Logging Time
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Helicopter Pilots Get It Up Quicker
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Logging Time
I have been asked to take a trip as a safety pilot on a longish trip in an R22 - only one crew required as per POH.
Problem is the pilot is a JAA PPL(H) and I am an FAA CPL(H), the aircraft is G registered.
Now as far as I am concerned I am along for the ride and odd radio call and nav duties. The owner/ppl pilot is worried who logs the P1 time and who's bum is on the line if anything goes wrong. He thinks that as I have the 'higher' qualification I should be the commander in case of errors but he wants to log the time! FCL at CAA seemed confused and put us on hold and we gave up after quite a few minutes wait!
Any ideas?
Problem is the pilot is a JAA PPL(H) and I am an FAA CPL(H), the aircraft is G registered.
Now as far as I am concerned I am along for the ride and odd radio call and nav duties. The owner/ppl pilot is worried who logs the P1 time and who's bum is on the line if anything goes wrong. He thinks that as I have the 'higher' qualification I should be the commander in case of errors but he wants to log the time! FCL at CAA seemed confused and put us on hold and we gave up after quite a few minutes wait!
Any ideas?
Last edited by Jetdriver; 21st November 2002 at 18:08.
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Helicopter Pilots Get It Up Quicker
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Thanks...
Still comsidering whether its actually worth doing. I don't know the guy very well and only have someone elses assesmenet of his abilities - has about 20 hrs post ppl.
There is a nagging doubt that if soething did go wrong that I couldn't put right I might end up carrying the can.
Still comsidering whether its actually worth doing. I don't know the guy very well and only have someone elses assesmenet of his abilities - has about 20 hrs post ppl.
There is a nagging doubt that if soething did go wrong that I couldn't put right I might end up carrying the can.
Last edited by Jetdriver; 21st November 2002 at 18:10.
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From: UK
I think you are right PW.
You have been asked to act as a "safety pilot" by an inexperienced PPL who presumably is otherwise qualified to carry out the flight and will limit himself to the authority given by his licence. I think it sounds eminently sensible that he wants someone with far greater experience to accompany him on the trip. That is indeed the function of a safety pilot.
Obviously as a safety pilot you would not act in command other in an emergency ( in which case you can happily log P1 I would suggest ). If you intend to act as P1 in any other event then that would require you to be approved to do so by the relevant authority.
In this case he is obviously the "commander" and you are the experienced observer / passenger/ security blanket ? If he wants you to assume the role of commander he needs to be put straight. I don't blame you being concerned about his lack of experience, but it does seem very straightforward on the face of it.
1) He logs the P1 ( he is signing out the aircraft )
2) His "bum is on the line" as he is P1.
3) Your guidance and help is being sought due your own experience. ( seems very sensible)
4) Lesson 1 "command"
You have been asked to act as a "safety pilot" by an inexperienced PPL who presumably is otherwise qualified to carry out the flight and will limit himself to the authority given by his licence. I think it sounds eminently sensible that he wants someone with far greater experience to accompany him on the trip. That is indeed the function of a safety pilot.
Obviously as a safety pilot you would not act in command other in an emergency ( in which case you can happily log P1 I would suggest ). If you intend to act as P1 in any other event then that would require you to be approved to do so by the relevant authority.
In this case he is obviously the "commander" and you are the experienced observer / passenger/ security blanket ? If he wants you to assume the role of commander he needs to be put straight. I don't blame you being concerned about his lack of experience, but it does seem very straightforward on the face of it.
1) He logs the P1 ( he is signing out the aircraft )
2) His "bum is on the line" as he is P1.
3) Your guidance and help is being sought due your own experience. ( seems very sensible)
4) Lesson 1 "command"
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Helicopter Pilots Get It Up Quicker
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Thanks Guys.
In the process of trying to get an honest opinion on his abilities from his CFI,(?QFI here) first.
Think I ll get something written down before I go as a safeguard!
In the process of trying to get an honest opinion on his abilities from his CFI,(?QFI here) first.
Think I ll get something written down before I go as a safeguard!
Last edited by Jetdriver; 23rd November 2002 at 02:26.
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From: South East
Can you legaly act as a safety pilot if your licence isnt valid over here and on a G registered aircraft.
I cant see how you can log the time if the licence isnt valid due to it not being JAA/CAA, as far as I can see you would be operating unlicenced!
I cant see how you can log the time if the licence isnt valid due to it not being JAA/CAA, as far as I can see you would be operating unlicenced!
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Helicopter Pilots Get It Up Quicker
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Why wouldn't my licence be valid in the uk?
It's an ICAO state issued licence and I am current on type and all biannuals and medical are also current. I can self fly hire G aircraftwith it.
It's an ICAO state issued licence and I am current on type and all biannuals and medical are also current. I can self fly hire G aircraftwith it.
Last edited by Jetdriver; 24th November 2002 at 04:35.
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Helicopter Pilots Get It Up Quicker
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I believe the FAA will/would issue you with a PPL based on your UK licence - not sure what the situation is now after 9/11 - sure a search will get you the lastest info.
For a CPL it used to be a case of just take the exams and a checkride for licence issue, again not 100% sure of the situation now - no 14 exams and all the associated hoops to jump through.
Guess the school who will hire to me may be wrong but I don't think so, if you read the following CAA link - CAN'T work but the original question does refer to commerical gain except a free ride.
CAA FAQ
For a CPL it used to be a case of just take the exams and a checkride for licence issue, again not 100% sure of the situation now - no 14 exams and all the associated hoops to jump through.
Guess the school who will hire to me may be wrong but I don't think so, if you read the following CAA link - CAN'T work but the original question does refer to commerical gain except a free ride.
CAA FAQ
Last edited by Jetdriver; 26th November 2002 at 02:30.
