Bristow North Sea
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We had found here in the states that the LoL insurance had so many loop holes for the insurance company that most of the claims were denied due to other reasons. i don't know if it is the same there or not but the insurance companys were from Britian. On the 14 Captain being layed off if the work goes away, how can you justify keeping them working.? 
But on the other hand I hate to see anybody out of work.
But on the other hand I hate to see anybody out of work.
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Bristow Unrest
I feel I must reply to PaperworkPilot. The only allegiance I and my colleagues have these days is to ourselves and our families.
We are long passed the time when we may have some allegiance to the company, whichever one you care to name. As for BALPA, allegiance doesn't come into it: members pay BALPA to assist them when necessary. Pilots are paid by the companies they work for; that's the only possible reason for any allegiance that may remain!
As the new Gen Sec of BALPA recently said,
"Pilots have laser-like minds - very sharp but bloody narrow!"
Look around you, only those pilots in organised groups get the best terms and conditions. To say the company wants some of the payrise back, is probably true. But other companies pay handsome salaries AND have good LoL schemes and pensions.
Bristow and CHC Scotia are contracted to the some of the world's richest companies, turning in enormous profits annually. These oil companies are 'captive clients', what alternatives do they have? The fixed wing airlines have to sell their wares to a public, who have a choice. But they can still deliver good salaries, LoL schemes and pensions better than Bristow's!
We are long passed the time when we may have some allegiance to the company, whichever one you care to name. As for BALPA, allegiance doesn't come into it: members pay BALPA to assist them when necessary. Pilots are paid by the companies they work for; that's the only possible reason for any allegiance that may remain!
As the new Gen Sec of BALPA recently said,
"Pilots have laser-like minds - very sharp but bloody narrow!"
Look around you, only those pilots in organised groups get the best terms and conditions. To say the company wants some of the payrise back, is probably true. But other companies pay handsome salaries AND have good LoL schemes and pensions.
Bristow and CHC Scotia are contracted to the some of the world's richest companies, turning in enormous profits annually. These oil companies are 'captive clients', what alternatives do they have? The fixed wing airlines have to sell their wares to a public, who have a choice. But they can still deliver good salaries, LoL schemes and pensions better than Bristow's!
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Paperwork
I take your point and in an ideal world you are right. I am sure that the Bristow boys and girls do have allegance to the Bristow name and provide the customer with the best service possible. However, judging by what others have posted, there would be more willingness to work with the management to get through this sticky patch if management showed some respect for the people who actually generate revenue. Good companies need teamwork. Sounds like that is what the Bristow management lacks.
I take your point and in an ideal world you are right. I am sure that the Bristow boys and girls do have allegance to the Bristow name and provide the customer with the best service possible. However, judging by what others have posted, there would be more willingness to work with the management to get through this sticky patch if management showed some respect for the people who actually generate revenue. Good companies need teamwork. Sounds like that is what the Bristow management lacks.
Management might soon try to get a crash-course on how to fly helicopters. Pilots may be bad managers (if outside the cockpit) but I would hate to be a Pax in a helicopter flown by any of our present managers.
Brace!Brace!Brace!
Brace!Brace!Brace!
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The problem is, there seems to be a hidden agenda here that not even middle management know about. The latest problems to hit BHL are not just generated by downturn in the oil industry, higher salaries, BP bringing in a third operator just because they want their own toys, or the UK government making swinging tax policies which caused the bigger oil players to cut down their operations in the UK Sector.
This is being led in my mind by the masters in Louisiana (they might only own 49% but NOTHING is done over here without their say-so). Bristow had a good profitable operation world wide but now has hardly anything to its name as it has all gone across the pond. The American's want all the profits to go to them and they will asset strip Bristow any way they can.
It isn't just Bristow that is having problems, CHC-Scotia and other European CHC operations are going the same way and soon there will be ONLY two oil players, CHC and OLOG!
It will be interesting to see where the CEO of Bristow and the HR Director go after they leave Redhill. Any bets on nice cosy posts in the US? Mind you the previous European Manager for Bristow who came over from the US and sorted the mess out then, has now left OLOG for other things. Wonder what he knows?
This is being led in my mind by the masters in Louisiana (they might only own 49% but NOTHING is done over here without their say-so). Bristow had a good profitable operation world wide but now has hardly anything to its name as it has all gone across the pond. The American's want all the profits to go to them and they will asset strip Bristow any way they can.
