HEMS - Regulations and saving life
I wonder why you lot always make things personal and turn vicious? I simply and repeatedly asked Bronx to explain what he meant by a particular phrase he used to describe an event, and everybody starts dancing like I'm shooting at their feet! I would say that you....blah, blah, blah.........
To some you might appear long on opinion and bluster, but short on knowledge and fact - who knows, I am surely not one to judge?
Anyway, is that G'day a long term proposition, as it is becoming increasingly apparent that no-one on this board is ever going to remotely approach you're intellectual capacity or social grace?
PruneFan.....we rotorheads are neurotic nutjobs! You think riding around in a collection of thousands of rotating bits and pieces, built to the minimum standard, by the lowest bidder, and maintained to the minimum standard.....flying over inhospitable surfaces.....in evil weather is something that would promote mental well being? Dear chap....get a grip....we are hands on pilots....and have never been known for being the quietest, most pacific folks in aviation. Thus when you evoke a somewhat caustic response....why just learn to weave your way through the flak. Cyber bullets create cyber wounds......only the Mod's can bring about cyber death. (note to the mod's....you sterling gentlemen are doing a most commendable job of what is such a daunting task too, I might add!)
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 5,197
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Passing of a Medevac Pioneer
Lt. Cowgill (center, second row) and friends with R-4 on floating aircraft repair unit (ARU) off the Philippines.
They were known as the "Ivory Soap" pilots and they were among the pioneers of helicopter medevac. And now the last of that group has passed away.
Bob Cowgill, the last of five Army Air Force pilots who flew 70 soldiers to safety during the WW II Ivory Soap rescues in the Philippines was 79.
Ivory Soap was the code name for a project during World War II that took Liberty Ships and outfitted them to conduct aviation repair in the Pacific theater. Among the things they carried were Sikorsky helicopters.
During June of 1945, the five aviators flew Sikorsky R-4 and R-6 helicopters into a combat zone in the Philippines to bring injured soldiers out for medical treatment, often under fire.
Many were the first cases flown with external litters welded in-theater to the side of the R-6 airframe. Details of the missions remained classified for decades.
Cowgill died in Port Townsend, Wash. He graduated from the University of Washington with a degree in aeronautical engineering and became an Army Aviator. After the war, he went with Hiller Helicopters, where he became he chief flight test engineer.
In 1968 he left aerospace engineering and became an authority on Pacific Northwest coastal Native American art and history. He developed a large collection of art, artifacts and books and devoted the last 35 years of his life to carving pieces inspired by that culture. His art was the subject of a major retrospective exhibit this year.
He was modest about his unit's World War II achievements that helped validate Igor Sikorsky's dream of how the helicopter would be used.
In April of 2003 Cowgill finally received recognition for his role in medical evacuations in the Philippines, receiving an Air Medal. He was awarded the Sikorsky Winged-S Rescue Award in 2001 after his unit's exploits came to light.
"I know what we did and I've always been proud of it. That's good enough for me," he told the Port Townsend Leader newspaper last year.
Lt. Cowgill in the cockpit of an R-4 on Okinawa in 1945
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Yorkshire
Posts: 80
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Barannfin,
That honour goes to Floyd Carlson (just), Bell Helicopter's test pilot, who carried out a rescue on 5 Jan 1945.
Bell's chief test pilot (fixed wing) baled out of a stricken YP-59 jet fighter and parachuted 10,000 ft into a remote area and deep snow. Although injured and having lost his flying boots, he made it to a farmhouse but no vehicle could get to him. Carlson took off in helicopter ship No 2, picked up a doctor, and made it to him in time to treat his injuries and save the loss of his toes. An ambulance made it to him three hours later behind a snow plough.
But, if this rescue was technically not an evacuation by helicopter, that happened a short time later in March 1945.
Carlson rescued two fishermen stranded on breaking ice in the middle of Lake Erie. Before leaving base, Carlson experimented with a mechanic to determine the right fuel load and weight and balance to ensure he could pick up a man from the hover without settling. He then rescued the fishermen one at a time after they'd spent 21 hours on the ice.
So endeth the history lesson!
