GOM Hiring Minimums heading down...Good News for the young'uns!
Thread Starter
GOM Hiring Minimums heading down...Good News for the young'uns!
Seems the magic number of 1000 hours total time no longer holds for GOM jobs. Additional rumour has it that one can hire on at one particular outfit and move right onto 412's.
Are the GOM operators finally feeling the pinch on pilots and lowering minimums?
Another good question that is begged....Has the pilot's union movement locked wages at too low a level and thus the operators cannot attract pilots on the current wages being offered?
Why are the operators going with a lower experience level pilot nowadays when they would not in the past?
Or....is this all a big fat bit of gossip?
What say you GOM'ers?
Are the GOM operators finally feeling the pinch on pilots and lowering minimums?
Another good question that is begged....Has the pilot's union movement locked wages at too low a level and thus the operators cannot attract pilots on the current wages being offered?
Why are the operators going with a lower experience level pilot nowadays when they would not in the past?
Or....is this all a big fat bit of gossip?
What say you GOM'ers?
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GOM practices (at least here)- long
Sasless,
this was my reply today (after some kind soul formated it better) on another forum answering some questions that were asked about our hiring practices and hours. I didn't talk about the pay. I believe that we are competitive with most of the rest of the industry in total compensation packages, and it seems to be moving up all the time (as it should be). I also believe it's a lot of things with the pilot shortage, such as location, job satisfaction, time away from family, lots of variables. Some foks like it - some don't. I'm suprised lately at the number of former EMS folks going to work in the GOM, and at the quality of people we get, especially many of the younger folks. I'm not sure that total hours is the absolute best predictor of safety. Yes, it's important and it really helps to have seen before some of the situations you may find yourself in, but my guess would be if you graphed flight time against accidents, you would not find much of a corelation between low GOM pilot total time and accidents. I remember going to Viet Nam, right out of flight school, and flying nights, bad weather, etc, with a grand total of 230 hours - course I was scared S***less most of the time. And my PIC - he was an old salt with almost 600 hours.
Cheers
Mike
"Well "pilot", you are obviously entitled to your opinions about our hiring practices being "messed up"; I'll be sure to file them where they belong.
Let me try and set the record straight on a few issues here raised by you and others:
1. As long as we meet FAR135 requirements, the insurance companies don't get into my hiring practices or hours. They care about accident rate and you would be hard pressed to show that, at least in the GOM, lower time pilots are more dangerous. Maybe you have some figures that they don’t. Some, but not many, of our customers put pilot requirements on us, but that's different.
2. We are not self insured, but we do have a deductible, so I guess you could say we are partially self insured, like you probably are with your home or auto. I just came back from giving insurance company presentations in Atlanta and not once was number of flying hours to be hired raised, but training, operational practices, and safety records were, and they seemed to like ours.
3. We still look at 1000 hours as a minimum, having said that, it's not a magic number. If someone at 950 hours really impresses while here for an interview or I get someone with 900 hours and 600 of that is turbine, we will take a hard look at them. We do have some part 91 fuels ships that a person can fly after training and build some hours and experience if they are real close. I also look at fixed wing hours, as strange as that seems, but whatever you fly you develop “air sense” and if someone has 850 recent helo hours and 1000 -1500 hours or so of recent fixed wing, that would get a second look. Recent experience is also important. 1500 helo hours 15 years ago, then a 10 hour refresher in helo’s last month doesn’t cut it.
4. With the Frasca flight training devices (Sims) for the 206 and 407, we find the turbine transition to be much easier and quicker. Five years ago it was a different story.
5. We like to hire civilian pilots who have had quality training and see them as the future of the industry. And by the way, yes we do like Vortex grads, as well as those from other quality flight school, but no matter where they come from, they have to meet our requirements, pass the interview, and get through training.
6. If you want to give me the name of someone you think was hired at 500-600 hours, call me sometime at 800-365-6771, ask for Mike Suldo, and I hope that I can set the record straight and hopefully improve your attitude."
this was my reply today (after some kind soul formated it better) on another forum answering some questions that were asked about our hiring practices and hours. I didn't talk about the pay. I believe that we are competitive with most of the rest of the industry in total compensation packages, and it seems to be moving up all the time (as it should be). I also believe it's a lot of things with the pilot shortage, such as location, job satisfaction, time away from family, lots of variables. Some foks like it - some don't. I'm suprised lately at the number of former EMS folks going to work in the GOM, and at the quality of people we get, especially many of the younger folks. I'm not sure that total hours is the absolute best predictor of safety. Yes, it's important and it really helps to have seen before some of the situations you may find yourself in, but my guess would be if you graphed flight time against accidents, you would not find much of a corelation between low GOM pilot total time and accidents. I remember going to Viet Nam, right out of flight school, and flying nights, bad weather, etc, with a grand total of 230 hours - course I was scared S***less most of the time. And my PIC - he was an old salt with almost 600 hours.
