc etc, by an engineer and then the application form presented to CASA for approval and finally issued. Have not seen one of these for a very long time. So techinically if it is not in the Class B aircraft approved list you cannot do it.
The Class A aircraft problem confuses everyone and no answers are gained.
Sometimes its a matter of if the engineer won't do it, you have to, (like topping up the oil springs to mind).
Don't talk to me about legalities!
800
The size of the company you work for,
The contract (client) the aircraft is on,
the country you operate in, &
whether you fly a Class B aircraft at a location with an engineer on site.
I agree, it would be great to have the Engineer (australian term meaning maintainer/mechanic that is used everywhere else) to do the daily inspection and sign the tech log and the pilot (us) do the pre-flight / fuel drain. But, going on the list above and the staffing levels and attitude of the "management / engineers" it just doesn't happen.
In Australia the CASA allows approved "pilot maintenance" to be carried out on Class B aircraft. http://www.casa.gov.au/download/CAAPs/ops/42zc.pdf
There is not supposed to be any pilot maintenance on Class A aircraft (ie Transport Category aircraft).
There used to be things called "Maintenance Authorities" where the pilot was trained to do specific things, like fit winches, hooks, duals and remove/inspect/reinstall chip plugs etc etc, by an engineer and then the application form presented to CASA for approval and finally issued. Have not seen one of these for a very long time. So techinically if it is not in the Class B aircraft approved list you cannot do it.
The Class A aircraft problem confuses everyone and no answers are gained.
Sometimes its a matter of if the engineer won't do it, you have to, (like topping up the oil springs to mind).
Don't talk to me about legalities!
800
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Preflight/dailly/postflights by Pilots
A number of things must be considered;
*The Mfc of the helicopter/aircraft has written a Flight Manual (FM) for the correct use of the aircraft by the user (Pilot). So all items mentioned in this FM can/must be done by a Pilot. There it stops! either if the aircraft is flying Privat or commercial. I can immagine that on large aircraft flying sheduled and regular flights there is a kind of maintenance doing the turn around/dailly/preflight/postflight or whatever, on the place the aircraft arrives. In my bussiness which is helicopters flying today to Geneve, tommorrow to Paris, Amsterdam, London, etc..... There is nobody to do all of this inspections. Do I have to send a Mechanic, in the seat next to the VIP, to add some oil and perform the PF??? Just think about, if you fly, you have to consider that sometimes you have to climb on your aircraft, it is part of the game!
*The Mfc of the helicopter/aircraft has written a Flight Manual (FM) for the correct use of the aircraft by the user (Pilot). So all items mentioned in this FM can/must be done by a Pilot. There it stops! either if the aircraft is flying Privat or commercial. I can immagine that on large aircraft flying sheduled and regular flights there is a kind of maintenance doing the turn around/dailly/preflight/postflight or whatever, on the place the aircraft arrives. In my bussiness which is helicopters flying today to Geneve, tommorrow to Paris, Amsterdam, London, etc..... There is nobody to do all of this inspections. Do I have to send a Mechanic, in the seat next to the VIP, to add some oil and perform the PF??? Just think about, if you fly, you have to consider that sometimes you have to climb on your aircraft, it is part of the game!
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There is a difference between a small single-engine helicopter and a transport-category helicopter, at least in the eyes of the regulatory authorities. In the US, an S76 in Part 135 ops has to be dailied by a certificated A&P mechanic. We do a preflight check, but that is nowhere near as detailed as what the mechanics do. My preflight is mostly to check for obvious things, like rags and tools left lying around, and it's not a real daily inspection. It takes far too long to open every cowling on the aircraft, and get a large stand out to the aircraft to closely check the tail rotor. We have to trust the mechanics for the major stuff. Take a look at an airline pilot doing a preflight of the airliner you ride on - he's not doing any inspecting, he's just looking for all the big parts to be there. That's mostly what I do, check for the right number of big parts. When I flew 206s, I could, and often did, sign off the daily inspection, but that's a far cry from an S76. Anyone who is flying an S76 from a remote base without a certificated mechanic is setting himself up for real trouble.