That honour goes to Floyd Carlson (just), Bell Helicopter's test pilot, who carried out a rescue on 5 Jan 1945.
Bell's chief test pilot (fixed wing) baled out of a stricken YP-59 jet fighter and parachuted 10,000 ft into a remote area and deep snow. Although injured and having lost his flying boots, he made it to a farmhouse but no vehicle could get to him. Carlson took off in helicopter ship No 2, picked up a doctor, and made it to him in time to treat his injuries and save the loss of his toes. An ambulance made it to him three hours later behind a snow plough.
But, if this rescue was technically not an evacuation by helicopter, that happened a short time later in March 1945.
Carlson rescued two fishermen stranded on breaking ice in the middle of Lake Erie. Before leaving base, Carlson experimented with a mechanic to determine the right fuel load and weight and balance to ensure he could pick up a man from the hover without settling. He then rescued the fishermen one at a time after they'd spent 21 hours on the ice.
So endeth the history lesson!
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: New York City
Posts: 820
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Barranfin / B47
Documented first uses of the helicopter for medical and rescue purposes:
First MEDICAL SUPPORT Flights January 3, 1944
USCG flew plasma from the Battery in New York City to a hospital in Sandy Hook. Snow squalls and sleet had grounded all fixed winged aircraft and the plasma was badly needed for sailors injured in an explosion aboard the USS Turner. This initial "flight for mankind" was made by Cdr. Frank Erickson, USCG in the first operational model of the Sikorsky R-4 helicopter.
January 15, 1945, Bell Model 30 (prototype Bell 47) used by Floyd Carlson to fly a doctor to a farm house in Western New York. The doctor treated a Bells Chief Pilot Jack Woollams suffering frostbite after baling out of his crippled P-59 Airacomet jet.
(They weren't evacuation flights - and Carlson's evac flight was the second by a few weeks.)
First MEDEVAC Flight January 1945
A Sikorsky YR-4 was dismantled at Wright Field (Dayton, Ohio) on January 17, 1945, loaded on a C-54 transport, and flown to the North Burma theater of operations. It was quickly reassembled and only nine days later, on January 26, 1945, Capt. Frank Peterson, AAF flew it to evacuate a wounded weather observer from a 4,700 foot mountain ridge in the Naga hills of Burma.
Peterson's YR-4, with escorting L-5, refueling enroute to mountain rescue - Chindwin River, Burma
Source data & 1/26/45 photo from de-classified AAF document, National Air & Space Museum archives.
This WWII combat zone mission is believed to be the first time a helicopter was actually used to rescue AND transport a trauma patient. Possibly Lt. Carter Harman, AAF, made a medevac flight near Mawlu, Burma on April 23, 1944. No official, documented source yet found to confirm.
First RESCUE Flights March 14, 1945
Floyd Carlson flew a Bell Model 30 to rescue two commercial fishermen stranded on an ice flow in Lake Erie. The fishermen were ferried, one at a time, to shore.
April, 1945, the first large scale rescue occurred when the US Army and USCG teamed up to rescue nine downed Canadian airmen. Lt. August Kleisch, USCG flew a R-4 that had been airlifted to the area to extricate these men from snow drifts 180 miles south of Goose Bay, Labrador.
First HOIST Rescue November 29, 1945
Sikorsky test pilot Jimmy Viner and Capt. Jackson Beighle, AAF (acting as hoist operator) used a R-5 with a new hydraulic hoist to lift two men from a large barge breaking apart in a storm on Penfield Reef off of Bridgeport, Conn.
Photo, from the Igor I. Sikorsky Historical Archives, Inc. web site, shows one of the barge's crew being lowered to the beach - the barge can be seen in the distant background.
When Igor Sikorsky's VS-300 experimental rotorcraft made it's first free flight in 1940, he is quoted as saying this new vehicle is for the "benefit of mankind". In just four years, this wish or prophecy became a reality.
