Two killed in A109 near Bournemouth - AAIB report published
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Thomas Coupling,
The Accident Bulletin is at:
http://www.dft.gov.uk/stellent/group...ty_027966.hcsp
Then type "Max Radford" into Pprune search tool and read the threads.
Read the facts not the gossip.
49ers
The Accident Bulletin is at:
http://www.dft.gov.uk/stellent/group...ty_027966.hcsp
Then type "Max Radford" into Pprune search tool and read the threads.
Read the facts not the gossip.
49ers
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Cause of helicopter crash still unclear
See the link below, an article in the Times today, looks like there trying to start a conspiracy theory.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/newspap...636062,00.html
Any views?
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/newspap...636062,00.html
Any views?
Compare with the accident involving G-XCEL - the cause in this case is known, but the report still hasn't been published by the AAIB. My understanding (and I'm sure friends of Ian, James or Neville will correct me if I'm wrong, and I'll edit my post if required) is that there may be legal action in the offing so the report is not being published until that is settled.
So an accident four months later which involved someone of interest to the media with no published report - not a conspiracy, IMO, just process.
So an accident four months later which involved someone of interest to the media with no published report - not a conspiracy, IMO, just process.
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Helicam,
Sorry I hadnt seen your post until this was brought back to the surface today. Had the aaib spoken to you ,as they were trying to speak to everyone who had flown in the 109 with MR?
The report has been given to the relatives a while ago for comment.
Regards
HB
Sorry I hadnt seen your post until this was brought back to the surface today. Had the aaib spoken to you ,as they were trying to speak to everyone who had flown in the 109 with MR?
The report has been given to the relatives a while ago for comment.
Regards
HB
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Is anybody prepared to disclose what those last 27 sec of ATC recording allegedly contain ?
I have no connection with this accident except having seen the sad wreckage at the AAIB and having flow from Bournemouth around that time.
I fully understand if the answer is 'no'
I have no connection with this accident except having seen the sad wreckage at the AAIB and having flow from Bournemouth around that time.
I fully understand if the answer is 'no'
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hover bovver
Yes i did speak to the AAIB regarding the accident as i went to see Maxs girlfriend a few days after it all happened and bumped into them at Red Aviation.
From what I saw Max seemed to understand the aircraft quite well, and was keen to further his knowledge of the aircraft by doing a few hand holding days with an A109 operator. I guess if Max had not of been on the ILS in a stabed aircraft the question about what happened may of been a bit more clear cut
helicam
Yes i did speak to the AAIB regarding the accident as i went to see Maxs girlfriend a few days after it all happened and bumped into them at Red Aviation.
From what I saw Max seemed to understand the aircraft quite well, and was keen to further his knowledge of the aircraft by doing a few hand holding days with an A109 operator. I guess if Max had not of been on the ILS in a stabed aircraft the question about what happened may of been a bit more clear cut
helicam
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I'm guessing that things like the recording are not released for Joe Public to listen to???
There may not be anything said on there, but as was said before, you may be able to hear something going on in the background.
I think there are a lot of people who would like a definate answer to what happened, but will we ever know?
There may not be anything said on there, but as was said before, you may be able to hear something going on in the background.
I think there are a lot of people who would like a definate answer to what happened, but will we ever know?
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I don't understad the bit about the LOW RPM warning horn. I thought helicopters had governors that ensured the engine operated at the correct rpm. The report says both engines were functioning normally, so why would there be a loss of rotor rpm?
Guess sabotage has been ruled out now.
ETC
Guess sabotage has been ruled out now.
ETC
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A governor can only modulate power within a range determined by limits set by either the governor system itself, or the maximum power available from the engines, assuming the drive is intact.
Pull the lever too far and rotor rpm will ultimately droop once this limit is reached.
Pull the lever too far and rotor rpm will ultimately droop once this limit is reached.
