B47 Gassed Up!
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
From: SYDNEY
B47 Gassed Up!
Can you believe in this day and age, an airline captain (and private owner of a B47) in western Sydney last week gassed up his B47 with 80 odd litres of JetA1 and attempted to fly it away?
Aircraft was seen hovering in a very shakey state, backfiring and generally making some very strange noises. After he shut it down, he claimed to onlookers that there was a problem with the starter motor!
Should stick to having the boggies gas up the crate in future just like in his B747!
Aircraft was seen hovering in a very shakey state, backfiring and generally making some very strange noises. After he shut it down, he claimed to onlookers that there was a problem with the starter motor!
Should stick to having the boggies gas up the crate in future just like in his B747!
Joined: Jun 1999
Posts: 146
Likes: 0
From: Norwich, CT USA
Well I once told a service attendent to fill my car up with diesel, he filled it with gasoline. That was an expensive cup of coffee I went to get while fueling was going on. Oh well I'm not perfect. As for the B-47 owner, well he didn't hurt anybody, just open the quick drains and collect the jet a and give it to somebody that drives a diesel car or truck. No real harm done. Its only around 60 or so gallons if that much.
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 3,833
Likes: 2
From: Sale, Australia
The same thing happened to Bob Hoover which caused him to crash his Aero Commander. Only goes to show no one is immune from cock ups, except perhaps overboosted from the tone of his post. Or do you suggest Bob Hoover is in need of some lessons?
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 814
Likes: 1
From: Iceland
I have several times had to run out of the FBO when I saw the "JET-A" truck pull up to my Robinson! And thats even though had had been very specific on the radio requested "Avgas".
There are so many that think that helicopter only use JET-A!
And in retrospect I guess they all should
There are so many that think that helicopter only use JET-A!
And in retrospect I guess they all should
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 224
Likes: 2
From: Depends on the day!
Aesir,
What is with the negativity towards pistons. They have flown just as many, probably more than turbines so what is your grounds for such a statement?
I have had engineers that have only worked on turbines say the same thing to me and the only thing I can come up with is that they don't feel confident enough to maintain them properly to keep them airworthy and safe.
B******t is what it is.
What is with the negativity towards pistons. They have flown just as many, probably more than turbines so what is your grounds for such a statement?
I have had engineers that have only worked on turbines say the same thing to me and the only thing I can come up with is that they don't feel confident enough to maintain them properly to keep them airworthy and safe.
B******t is what it is.
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 394
Likes: 2
From: Aus, Europe & everywhere in between
I reckon it's just plain stupidity and bad airmanship.
Assume nothing in aviation! Check for yourself. The re-fueller is not the one about to strap their arse into the aircraft after they have topped up the tanks.
This is a BIG lesson for the young guys.
Oh yeah.........please don't give me the "its an honest mistake" or "it wasn't his fault".
It wasn't an honest mistake and it was his fault!!
Enjoy your flying everyone and keep an eye on those fuel trucks.
Assume nothing in aviation! Check for yourself. The re-fueller is not the one about to strap their arse into the aircraft after they have topped up the tanks.
This is a BIG lesson for the young guys.
Oh yeah.........please don't give me the "its an honest mistake" or "it wasn't his fault".
It wasn't an honest mistake and it was his fault!!
Enjoy your flying everyone and keep an eye on those fuel trucks.
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 202
Likes: 0
From: UK
Filled up with Avgas once but they charged me for Avtur! What a result - £40 instead of £110
Si
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
From: Geelong
What are the actual consequences of running JetA1 in an avgas engine? I would think that filling the tanks then realising you've got the wrong fuel is no big deal - just drain and refill with avgas.
But to actually run the engine, pick the machine up to the hover, cough and splutter, then decide to put it down cos something seems wrong, is surely much more serious.
Is the machine U/S until a LAME makes checks or changes to the engine? Does an incident report need to be submitted to CASA? Is it something that should be marked on the MR?
PJ.
But to actually run the engine, pick the machine up to the hover, cough and splutter, then decide to put it down cos something seems wrong, is surely much more serious.
Is the machine U/S until a LAME makes checks or changes to the engine? Does an incident report need to be submitted to CASA? Is it something that should be marked on the MR?
PJ.
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 171
Likes: 0
From: midcoast US
Pearl Jam -
"What are the actual consequences of running JetA1 in an avgas engine? I would think that filling the tanks then realising you've got the wrong fuel is no big deal - just drain and refill with avgas. "
When the engine is asked to deliver a good portion of power, serious misfiring can result. Detonation can cause burned piston domes, bent connecting rods and other metal suitable for the recycling yard.
Several years ago, a nearby small-town municipal airport had a big misrefueling problem. The fuel supplier brought a load of Jet A and put it into the underground avgas tank. Several of the local pilots had performance problems, but nobody caught the problem. An instructor friend had stopped there just to refuel. On his takeoff roll (in a plank), the engine ran so badly he aborted. After the second attempt, the engine was junk. The insurance company got to pay for about 30 engine rebuilds.
Not a bad reason to take a fuel sample after refueling. Even if the avgas color doesn't noticably change, the smell and oily feel would probably show up.
"What are the actual consequences of running JetA1 in an avgas engine? I would think that filling the tanks then realising you've got the wrong fuel is no big deal - just drain and refill with avgas. "
When the engine is asked to deliver a good portion of power, serious misfiring can result. Detonation can cause burned piston domes, bent connecting rods and other metal suitable for the recycling yard.
Several years ago, a nearby small-town municipal airport had a big misrefueling problem. The fuel supplier brought a load of Jet A and put it into the underground avgas tank. Several of the local pilots had performance problems, but nobody caught the problem. An instructor friend had stopped there just to refuel. On his takeoff roll (in a plank), the engine ran so badly he aborted. After the second attempt, the engine was junk. The insurance company got to pay for about 30 engine rebuilds.
Not a bad reason to take a fuel sample after refueling. Even if the avgas color doesn't noticably change, the smell and oily feel would probably show up.
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 35
Likes: 0
From: Sydney
One wonders if this airline pilot submitted a incident report to the proper authorities so that they can investigate whether the fuel bowsers need a better placard system, or whether is was a pilot induced problem. 
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 2,584
Likes: 0
From: UK
Thread Starter
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
From: SYDNEY
No excuse!
This machine WAS NOT gassed up by a mere bowser operator or truck driver, this aircraft was filled up by an experienced airline captain who happened to also be the owner of the aircraft.
Bowser is clearly identified, however in fairness, is co-located with the AVGAS bowser. Simple enough mistake for sure BUT still a mistake that is unacceptable!
Aircraft was flown/hovered with said fuel onboard (80 litres JETA1 and 15 AVGAS) Fuel drained and flushed and flown away with a possible surprise install for some unsuspecting pilot a few hours down the track.
And for the record; NO! The incident was not reported as required.
Bowser is clearly identified, however in fairness, is co-located with the AVGAS bowser. Simple enough mistake for sure BUT still a mistake that is unacceptable!
Aircraft was flown/hovered with said fuel onboard (80 litres JETA1 and 15 AVGAS) Fuel drained and flushed and flown away with a possible surprise install for some unsuspecting pilot a few hours down the track.
And for the record; NO! The incident was not reported as required.