Documented first uses of the helicopter for medical and rescue purposes:
First MEDICAL SUPPORT Flights January 3, 1944
USCG flew plasma from the Battery in New York City to a hospital in Sandy Hook. Snow squalls and sleet had grounded all fixed winged aircraft and the plasma was badly needed for sailors injured in an explosion aboard the USS Turner. This initial "flight for mankind" was made by Cdr. Frank Erickson, USCG in the first operational model of the Sikorsky R-4 helicopter.
January 15, 1945, Bell Model 30 (prototype Bell 47) used by Floyd Carlson to fly a doctor to a farm house in Western New York. The doctor treated a Bells Chief Pilot Jack Woollams suffering frostbite after baling out of his crippled P-59 Airacomet jet.
(They weren't evacuation flights - and Carlson's evac flight was the second by a few weeks.)
First MEDEVAC Flight January 1945
A Sikorsky YR-4 was dismantled at Wright Field (Dayton, Ohio) on January 17, 1945, loaded on a C-54 transport, and flown to the North Burma theater of operations. It was quickly reassembled and only nine days later, on January 26, 1945, Capt. Frank Peterson, AAF flew it to evacuate a wounded weather observer from a 4,700 foot mountain ridge in the Naga hills of Burma.
Peterson's YR-4, with escorting L-5, refueling enroute to mountain rescue - Chindwin River, Burma
Source data & 1/26/45 photo from de-classified AAF document, National Air & Space Museum archives.
This WWII combat zone mission is believed to be the first time a helicopter was actually used to rescue AND transport a trauma patient. Possibly Lt. Carter Harman, AAF, made a medevac flight near Mawlu, Burma on April 23, 1944. No official, documented source yet found to confirm.
First RESCUE Flights March 14, 1945
Floyd Carlson flew a Bell Model 30 to rescue two commercial fishermen stranded on an ice flow in Lake Erie. The fishermen were ferried, one at a time, to shore.
April, 1945, the first large scale rescue occurred when the US Army and USCG teamed up to rescue nine downed Canadian airmen. Lt. August Kleisch, USCG flew a R-4 that had been airlifted to the area to extricate these men from snow drifts 180 miles south of Goose Bay, Labrador.
First HOIST Rescue November 29, 1945
Sikorsky test pilot Jimmy Viner and Capt. Jackson Beighle, AAF (acting as hoist operator) used a R-5 with a new hydraulic hoist to lift two men from a large barge breaking apart in a storm on Penfield Reef off of Bridgeport, Conn.
Photo, from the Igor I. Sikorsky Historical Archives, Inc. web site, shows one of the barge's crew being lowered to the beach - the barge can be seen in the distant background.
When Igor Sikorsky's VS-300 experimental rotorcraft made it's first free flight in 1940, he is quoted as saying this new vehicle is for the "benefit of mankind". In just four years, this wish or prophecy became a reality.
Last edited by Bronx; 13th Aug 2003 at 23:17.
Iconoclast
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: The home of Dudley Dooright-Where the lead dog is the only one that gets a change of scenery.
Posts: 2,132
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If only I were old enough.
To: Bronx
When that happened I was only 14 ½ years old. However 2 ½ years later I was in the Coast Guard and two years after that I was working on helicopters. Coast Guard aviators at Floyd Bennett field not too far from the Bronx trained most of the helicopter pilots of that era. I had the privilege of working with and flying with most of those same aviators.
When that happened I was only 14 ½ years old. However 2 ½ years later I was in the Coast Guard and two years after that I was working on helicopters. Coast Guard aviators at Floyd Bennett field not too far from the Bronx trained most of the helicopter pilots of that era. I had the privilege of working with and flying with most of those same aviators.
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Hartford, CT USA
Posts: 147
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks for all that information Bronx. Its pretty amazing how quickly the helicopters proved themselves to, what I think is thier best mission.
As Mr. Sikorsky once said, If you need help anywhere in the world, a plane can fly over and drop flowers. But a helicopter can land and rescue you.
(alright maybe not anywhere)
Thats what I am looking forward to doing in the USCG.
Lu, you wouldn't happen to still be in touch with any current CG aviators would you?
As Mr. Sikorsky once said, If you need help anywhere in the world, a plane can fly over and drop flowers. But a helicopter can land and rescue you.