It isn't just Bristow that is having problems, CHC-Scotia and other European CHC operations are going the same way and soon there will be ONLY two oil players, CHC and OLOG!
It will be interesting to see where the CEO of Bristow and the HR Director go after they leave Redhill. Any bets on nice cosy posts in the US? Mind you the previous European Manager for Bristow who came over from the US and sorted the mess out then, has now left OLOG for other things. Wonder what he knows?
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I think the guys working for Bristow, all at one time thought, or knew, that they were working for one of the best helicopter companies in the world.
How things can appear to change. I understand that they haven't had a successful bid in nearly 10 attempts recently (maybe one small one). Insiders say that it's purely on cost. So where is the company failing? The competitors have the same salary structure for pilots and engineers.
Perhaps it's time to get people from the sharp end in to win contracts again.....it used to work....and this system of suits doing the job would appear to be destroying a well respected company. The workforce stays loyal to a name up to a certain point.
To rub salt into the wound, I believe they're also training new Bond offshore co-pilots, giving new Bond a hangar in Aberdeen, and letting new Bond use their passenger terminal. But maybe that's another story.
How things can appear to change. I understand that they haven't had a successful bid in nearly 10 attempts recently (maybe one small one). Insiders say that it's purely on cost. So where is the company failing? The competitors have the same salary structure for pilots and engineers.
Perhaps it's time to get people from the sharp end in to win contracts again.....it used to work....and this system of suits doing the job would appear to be destroying a well respected company. The workforce stays loyal to a name up to a certain point.
To rub salt into the wound, I believe they're also training new Bond offshore co-pilots, giving new Bond a hangar in Aberdeen, and letting new Bond use their passenger terminal. But maybe that's another story.
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It isn't just Bristow that is having problems, CHC-Scotia and other European CHC operations are going the same way and soon there will be ONLY two oil players, CHC and OLOG!
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Totally agree that 3 operators won't work, but I'd put my money on CHC and Bond.
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The fact remains that the oil companies are willing to throttle the operators close to death just to save a few bob. The fact that the stress on the operator's staff is detrimental to flight safety seems not to bother them. What I'd like to know is whether the oil company can be made accountable for any harm that results from overstressed crews and engineers making a mistake and killing people, or whether they can shrugg it off and simply blame the operator. Just how far does corporate manslaughter go?
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S76Heavy
A very interesting point you make. I wonder if there is a legal-beagle on the Forum who could answer this question?
If there was a way, it could make them wake up to their responsibilities more, but I suspect that this has already been discussed with various oil company legal departments. No doubt they have made sure in various clauses in contracts that they are not held responsible in any way for their contractor's actions!
Anyone care to comment who might have some corporate legal knowledge?
BHPS
A very interesting point you make. I wonder if there is a legal-beagle on the Forum who could answer this question?
If there was a way, it could make them wake up to their responsibilities more, but I suspect that this has already been discussed with various oil company legal departments. No doubt they have made sure in various clauses in contracts that they are not held responsible in any way for their contractor's actions!
Anyone care to comment who might have some corporate legal knowledge?
BHPS
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S76Heavy & BHPS,
I'm not a legal-beagle and don't have any in depth knowledge of corporate law, but, I am sure I am correct in saying that should the pilot feel unfit to fly for any reason, such as stress, then he/she is duty (lawfully?) bound not to fly. Don't ask me where it's written down as I don't know, perhaps someone who does will post. Anyway, if what I have said is true, then any incident that was proved to be caused as a result of the pilot suffering stress, the authority, the company and the customer would blame the poor unfortunate pilot concerned.
Chopperman.
I'm not a legal-beagle and don't have any in depth knowledge of corporate law, but, I am sure I am correct in saying that should the pilot feel unfit to fly for any reason, such as stress, then he/she is duty (lawfully?) bound not to fly. Don't ask me where it's written down as I don't know, perhaps someone who does will post. Anyway, if what I have said is true, then any incident that was proved to be caused as a result of the pilot suffering stress, the authority, the company and the customer would blame the poor unfortunate pilot concerned.
Chopperman.
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Forgive me for my ignorance of North Sea matters, but this is all a bit confusing.
I've been reading on this Rotorheads forum over the last couple of days that the North Sea pilots are the best paid in the industry, and that BALPA has made great changes in getting a great deal for all you guys, with Bentley cars and salaries most of us can only dream of.
Now I'm reading that you guys are all stressed-out, flight safety is suffering, people are getting close to being killed and that someone needs to see if the oil companies can be held liable.