If you demand more power than the engines can provide, then the Nr will decay. A governor will only control power within the range of 'idle' to 'Max contingency' (or 30 sec rating), power demand outside that range and the Nr will vary.
I'm curious about the electrical system logic; seems to favour the left hand seat to the right?
I'm curious about the electrical system logic; seems to favour the left hand seat to the right?
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I found reading that report harrowing.
It dredged back all the feelings from the time of the accident.
I am not convinced by the summary of the report. To me it seems like a standard AAIB cop out, but then I am bias.
It dredged back all the feelings from the time of the accident.
I am not convinced by the summary of the report. To me it seems like a standard AAIB cop out, but then I am bias.
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HeliEng
So if you doubt the report, what do you think is a more likely cause for the accident?
Seems to me there was a fair amount of supporting evidence and as ever it looked a pretty thorough investigation.
So if you doubt the report, what do you think is a more likely cause for the accident?
Seems to me there was a fair amount of supporting evidence and as ever it looked a pretty thorough investigation.
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Rotorspeed,
To be honest with you I don't know. And in truth I don't think anyone really truly will.
I knew Max for about 5 years, and I just don't believe that cloud would have been the cause of his death. In my opinion he was a very experienced, capable pilot, and I have trusted him with my life on many occasion.
Max and I (and others no doubt) have known helicopter pilots and passengers who have been killed through getting disorientated in cloud, and as such I for sure have a healthy respect for cloud, and fully appreciate how it can turn out.
I don't think this should turn into a debate about flying into cloud, this is just my opinion and the founding of it.
Regards
Helieng
To be honest with you I don't know. And in truth I don't think anyone really truly will.
I knew Max for about 5 years, and I just don't believe that cloud would have been the cause of his death. In my opinion he was a very experienced, capable pilot, and I have trusted him with my life on many occasion.
Max and I (and others no doubt) have known helicopter pilots and passengers who have been killed through getting disorientated in cloud, and as such I for sure have a healthy respect for cloud, and fully appreciate how it can turn out.
I don't think this should turn into a debate about flying into cloud, this is just my opinion and the founding of it.
Regards
Helieng
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What I'm about to say is not meant to offend anyone so please don't take offence, I'm sorry some of you lost a good friend.
But take a look at the weather report's from Bournmouth and the neibouring airports poor viss, Low cloud.
An eye witness report said the helicopter flew above him but he could not see it due to low cloud, He also said it was a cold misty night.
Not good weather for a VFR rated pilot to be flying in at night is it, I know I'm not the only here who thinks this.
Maybe the weather was OK till he was nearly at Bournmouth and then rapidly got worse which would have been very difficult for any of us to detect or know about in certain circumstance's.
But this does not change the fact's low viss, low cloud & a non instrument rated pilot at night is not a good combination, Leading to a spatial dis-orientation accident where sadly two people lost there live's.
But take a look at the weather report's from Bournmouth and the neibouring airports poor viss, Low cloud.
An eye witness report said the helicopter flew above him but he could not see it due to low cloud, He also said it was a cold misty night.
Not good weather for a VFR rated pilot to be flying in at night is it, I know I'm not the only here who thinks this.
Maybe the weather was OK till he was nearly at Bournmouth and then rapidly got worse which would have been very difficult for any of us to detect or know about in certain circumstance's.
But this does not change the fact's low viss, low cloud & a non instrument rated pilot at night is not a good combination, Leading to a spatial dis-orientation accident where sadly two people lost there live's.
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TC
According to the report he didn't hold a UK instrument and hadn't logged instrument flight since 6th December 1999.
From that date onward he had also only logged 40 minutes night flight until he was converted into the 109E on the 1st January 2004.
Since that date he flew 15 hours 30 minutes at night all in the 109E.
According to the report he didn't hold a UK instrument and hadn't logged instrument flight since 6th December 1999.
From that date onward he had also only logged 40 minutes night flight until he was converted into the 109E on the 1st January 2004.
Since that date he flew 15 hours 30 minutes at night all in the 109E.