(alright maybe not anywhere)
Thats what I am looking forward to doing in the USCG.
Lu, you wouldn't happen to still be in touch with any current CG aviators would you?
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 5,197
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This thread starts with a discussion about CAA regulations threatening the future of a hospital helipad but goes on to discuss wider HEMS and SAR issues.
Heliport
Birmingham Evening Mail report
Heliport
Birmingham Evening Mail report
BIRMINGHAM Children's Hospital will lose its helicopter landing pad unless it can find pounds 1.2 million by the end of the year.
Critically-injured children might have to be flown to other hospitals around the city for initial treatment before being transferred by land ambulance to the city centre hospital to receive the specialist paediatric treatment they need.
Hospital managers and air ambulance operators have called for action to save the helipad.
Up to 40 patients a year, many with lifethreatening injuries, are flown to the hospital from all over the country.
The current helipad will be decommissioned in December because of new regulations introduced by the Civil Aviation Authority.
The CAA rules state that helicopters using hospital landing sites must have three clear routes in and out of the area.
But its current location surrounded by the hospital, Central Hall, and Aston University halls of residence, means it does not meet the guidelines.
The only alternative would be to build a landing site on top of the new £13 million burns unit which has just been given the goahead by city planners.
The hospital's A&E manager, Mandy Sankey, said any delay to a child receiving life- saving specialist treatment during the 'golden hour' - the first 60 minutes after an accident - could reduce the chances of survival. 'We have to find the money,' she added.
Critically-injured children might have to be flown to other hospitals around the city for initial treatment before being transferred by land ambulance to the city centre hospital to receive the specialist paediatric treatment they need.
Hospital managers and air ambulance operators have called for action to save the helipad.
Up to 40 patients a year, many with lifethreatening injuries, are flown to the hospital from all over the country.
The current helipad will be decommissioned in December because of new regulations introduced by the Civil Aviation Authority.
The CAA rules state that helicopters using hospital landing sites must have three clear routes in and out of the area.
But its current location surrounded by the hospital, Central Hall, and Aston University halls of residence, means it does not meet the guidelines.
The only alternative would be to build a landing site on top of the new £13 million burns unit which has just been given the goahead by city planners.
The hospital's A&E manager, Mandy Sankey, said any delay to a child receiving life- saving specialist treatment during the 'golden hour' - the first 60 minutes after an accident - could reduce the chances of survival. 'We have to find the money,' she added.
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: N2832W8100
Posts: 166
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Typical Stupidity.
Does any problems in the past that would give them good grounds to make this stupid new Regulation?
Or is it just another pointless act at our expense to give them justification of having a job?
Does any problems in the past that would give them good grounds to make this stupid new Regulation?
Or is it just another pointless act at our expense to give them justification of having a job?
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
The CAA rules state that helicopters using hospital landing sites must have three clear routes in and out of the area.
3 clear routes in and out seems a bit restrictive around any hospital area.
Be nice to get a HEMS pilots eye view on this.
Join Date: May 2001
Location: queensland australia
Age: 77
Posts: 563
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
i thought some of the regulations we had in australia were sometimes a backward step but your morons take the prize.
it took us fifteen years of argument with our casa to be able to do curved approaches and departures to avoid flying over congested areas and the like. in other words utilising the machine properly.
three tracks in and out is a joke and apparently endangers life. they should be held accountable for their actions.
maybe we could make a trophy, a jar of prunes perhaps, for the person or group within the the civil aviation authority of each country that comes up with the most ludicrous regulation each year.
it may make all of the crap they have in their systems come out the right end for a change.
it took us fifteen years of argument with our casa to be able to do curved approaches and departures to avoid flying over congested areas and the like. in other words utilising the machine properly.
three tracks in and out is a joke and apparently endangers life. they should be held accountable for their actions.
maybe we could make a trophy, a jar of prunes perhaps, for the person or group within the the civil aviation authority of each country that comes up with the most ludicrous regulation each year.
it may make all of the crap they have in their systems come out the right end for a change.