Is there some kind of reality gap here, or is there a lot that's not being said?
I'm confused
I've been reading on this Rotorheads forum over the last couple of days that the North Sea pilots are the best paid in the industry, and that BALPA has made great changes in getting a great deal for all you guys, with Bentley cars and salaries most of us can only dream of.
Now I'm reading that you guys are all stressed-out, flight safety is suffering, people are getting close to being killed and that someone needs to see if the oil companies can be held liable.
Is there some kind of reality gap here, or is there a lot that's not being said?
I'm confused
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Mama Mangrove,
what good is a decent salary if you're not even sure you'll have a job next month? There will be less flying in the future, hence less pilots required.
Also, if you look at the average age of the helicopter fleets you can expect equipment failure. If then there are no spares in stock to save money, you have a screaming customer on the phone who demands a helicopter NOW when your last servicable one just went T... up, the company is either making a loss or barely making a profit, penalties for unservicabilities are high and the contract renewal date is getting close, pressures are high to get the job done. And then it's a small step to getting the job done in spite of, or regardless..a slippery slope.
what good is a decent salary if you're not even sure you'll have a job next month? There will be less flying in the future, hence less pilots required.
Also, if you look at the average age of the helicopter fleets you can expect equipment failure. If then there are no spares in stock to save money, you have a screaming customer on the phone who demands a helicopter NOW when your last servicable one just went T... up, the company is either making a loss or barely making a profit, penalties for unservicabilities are high and the contract renewal date is getting close, pressures are high to get the job done. And then it's a small step to getting the job done in spite of, or regardless..a slippery slope.
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S76
What you say is quite true, but it's not confined to the North Sea. Almost anywhere in the international oil patch where countries allow more than one operator the oil companies force them to compete against each other to obtain the lowest price. That's just plain market economics isn't it?
Most companies these days cut down on spares holdings to save money and it's sods law that the customer is always screaming on the phone just when your last helicopter went t..s up.
If you think job security is bad in the UK you should see what it's like in the rest of the world. Not a lot different I suspect. So I don't see why North Sea pilots should be any more stressed than anyone else - and at least they've had these high salaries being talked about to help them save up some money to cushion the hard times.
Sorry, I'm not unsympathetic to those poor guys being laid off, but I don't see that the North Sea is any different to anywhere else. Just as a matter of interest, are Bristow pilots on overseas contracts on the same deal as those in the UK? Are they also being restive?
What you say is quite true, but it's not confined to the North Sea. Almost anywhere in the international oil patch where countries allow more than one operator the oil companies force them to compete against each other to obtain the lowest price. That's just plain market economics isn't it?
Most companies these days cut down on spares holdings to save money and it's sods law that the customer is always screaming on the phone just when your last helicopter went t..s up.
If you think job security is bad in the UK you should see what it's like in the rest of the world. Not a lot different I suspect. So I don't see why North Sea pilots should be any more stressed than anyone else - and at least they've had these high salaries being talked about to help them save up some money to cushion the hard times.
Sorry, I'm not unsympathetic to those poor guys being laid off, but I don't see that the North Sea is any different to anywhere else. Just as a matter of interest, are Bristow pilots on overseas contracts on the same deal as those in the UK? Are they also being restive?
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MM,
perhaps it's just the culture shock from being indoctrinated for years about the fact that safety is paramount, only to find that when push comes to shove, safety is not allowed to cost any money and just get the job done, stop bitching. And the guys who got mortgages based on the pay rise are in more trouble nowadays if they are made redundant than before.
Job satisfaction is going down the drains as they take away the tools with which we can do a professional job, so is loyalty when people are being made redundant in illogical ways and it will only be a matter of time before what's left of the professionalism goes that same way. Humans are simply like that.
And as there are numerous ways in which I can get killed by somebody else's mistake (let alone mine) and the working environment is being set up to become more incident-prone, I start worrying about these things when really I should be concentrating on other stuff like flying the damn thing safely.
I fear that it will take another accident to prove that there are limits to how far you can cut a budget and still maintain a safety margin. As usual, the important lessons will be written in blood, but it's never the blood of those faceless grey suits (just review the Aussie HEMs crash thread, looks very similar to this one, the difference being they HAD their fatalities).
It's all good and well, market economy etc. but I don't want to suffer the GoM safety record in my working area just so somone can make more profit.
perhaps it's just the culture shock from being indoctrinated for years about the fact that safety is paramount, only to find that when push comes to shove, safety is not allowed to cost any money and just get the job done, stop bitching. And the guys who got mortgages based on the pay rise are in more trouble nowadays if they are made redundant than before.
