Hand flown approaches into Major international Airports
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Hand flown approaches into Major international Airports
I am aware that my question is generic and that for different operators the SOP may dictate different answers, but how typical is a “hand flown” approach into a major international airport using CAT2/3 capable runways / aircraft?
Would a typical operator say Virgin / BA etc expect it’s pilot’s to fly say one in five approaches by hand ? How much latitude does the PIC have to elect to hand fly an approach? And typically from what distance / altitude?
My limited understanding is that under certain weather conditions the pilot given his experience and ability to interpret the conditions is always going to be better at maintaining the approach than an autopilot, so that's one factor. I guess visibility might be another factor?
Are major carriers more insistent than smaller ones on the type of approach? Does experience allow more latitude on when a hand flown approach might be executed?
Would a typical operator say Virgin / BA etc expect it’s pilot’s to fly say one in five approaches by hand ? How much latitude does the PIC have to elect to hand fly an approach? And typically from what distance / altitude?
My limited understanding is that under certain weather conditions the pilot given his experience and ability to interpret the conditions is always going to be better at maintaining the approach than an autopilot, so that's one factor. I guess visibility might be another factor?
Are major carriers more insistent than smaller ones on the type of approach? Does experience allow more latitude on when a hand flown approach might be executed?
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Thanks Intruder
Two further questions if I may
1/What IMC conditions would you opt to fly by hand (other than equipment failure / un-serviceability) ?
2/Are you under any guidance / rules regarding autopilot use?
Two further questions if I may
1/What IMC conditions would you opt to fly by hand (other than equipment failure / un-serviceability) ?
2/Are you under any guidance / rules regarding autopilot use?
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We have no restrictions, other than the normal ones on low-altitude use when not coupled to the ILS.
I'll hand-fly any "slam-dunk," where ATC holds us high until close to the airport, and IMC arrivals/approaches when I feel like doing it.
I'll hand-fly any "slam-dunk," where ATC holds us high until close to the airport, and IMC arrivals/approaches when I feel like doing it.
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I will hand fly the approach in raw data and auto thrust out if conditions are suitable but more importantly if PNF is up to the increase in his workload and not too knackered.
Last hand flown approach with manual thrust was on Wednesday into LHR and very satisfying it was too. Good viz, light winds and a competent, alert PNF.
Company regs require use of automation in high workload situations and with degraded aircraft systems
Last hand flown approach with manual thrust was on Wednesday into LHR and very satisfying it was too. Good viz, light winds and a competent, alert PNF.
Company regs require use of automation in high workload situations and with degraded aircraft systems
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747-200 driver, Cat.II current...
xxx
I engage the "Otto"-pilot after retracting flaps on takeoff and accelerating to climb speed.
xxx
As far as landing, if VMC, I fly Mexican procedures ("Manuel" approach), as I hardly get more than 1, sometimes 2 landings (if lucky) every month... generally from the time we slow down, extend flaps and gear, for approach and landing. The only time I do an autoland, is to check the equipment if so requested by maintenance. At my age, all I can handle is 15 minutes of hand flying per sector...
xxx
For low visibility, I let "Otto" (German procedure) handle the aircraft with 3 autopilots engaged, and click to "Manuel" when I see the approach/runway lights. I am not the type of guy, who pretends to be "the ace of the base", and forced to miss the approach/landing, to make OPEC richer than what they are now, because of my lack of proficiency.
xxx
This reminds me I have to land twice next month, my last landing was nearly 60 days ago.
Happy contrails
I hate spelling mistakes... so excuse me, I did make a correction.
xxx
I engage the "Otto"-pilot after retracting flaps on takeoff and accelerating to climb speed.
xxx
As far as landing, if VMC, I fly Mexican procedures ("Manuel" approach), as I hardly get more than 1, sometimes 2 landings (if lucky) every month... generally from the time we slow down, extend flaps and gear, for approach and landing. The only time I do an autoland, is to check the equipment if so requested by maintenance. At my age, all I can handle is 15 minutes of hand flying per sector...
xxx
For low visibility, I let "Otto" (German procedure) handle the aircraft with 3 autopilots engaged, and click to "Manuel" when I see the approach/runway lights. I am not the type of guy, who pretends to be "the ace of the base", and forced to miss the approach/landing, to make OPEC richer than what they are now, because of my lack of proficiency.
xxx
This reminds me I have to land twice next month, my last landing was nearly 60 days ago.
Happy contrails
I hate spelling mistakes... so excuse me, I did make a correction.
Last edited by BelArgUSA; 26th Jan 2008 at 20:45.
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Our company encourages hand flying.
Current on the B757-200, I always disconnect the automatics and hand fly the approach ( keeps the scan current ),within the limits of the weather. I try to do 1 autoland per month just to refresh the LVO SOP's, but I let the aircraft do it's stuff in CatIII LVO's
!!.
Current on the B757-200, I always disconnect the automatics and hand fly the approach ( keeps the scan current ),within the limits of the weather. I try to do 1 autoland per month just to refresh the LVO SOP's, but I let the aircraft do it's stuff in CatIII LVO's
!!.
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Thanks to everyone that's replied, I'd suspected that pilot's love to fly the aircraft at every opportunity and the appropriate conditions prevail.
Like the German / Mexican references BelArgUSA !
Like the German / Mexican references
BelArgUSA !
Last edited by colossus; 29th Jan 2008 at 17:56.
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My limited understanding is that under certain weather conditions the pilot given his experience and ability to interpret the conditions is always going to be better at maintaining the approach than an autopilot
I wish!!
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My limited understanding is that under certain weather conditions the pilot given his experience and ability to interpret the conditions is always going to be better at maintaining the approach than an autopilot
These two were the first truly successful narrow and wide-body types respectively to operate to CATIII conditions, without restriction.
Ah, Lockheed, superb....just ask the pilot that flies one
The above comments hold true for low visibility approaches. But flying around Europe last week when it was very windy it was definitely better disconnecting everything early on approach. There are several obvious reasons. As a starter, our autothrottle (737) copes poorly with very gusty conditions. It is also a good idea to get used to the conditions early when landing with a strong crosswind. The Virgin A340 incident at LHR written up recently in the crash comic would be a good example of how not to do it.
Last edited by lederhosen; 3rd Feb 2008 at 14:47.
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Last year my company chartered one of those wonderful airplanes because one of his A330s catched a cold (or something like that). Sadly the passengers refused to board the L1011 because they deemed it to old and therefore unsafe... (no refunds were given).
Well, thats thoroughly off topic by now but more on topic, hand flown approaches are much more fun than keeping the automatics in so i do it as often as i can. Allways have to observe the present workload and the status of your other crewmembers of course.
Well, thats thoroughly off topic by now but more on topic, hand flown approaches are much more fun than keeping the automatics in so i do it as often as i can. Allways have to observe the present workload and the status of your other crewmembers of course.
"Sadly the passengers refused to board the L1011 because they deemed it to old and therefore unsafe... (no refunds were given)."
Stupid 'ground people'--muppets--- maybe 'ground muppets'---whatever
Stupid 'ground people'--muppets--- maybe 'ground muppets'---whatever