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: ----------
Posts: 194
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Would you not think that these idiots would allow some discresion based on the life saving potential of this unit. I wonder what the bright spark from fualty towers that dreamed up this idea would feel like if his child had severe injuries then had to be transported by land ambulance from some where else into the middle of Birmingham on a hot busy traffic conjested day.
Silsoesid is also right this has far reaching conciquences for the rest of the hospitals in the uk.
God help us bureaucracy gone senceless again
Sincerely
Bravo 99 (AJB)
Silsoesid is also right this has far reaching conciquences for the rest of the hospitals in the uk.
God help us bureaucracy gone senceless again
Sincerely
Bravo 99 (AJB)
Rule 5.
If said helipad fails to meet new requirements it still should not effect life-saving flights. Rule 5 will be the 'critical' rule here and crews are absolved from adherance of Rule 5 for the purposes of saving life.
Routine (planned) medical transfer flights, will however, still continue to be effected.
J
If said helipad fails to meet new requirements it still should not effect life-saving flights. Rule 5 will be the 'critical' rule here and crews are absolved from adherance of Rule 5 for the purposes of saving life.
Routine (planned) medical transfer flights, will however, still continue to be effected.
J
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: UK
Age: 71
Posts: 1,364
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You need to be a bit careful about believing technical detail from newspapers, but the theme sounds terribly familiar.
Bear in mind that any air ambo (and police hele) in the UK will be two engine anyway!
The CAA have also just tightened up their regulation of "rescue work" carried out by police helicopters. In the UK none are SAR equipped (no winches etc). Nevertheless, from time to time police helicopters end up in situations where people are drowning, and there are no rescue boats etc. An almost instinctive reaction from the crew is to use the helicopter to save the people - low hover over the water, grab the person and lift them to safety. Notwithstanding any rational view of the risk, (risk exposure to the helicopter and crew is very low v. almost certain drowning of the casualty) the CAA have now more or less promised to prosecute the next pilot and police force who use their helicopter like this.
It is clear that they won't be happy until we are only able to use heicopters like aeroplanes.
I ought to ask FL if he will defend the first of us who gets clobbered by this one.
Bear in mind that any air ambo (and police hele) in the UK will be two engine anyway!
The CAA have also just tightened up their regulation of "rescue work" carried out by police helicopters. In the UK none are SAR equipped (no winches etc). Nevertheless, from time to time police helicopters end up in situations where people are drowning, and there are no rescue boats etc. An almost instinctive reaction from the crew is to use the helicopter to save the people - low hover over the water, grab the person and lift them to safety. Notwithstanding any rational view of the risk, (risk exposure to the helicopter and crew is very low v. almost certain drowning of the casualty) the CAA have now more or less promised to prosecute the next pilot and police force who use their helicopter like this.
It is clear that they won't be happy until we are only able to use heicopters like aeroplanes.
I ought to ask FL if he will defend the first of us who gets clobbered by this one.
Does the Childrens Hospital actually need this helipad ? There's talk about the 'golden hour' after an accident; how does this differ from children to adults ? If there are other casualty units "around the city" (presumably therefore only within a few minutes flying time of each other) each of which can stabilise accident victims (adult or child) within the golden hour, does having this additional one actually help ? If there are not 'three clear routes in and out' of the current helipad, how far away is the proposed new one, that presumably does have them ? And hence, how long must the critically injured patient spend on a trolley being rushed from the new pad to the casualty department ?
They say that "Up to 40 patients a year, many with life threatening injuries, are flown to the hospital from all over the country." unless that's a mis-spelling of county, most of these sound like transfers rather than children requiring "life-saving specialist treatment during the 'golden hour'".
Or is this a disgruntled manager about to lose part of their empire deciding to blame the CAA and pull the 'children may be affected' ploy ? After all, that's sure to provoke an outcry and secure their budget for next year.
They say that "Up to 40 patients a year, many with life threatening injuries, are flown to the hospital from all over the country." unless that's a mis-spelling of county, most of these sound like transfers rather than children requiring "life-saving specialist treatment during the 'golden hour'".
Or is this a disgruntled manager about to lose part of their empire deciding to blame the CAA and pull the 'children may be affected' ploy ? After all, that's sure to provoke an outcry and secure their budget for next year.