Cheers
Mike
"Well "pilot", you are obviously entitled to your opinions about our hiring practices being "messed up"; I'll be sure to file them where they belong.
Let me try and set the record straight on a few issues here raised by you and others:
1. As long as we meet FAR135 requirements, the insurance companies don't get into my hiring practices or hours. They care about accident rate and you would be hard pressed to show that, at least in the GOM, lower time pilots are more dangerous. Maybe you have some figures that they don’t. Some, but not many, of our customers put pilot requirements on us, but that's different.
2. We are not self insured, but we do have a deductible, so I guess you could say we are partially self insured, like you probably are with your home or auto. I just came back from giving insurance company presentations in Atlanta and not once was number of flying hours to be hired raised, but training, operational practices, and safety records were, and they seemed to like ours.
3. We still look at 1000 hours as a minimum, having said that, it's not a magic number. If someone at 950 hours really impresses while here for an interview or I get someone with 900 hours and 600 of that is turbine, we will take a hard look at them. We do have some part 91 fuels ships that a person can fly after training and build some hours and experience if they are real close. I also look at fixed wing hours, as strange as that seems, but whatever you fly you develop “air sense” and if someone has 850 recent helo hours and 1000 -1500 hours or so of recent fixed wing, that would get a second look. Recent experience is also important. 1500 helo hours 15 years ago, then a 10 hour refresher in helo’s last month doesn’t cut it.
4. With the Frasca flight training devices (Sims) for the 206 and 407, we find the turbine transition to be much easier and quicker. Five years ago it was a different story.
5. We like to hire civilian pilots who have had quality training and see them as the future of the industry. And by the way, yes we do like Vortex grads, as well as those from other quality flight school, but no matter where they come from, they have to meet our requirements, pass the interview, and get through training.
6. If you want to give me the name of someone you think was hired at 500-600 hours, call me sometime at 800-365-6771, ask for Mike Suldo, and I hope that I can set the record straight and hopefully improve your attitude."
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slight change
How many pure R-22 people were being hired into GOM at 1000 hours 5 or 6 years ago? - probably not many - now it's no big deal if they come from a good school, have good skills, and a good attitude. Used to be turbine time was a must, now it isn't.
Mike
Mike
Pass the smelling salts!
Mike Suldo, President of Air Logistics (A Bristow Company) says, and I quote (I can't believe I'm quoting this, but here goes):
<COUGH> <COUGH> <SNORT> 
Whoa! You know that sound (fermented) grape juice makes as it gets ejected out the nose and onto the keyboard? I just made it. A classic "spit take" right out of '50s sitcom. If I had cartoon eyes, they'd be bugging right out of my head, held on only by the wires that attach them.
Did I just hear that right? Did Mike friggin' SULDO just say that compensation should be moving up all the time? What the...did Mike just have a brain aneurysm? Alert the media! I'm getting too old for this - ye olde ticker can't take it much longer.
A somewhat controversial figure and a guy we love to poke fun at, actually Suldo has always been a good egg. It's just that in his former life, when it came to doing right by his pilots, he always found himself being held down by The Man...or more correctly, The woMan in the form of one Carroll W. Suggs who has thankfully departed aviation for greener but no doubt soggier and mouldier pastures in the wake of a nasty little thunderstorm by the name of Katrina that came ashore and rearranged her New Orleans neighborhood not long ago. Glad to see that Mike has had a change of heart. Let's hope that he uses his newfound benevolence wisely - especially in terms of Air Log's next union contract!
I believe that we are competitive with most of the rest of the industry in total compensation packages, and it seems to be moving up all the time (as it should be).
Whoa! You know that sound (fermented) grape juice makes as it gets ejected out the nose and onto the keyboard? I just made it. A classic "spit take" right out of '50s sitcom. If I had cartoon eyes, they'd be bugging right out of my head, held on only by the wires that attach them. Did I just hear that right? Did Mike friggin' SULDO just say that compensation should be moving up all the time? What the...did Mike just have a brain aneurysm? Alert the media! I'm getting too old for this - ye olde ticker can't take it much longer.
A somewhat controversial figure and a guy we love to poke fun at, actually Suldo has always been a good egg. It's just that in his former life, when it came to doing right by his pilots, he always found himself being held down by The Man...or more correctly, The woMan in the form of one Carroll W. Suggs who has thankfully departed aviation for greener but no doubt soggier and mouldier pastures in the wake of a nasty little thunderstorm by the name of Katrina that came ashore and rearranged her New Orleans neighborhood not long ago. Glad to see that Mike has had a change of heart. Let's hope that he uses his newfound benevolence wisely - especially in terms of Air Log's next union contract!
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SirVivr
Msuldo:
Having spoken to you in Trinidad recently, I think we will show the rest of the industry how it should (will ) be done.
The others will be left behind.
Chas A
Having spoken to you in Trinidad recently, I think we will show the rest of the industry how it should (will ) be done.
The others will be left behind.
Chas A