Job satisfaction is going down the drains as they take away the tools with which we can do a professional job, so is loyalty when people are being made redundant in illogical ways and it will only be a matter of time before what's left of the professionalism goes that same way. Humans are simply like that.
And as there are numerous ways in which I can get killed by somebody else's mistake (let alone mine) and the working environment is being set up to become more incident-prone, I start worrying about these things when really I should be concentrating on other stuff like flying the damn thing safely.
I fear that it will take another accident to prove that there are limits to how far you can cut a budget and still maintain a safety margin. As usual, the important lessons will be written in blood, but it's never the blood of those faceless grey suits (just review the Aussie HEMs crash thread, looks very similar to this one, the difference being they HAD their fatalities).
It's all good and well, market economy etc. but I don't want to suffer the GoM safety record in my working area just so somone can make more profit.
Safety Margin?
Compete ourselves out of business?
It will take another Crash?
Screaming Customer?
The cause of the problem is staring out the mirror at you when you shave in the morning. The oil companies do not set the rates...the helicopter company does. The oil company does not set the safety standard....the helicopter company does....the oil company does not set the engineering standards....the helicopter company does. The helicopter company is made up of people.....and it is the personal decisions made by those people that determine the standard.
You accept a lesser standard....and you have now set the "new standard". The company wants to set rates so low everyone goes broke....that is a business decision made by people.
There is more to being a "Professional" than the fancy uniform and paycheck. Function is the key....form is mere flash. If the aircraft is unsafe....write up the defect. If the weather is below minimums....refuse the flight. If the company violates the law, report them. It is your neck on the block afterall.
And face it.....the only thing guaranteed in this life....and that is it ends for all of us. Everything else is the luck of the draw.
Compete ourselves out of business?
It will take another Crash?
Screaming Customer?
The cause of the problem is staring out the mirror at you when you shave in the morning. The oil companies do not set the rates...the helicopter company does. The oil company does not set the safety standard....the helicopter company does....the oil company does not set the engineering standards....the helicopter company does. The helicopter company is made up of people.....and it is the personal decisions made by those people that determine the standard.
You accept a lesser standard....and you have now set the "new standard". The company wants to set rates so low everyone goes broke....that is a business decision made by people.
There is more to being a "Professional" than the fancy uniform and paycheck. Function is the key....form is mere flash. If the aircraft is unsafe....write up the defect. If the weather is below minimums....refuse the flight. If the company violates the law, report them. It is your neck on the block afterall.
And face it.....the only thing guaranteed in this life....and that is it ends for all of us. Everything else is the luck of the draw.
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SASless:
I hesitated before I took the bait because, behind the irony, there is a lot of truth in what you have said; however:
is too simplistic in my view!
The offshore industry is one in which the customer has more influence on the product than most. Certainly in some areas of operation, one only has to examine the contractual rates to see that a number of extremely important innovations are directly financed by the oil companies.
The reduction in the accident rate in these areas is the direct result of the synergy between pilots, operators, oil companies and the regulator. A similar approach might be useful in other areas.
Having experienced a similar downturn in the past, my sympathy is with the families of the redundant staff but remember the old adage, “when one door closes, many others open”.
I hesitated before I took the bait because, behind the irony, there is a lot of truth in what you have said; however:
The oil companies do not set the rates...the helicopter company does. The oil company does not set the safety standard....the helicopter company does....the oil company does not set the engineering standards....the helicopter company does. The helicopter company is made up of people.....and it is the personal decisions made by those people that determine the standard.
The offshore industry is one in which the customer has more influence on the product than most. Certainly in some areas of operation, one only has to examine the contractual rates to see that a number of extremely important innovations are directly financed by the oil companies.
The reduction in the accident rate in these areas is the direct result of the synergy between pilots, operators, oil companies and the regulator. A similar approach might be useful in other areas.
Having experienced a similar downturn in the past, my sympathy is with the families of the redundant staff but remember the old adage, “when one door closes, many others open”.
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SASless,
all very true, but my face is just one of the many who determine the safety of my flight. And some of the faces are very concerned about being branded as "troublemakers". Each of us can only do so much and depends on others for other critical aspects of the job.
all very true, but my face is just one of the many who determine the safety of my flight. And some of the faces are very concerned about being branded as "troublemakers". Each of us can only do so much and depends on others for other critical aspects of the job.